ATF rejected my 5320.20 to MD for AR-15 SBR, My response

[ericoak]

I have updated my first paragraph to reflect the new language in the MSP bulletin.

I recently received two 5320.20s disapprovals for my AR-15 SBRs that I would like to take to MD. MD law is quite confusing, but I believe the wrong criteria was applied resulting in an incorrect disapproval. Before going over the criteria, I would also point to Maryland State Police bulletin LD-FRU-15-004 (included with this letter) which says that short barreled rifles and shotguns are illegal if they meet the definition of a copycat weapon. As I will prove below, my AR-15 SRBs do not meet this definition. They also say that any SBR offered for sale by a dealer is no longer required to be on the handgun roster, which would imply that SBRs are legal for sale by dealers in MD. I am not a dealer so the roster requirement doesn’t apply. The ATF has also approved many AR-15s and AKs in the same configuration as mine in MD this year alone, and can be purchased from MD dealers. The MSP bulletin also gives a phone number for contact MD Firearms Registration Unit.

 

[ericoak]

I spoke with Terry W, the examiner that denied my form. I told him basically the same gun is for sale right now at my local gun store, and he told me that the ATF interpretation says SBRs are legal for sale to resident but not legal for non residents to bring into the state. Now, I don't see anything in the law that says that a gun legal for a MD resident to buy is banned from being brought it in, but I could tell this wouldn't work.

Instead I asked if my father is a legal MD resident and on the trust, why he can't bring the gun into MD that he already owns but he can buy a new one.

He told me to resubmit with a letter and documentation showing he is on the trust and the legal department would look at it.

 

[Bob A]

Given the expense of dealing with NFA weapons in the first place, why not get a lawyer who is familiaar with the MD regs to go to the mat with BATF? Most gov institutions pay closer attention to legal counsel than they do to the masses of the great unwashed.

 

[rouchna]

I spoke with Terry W, the examiner that denied my form. I told him basically the same gun is for sale right now at my local gun store, and he told me that the ATF interpretation says SBRs are legal for sale to resident but not legal for non residents to bring into the state. Now, I don't see anything in the law that says that a gun legal for a MD resident to buy is banned from being brought it in, but I could tell this wouldn't work.

Instead I asked if my father is a legal MD resident and on the trust, why he can't bring the gun into MD that he already owns but he can buy a new one.

He told me to resubmit with a letter and documentation showing he is on the trust and the legal department would look at it.

That is insane. Now you know why I gave up. Props to you for still trying.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ericoak]

Given the expense of dealing with NFA weapons in the first place, why not get a lawyer who is familiaar with the MD regs to go to the mat with BATF? Most gov institutions pay closer attention to legal counsel than they do to the masses of the great unwashed.

Because a lawyer is more expensive than the gun.

Most of the NFA lawyers I talked about knew less about NFA then people on this forum.

 

[Hawkeye]

Most of the NFA lawyers I talked about knew less about NFA then people on this forum.

That's because most "NFA lawyers" don't actually own NFA items and don't run the risk of going to prison if they get it wrong. We do.

 

[JsbsMarine]

Glad I saw this thread, wll be submitting 5320s for sbr and MGs into MD from VA. Will see what the results are in a few weeks.

 

[pwoolford]

Since your father is on the trust as an owner I'd probably just register a lower to leave at his house. Then you can just transport uppers back and forth.

 

[swinokur]

The thing I don't get is that Federally registered SBR's are legal in MD accoding to SS 5-203

There is no mention of a 29" OAL requirement in that statute

So if it's legal, what grounds is BATFE using to reject 5320.20's. ?

It might be illegal to make one now, but according to the statute if it's Federally registered it's legal in MD.

seeno. 2
.

 

[Hawkeye]

The thing I don't get is that Federally registered SBR's are legal in MD accoding to SS 5-203

There is no mention of a 29" OAL requirement in that statute

So if it's legal, what grounds is BATFE using to reject 5320.20's. ?

ATF is going by MSP's guidance. Under the FSA 2013, it's illegal to make a new banned assault weapon in Maryland. If a centerfire, semiautomatic rifle that accepts detachable magazines is less than 29" in OAL, it is banned as a "copycat assault weapon."

Since ATF says that when you build an SBR you are "making" a new firearm, it is illegal to make an SBR that is a centerfire, semi-automatic rifle capable of accepting detachable magazines that has an OAL of less than 29", because you are making a banned firearm post 10/1/13.

You can (and people here have) still make an SBR in Maryland that's rimfire, or not semi-auto, or the like, with an OAL of less than 29".

 

[swinokur]

well, what if the SBR was registered by BATFE prior to 10-1-13?

that doesn't make it illegal to either the MSP or BATFE.

 

[Hawkeye]

well, what if the SBR was registered by BATFE prior to 10-1-13?

Then it should be totally fine.

What EricOak should do is probably to get the section of FSA2013 that deals with the fact that rifles possessed prior to that date being legal to bring to Maryland and send that to ATF.

 

[rouchna]

well, what if the SBR was registered by BATFE prior to 10-1-13?

that doesn't make it illegal to either the MSP or BATFE.

They will still deny it. They don't care

 

[swinokur]

well that was my point and I was thinking exactly of you.

 

[rouchna]

well that was my point and I was thinking exactly of you.

 

[ericoak]

I just got great news!

Sent a letter to the ATF legal department stating my case in December and just got a call from the ATF. They now have a MD Liason responsible for determining what is MD legal and he agreed that my configuration was legal and that any configuration you can buy in state can be transported into MD.

He told me to resubmit and it will be approved.

 

[swinokur]

wow. awesome news. I PM'ed Rouchna

 

[rouchna]

I just got great news!

Sent a letter to the ATF legal department stating my case in December and just got a call from the ATF. They now have a MD Liason responsible for determining what is MD legal and he agreed that my configuration was legal and that any configuration you can buy in state can be transported into MD.

He told me to resubmit and it will be approved.

Thanks for posting. I will do the same. Good luck to us both

wow. awesome news. I PM'ed Rouchna

Thank you Sir.

 

[outrider58]

That's re-****** rediculous! They had to assign a Md "liaison" to interpret Md gun law? Wtf? I know...

 

[swinokur]

BATFE was rejecting 5320.20's for SBR's OAL <29" that were legallly possessed before 10-1-13.

In spite of the MD statute saying federally registered SBR's are legal in MD.

We're dealing with idiots here.