AR15 bullets for reloading

[Melnic]

OK,
I ran 20 bullets through my dad's AR15 today.
It's a bushmaster XM15-E2S with I believe a 1/9 twist.
I had purchased some 9mm rounds and saw some hornady 55g HPBT bullets for $12/100 so I just added to the cart.
I loaded up 24,24.1,24.2,24.3grns of Varget with it in groups of 5.
The reloads did no better than the cheap Independance 5.56 55grn ammo that I already had. The Swiss Geco 223 groups were about half the size at about 1/2" @ 50yds w/ a cold barrel
My buddy was there and suggested I switch to some 69g matchkings, Another guy suggested a different powder also and that the Hornady bullets were not very accurate compared to others. I cant recall the brand he suggested.

What other suggestions are there you guys have for me?
I have several more lbs of Varget or H4895 so I'd like to stick with Varget for now if I can vs. switching Powder and hunting around.

 

[Weber]

Sometimes its the shooter, not the ammo...

 

[BUFF7MM]

You might want to try seating the bullet to a different depth if you don't want to switch powders

 

[byf43]

Hornady 55 gr V-Max boolits and H-335 - or - W-748 powder produce great results in two of my ARs. I haven't tried these in the 1:9 twist barrel, though.
(Just in 1:7 twist.)

Sierra 69 gr MatchKing and H-335 produce EXCELLENT results in both 1:7 twist ARs.

 

[Melnic]

Sometimes its the shooter, not the ammo...

Not in this case, 2 different shooters, had friend shoot my last 5 reloads and also the Swiss Geco, Geco did better than my reloads in both cases and the same as the Independence. I will say the AR trigger pull is heavy but not a reason for the reload groups to be big.

 

[Speed3]

I'm going through load development at the moment as well... sorry i can't be of any help.

 

[Franklin]

you are 3 grains short on suggested load"conservative anyway for CYA" and even at 10% down load, you are a grain and some change short. you have alot more experimenting to do with powders loads before you try a different powder. check for over pressure and keep adding powder.

 

[shrpshtrjoe]

I love varget I have had great luck with it in .223 and .308 it's pretty much all I use for both.. I have never shot the 69gr bullets in a 1:9 but I would think they would stabilize ok.. Seating depth for a AR is limited to fit the mag unless your going to feed it as a single shot.. If you have the H4895 on hand that would be the cheapest way to proceed, load a few up with that and go from there..

 

[paxfish]

I'm going through load development also. Using Sierra Blitz Kings right now. My research steered me in that direction and I have nothing to complain about:

http://mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=133165

 

[Melnic]

you are 3 grains short on suggested load"conservative anyway for CYA" and even at 10% down load, you are a grain and some change short. you have alot more experimenting to do with powders loads before you try a different powder. check for over pressure and keep adding powder.

What are you referencing?

Hodgdon website shows 23.0-25.0C
I think I recall my Lee book showed 24-25.5C

I'm not a very experienced reloader, but on all my other rifle reloads so far, when I had the right bullet, my starting loads always were as good as factory loads or better if I measured to within .1grain of each load.

 

[covertpanda]

I don't know about running 69gr anything in a 1/9. It may or maynot work depnding on how lucky you are. I have also had good results with varget in .223; I've been running a mix of 55gr sierra matchkings bthp and dogtown fbhp (made by nosler for midway).

Also what length were the test rounds?

 

[Melnic]

I don't know about running 69gr anything in a 1/9. It may or maynot work depnding on how lucky you are. I have also had good results with varget in .223; I've been running a mix of 55gr sierra matchkings bthp and dogtown fbhp (made by nosler for midway).

Also what length were the test rounds?

2.215 OAL
I put the crimp about half way into the cannelure on the bullet with some of the cannelure showing
Using the Lee Dies with FCD

 

[Sticky]

From Sierra data for their lineup of 55gr bullets and varget..

Varget 25.1 25.8 26.5 27.2

I suggest you are still wayyy low in the load range, you need to load some hotter and see what you get.. I'd load half grain increments from 25 to 27 (a few of each) and test them from low to high looking for pressure signs and accuracy...Then go back and fine tune the next loads and test based on your results.

Varget is a very accurate powder when loaded properly...

The whole table.. attached

 

[Sticky]

Hornady Zmax or Vmax 55gr bullets give me less than a half minute of accuracy out of my bull bbl 223 loading with H335, they should do just fine if you find the right charge wt..

 

[Marauder]

I've had good luck with Sierra 52gr BTHP. http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=130014

 

[covertpanda]

2.215 OAL
I put the crimp about half way into the cannelure on the bullet with some of the cannelure showing
Using the Lee Dies with FCD

Okay, (and assuming its a 16" barrel) you should be close to 2900fps somewhere in the 26.3-26.6 neighborhood. Definitely check for pressure signs on the cases as you go up in charge. Lastly, if you are only making 5 round samples it might not hurt to weigh the brass and use similar weighted brass for each sample (prob won't make a huge difference at 50yds; but it will only take a minute or two).

 

[Deep Creek Rock]

Dont do such small powder charge increases, between the lot for a rifle. .1grain incriment, is more suited for pistol rounds, with limited charge from min to max.

If it were me, start with the min listed charge in your data, and make sure the round develops enough gas/energy to operate/cycle your AR. Then do your lot in .5 (half a grain) until you are at or near max. .50 grains (half a grain) is usally the standard charge weight difference most do for rifles. Find which of that lot produces the tightest groups. If none do - then switch powders, and do the same thing again.


.1 in a rifle caliber betwen each charge lot, probably wont make a tremendous difference between each other.

You may want to also experiment with crimping. Crimping can sometimes degrade accuracy, but sometimes it is needed to keep things safe. I tend to avoid crimping bottleneck rifle rounds, unless absolutely needed. I would test your rounds to see if a crimp is even needed before going that route. You can table test on a loaded round. See if you can push the bullet back into the case, by pushing the nose of the bullet on a hard table. If you can easily do so, then a crimp may be warranted.

Another test is to do a dummy round (no powder no primer, bullet seated to recommended/needed COL). Measure the dummy round COL, then place the dummy in the mag (dont single feed it). Close the bolt then eject the round, and remeasure the COL. If the round got set back - or forward, then a crimp may be warranted. Do it a few times, and remeasure to make sure, and err on the side of caution.

 

[Franklin]

What are you referencing?

Hodgdon website shows 23.0-25.0C
I think I recall my Lee book showed 24-25.5C

I'm not a very experienced reloader, but on all my other rifle reloads so far, when I had the right bullet, my starting loads always were as good as factory loads or better if I measured to within .1grain of each load.

I referenced that from hodge nas website. 23 grains is would be for more in the high 60 to 77 grain range. I referenced 27.7 repeat 27.7 as their suggested load - 2.77=24.93. That's 10 percent under their suggested CYA loading.

I will look in my hornady book here in a sec once I get a cup of tea and dinner.

 

[Franklin]

My hornady book says 26.4 max repeat 26.4

You can see the variance there from what MR.sticky posted hence the 10 percent and work up.

 

[Melnic]

ok, I see the problem, small font and no reading glasses. I looked up the 222 Rem and not 223 rem.

It does show 25.5 to 27.5C
55 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon Varget .224" 2.200" 25.5 3174 41,300 CUP 27.5C 3384 49,700 CUP

My Lee book also showed 25.5-27.5C and I'd used the lower number (that I thought was correct but was not).

OK, now that we have that covered, I'd like to hone in on an approximate good load for the existing bullet and powder in the short term.
Should I be concerned about the compressed load indication at 27.5?
I'm using Lee dies. would I be ok to try 25.5,26,26.5 and 27?
or should I start at 25.5 and move up say .4grn increments?