2020 HB-4/SB-208, Rifles & Shotguns, Secondary Transactions

[BUFF7MM]

I look forward to being non compliant.

 

[teratos]

What law thingy? Get it now?

Damn. I’m as dumb as my kids think I am.

 

[135sohc]

how will they know if a future private sale happened 2 years ago or today?

example.
How will they know that a sale that happens in june of 2021 did not take place in june of 2018 when it was legal?

It would take some digging and connecting the dots but a serial number on a commercially made firearm would provide an idea of when it was made if LE decided to pursue someone.

known older stuff vs buying a mossberg at walmart a year from now (if they still sell guns a year from now...) and flipping it for a quick profit. probably not the smartest idea.

 

[BeoBill]

.

 

[Stoveman]

What will be the excuse when criminal violence with firearms does not abate?

Can we laugh in the "good" delegate's face (if she ever found her panties) and in the face of Danielle?

Don't go looking for those skivvies in MigraineMan's house.

 

[Stoveman]

.

Well dayum, it's almost like those Patriot Picket guys were prescient.

 

[mpollan1]

Back to the Future

 

[MigraineMan]

Don't go looking for those skivvies in MigraineMan's house.

To the best of my knowledge, she still hasn't stopped by to retrieve them.

Haven't checked to see if she has un-blocked me yet.

 

[Ponder_MD]

Weeping mothers are turning out to be the greatest threat to liberties that I have ever seen. It was all very reasonable when M.A.D.D. first came out.

It's long been deemed untasteful and unsympathetic to attack a crying mother who lost a loved one. When we oppose, we don't ever oppose the mothers, we oppose the legislators. We need to expose these organizations for that they really are now- Emotional blackmail factories for the Progressive Party. I think we should be less afraid to directly attack and counter crying parents who sponsor "apostrophe laws."

 

[rockstarr]

Veto overriden in the House as well. 30 day clock starting tomorrow if things proceed ...

https://www.baltimoresun.com/politi...0210211-qafvs4kwmfh3jibcuvl7k4axfe-story.html

So you mean to tell me that in both houses, they got EXACTLY the number of votes needed to over turn? Yeah that’s not giving political cover to anyone I’m sure. I can’t stand these tyrants.

 

[lazarus]

how will they know if a future private sale happened 2 years ago or today?

example.
How will they know that a sale that happens in june of 2021 did not take place in june of 2018 when it was legal?

Possibly by asking. Are they going to attempt to trace any and all guns? No.

But it would be a shame if you bought a shotgun from someone months or years after the law went in to affect and MSP traces it and the last owner was the guy who sold it to you and it turns out he bought it after the law went in to affect.

Or a guy you sold it to does something bad, even if it isn’t with the gun you sold to them and MSP/ATF traces it back to you. The guy you sold it to might turn you in for a reduced sentence.

Or you go to sell it to a friend of a friend and it turns out that friend of a friend is actually a sting your friend didn’t know about.

Or you are just selling or buying something through the classifieds or else where and you work it out to just skip the FFL and get caught. Not sure how often a couple of guys selling a rifle in a parking lot have a cop come by and ask questions. Or again, turns out to be a sting or an informant.

Unless you particularly want to get caught, I’d wager probably everyone here who knows about the bill will be abiding by it selling through the classifieds, gun forums, etc. even if maybe they chance skipping the legal process selling or giving a gun to a close friend.

Otherwise it is what is known as playing stupid games, winning stupid prizes.

 

[Straightbolt]

Possibly by asking. Are they going to attempt to trace any and all guns? No.

But it would be a shame if you bought a shotgun from someone months or years after the law went in to affect and MSP traces it and the last owner was the guy who sold it to you and it turns out he bought it after the law went in to affect.

Or a guy you sold it to does something bad, even if it isn’t with the gun you sold to them and MSP/ATF traces it back to you. The guy you sold it to might turn you in for a reduced sentence.

Or you go to sell it to a friend of a friend and it turns out that friend of a friend is actually a sting your friend didn’t know about.

Or you are just selling or buying something through the classifieds or else where and you work it out to just skip the FFL and get caught. Not sure how often a couple of guys selling a rifle in a parking lot have a cop come by and ask questions. Or again, turns out to be a sting or an informant.

Unless you particularly want to get caught, I’d wager probably everyone here who knows about the bill will be abiding by it selling through the classifieds, gun forums, etc. even if maybe they chance skipping the legal process selling or giving a gun to a close friend.

Otherwise it is what is known as playing stupid games, winning stupid prizes.

OR ....You move the hell out of the state ASAP
My plan....F this state ....just have to survive here a few more years

 

[Engine4]

Otherwise it is what is known as playing stupid games, winning stupid prizes.

I must respectfully disagree, disobedience of anti constitutional laws isn't playing stupid games.

 

[cessnapilot]

While in principle I would love to just disregard this law, if I’m selling to someone I don’t know (via the classifieds, etc) I’m not going to risk a criminal record to do so and if I’m buying and the seller is offering to do a private sale I’d probably pass because I don’t know if it’s a setup. Now if I were selling to someone I know... you get the idea.

 

[cessnapilot]

I know I’m being kind of lazy because I could just look it up myself but does anyone know the possible penalty for a violation of this law?

 

[cessnapilot]

Interesting exemption

“Between those with demonstrable religious beliefs against have portrait photograph taken of them and who does not possess a license or an identification card of any kind with photographic identification”

I wonder how “demonstrable” is defined? Maybe if some states their religious objections and refuse to produce ID you could still do a private sale?

 

[135sohc]

Interesting exemption

“Between those with demonstrable religious beliefs against have portrait photograph taken of them and who does not possess a license or an identification card of any kind with photographic identification”

I wonder how “demonstrable” is defined? Maybe if some states their religious objections and refuse to produce ID you could still do a private sale?

That was included for the Amish.

 

[lazarus]

That was included for the Amish.

This. Demonstrable also means you have the ability to prove that your beliefs predate your arrest for the crime among other things.

If you have a driver’s license or state ID it is going to be a pretty tough sell to claim you converted to being Amish in the recent past and, oh, didn’t get rid of your car. And electronics. And phone. And...

 

[lazarus]

I must respectfully disagree, disobedience of anti constitutional laws isn't playing stupid games.

You do you. Plenty of people commit civil disobedience all the time. Just keep in mind they also often get caught and almost always are convicted and suffer the prescribed penalties of said civil disobedience.

Which will probably mean losing all your guns and a few months to a couple of years in prison. Probably your job. Hope your wife is understanding and kids if you are married. Etc.

We have everything to lose. The government, just doing their job.

I hope this is fought and is over turned. But so far I am not aware of anyone having much success getting similar state laws overturned.

 

[135sohc]

The Amish are like the perfect gift to annapolis.. They pay taxes and contribute to the system but expect and literally take almost nothing out of it... FWIW I am glad they got something out of this and it was probably included without any fight from the left as a means to prevent any legal challenges based upon discrimination.