For those of you who don't reload....

trickg · Sep 29, 2008

I did some basic figures tonight for the reloading I have done since I put together a reloading setup and started reloading in early July, and I was stunned by the difference in what it would have cost me to buy ammo, and what it cost me to reload in terms of expendable components.

I did basic numbers at an even $20 per box for .45 ACP and $28 per box for .44 Magnum. (Yes, I realize that the numbers are somewhat lower than that if bought in bulk, but work with me.)

For .45 ACP I have reloaded 15.48 boxes of ammo. (Not all of my reloading is done in even batches of multiples of 50)

For .44 Magnum I have reloaded 7.52 boxes.

Had I purchased the ammo, it would have cost me $520.16. I reload for about $6 per box, so I only have $138 worth of components for a savings of $382.16 since early July, so at this point, my reloading gear has paid for itself and I'm only 3 months into it.

That's something to think about for those of you who are content to put out the $$$ for factory ammo. Even with bulk ammo pricing, if you shoot much at all, a basic reloading setup will quickly pay for itself.

Topher · Sep 29, 2008

I couldn't agree more. Reloading saves me money and produces better results. I thought it would take way to much time... It really does not take that much time... For a small investment you can save yourself a lot!

Calibers I reload:
.38/.357
.45 acp
.308 win
30-40 Krag
.223

herr.baer · Sep 29, 2008

Same here. I can made it for a fraction of the cost and I get to make sure of the quality control too. :party29:

simplegreen · Sep 29, 2008

i wonder where this spur to see if you've broken even has come from :innocent0

bean93x · Sep 29, 2008

wait, its still costing you $15 per box of .45acp?

OR does it cost you $6 a box?

Topher · Sep 29, 2008

bean93x said:
wait, its still costing you $15 per box of .45acp?

OR does it cost you $6 a box?

No... .45 acp can be made for about $6 depending on bullets and powder.

bean93x · Sep 29, 2008

Topher said:
No... .45 acp can be made for about $6 depending on bullets and powder.

iv'e heard of it costing $6 per 50 using cast lead bullets.

are you using jacketed rounds or cast lead?

and......... are your loads cleaner than say.... WWB?

Topher · Sep 29, 2008

FYI....
You can get once fired brass from Cresap for $5.00 for 50 pistol rounds and 20 rifle rounds. Already cleaned.
Just ask at the window or PM me and I can get you the phone number of the guy who sorts, cleans, and sells it.

All you .40 reloaders. We (Cresaps)have a ton of Federal brass from the Pentagon using our range every Monday-Wednesday to qualify their police force.

Topher · Sep 29, 2008

bean93x said:
iv'e heard of it costing $6 per 50 using cast lead bullets.

are you using jacketed rounds or cast lead?

and......... are your loads cleaner than say.... WWB?

For me, the bullets come out to be $6.75 for Ranier Lead Safe bullets.
You can go cheaper...
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=196409

trickg · Sep 29, 2008

simplegreen said:
i wonder where this spur to see if you've broken even has come from

Honestly, it was mainly just curiosity - I reloaded up the last of my .357 bullets last night and I record everything I reload in a ledger: (there may have been a small complaint from my better half about the amount of money I have spent in the last 6 months on this stuff

)

Date
Caliber
Number of rounds loaded
Weight/type of bullet
Type of power
Charge of powder in gr
Misc notes (I usually notate the primer brand and type)

Anyway, I was looking at my ledger and was surprised at how many rounds I had reloaded in a fairly short time - I usually reload something about once a week.

bean93x said:
iv'e heard of it costing $6 per 50 using cast lead bullets.

are you using jacketed rounds or cast lead?

and......... are your loads cleaner than say.... WWB?

I'm using cast lead bullets, so yes, that's why it's only roughly $6 per box - far less expensive and I can deal with a little leading here or there. As for whether or not my rounds are cleaner, it's hard to say - I think that the powder is probably burning clean enough (with maybe the exception of some Herco I tried for .44 Mag - that burned a little dirty) but I get a lot of smoke and I think that's from the lube from this particular bullet maker. I'm not going to be able to get those locally anymore so I'm going to try a different supplier who I think uses a different lube. I'm using Bullseye for my .45 ACP and that's dirtier than the W231 that I've used with the .38 special, but not by much.

Anyway, a little dirt don't hurt and I have yet to shoot anything that powder fouls to the point where it impedes the function of my guns.

At some point I'll start casting bullets too - 100 lbs of wheel weights makes A LOT of bullets, and it will reduce my costs even further.

txiyo · Sep 29, 2008

I'll have to teach my self how to do this. Did you learn on the forum?

JasonMD85 · Sep 29, 2008

I have always been interested in reloading. The ONLY reason I haven't gotten into it, is because I am afraid of making a bad load or a bad round, and hurting my firearms or even myself. I see a lot on different boards about people that did something wrong and didn't realize it, and caused a lot of damage.

The .40 is tempting though. There are a LOT of different agency's that use that round, and casings can be found dirt cheap (including the local PD). Maybe I should look into it.

If you take your time, and follow directions, is it really that easy to make a bad load?

trickg · Sep 29, 2008

marknakasone said:
I'll have to teach my self how to do this. Did you learn on the forum?

Well, not really. I grew up with a Dad who made firearms and shooting his main pastime in his life, and I can't remember a time when he wasn't doing something with guns, reloading or casting bullets in his workshop. However, having said that, while I did do some reloading and casting bullets while growing up, it was always under his direct supervision and I never did any of it on my own - he set EVERYTHING up for me.

He passed away in 1997, but my Mom didn't see fit to pass those guns on to me until this last February, and I've had to start everything from scratch. I did bring home a lot of his reloads, but I got none of his equipment - that was all sold off at a sale in February, so all of my reloading stuff has been purchased within the last 6 months - I got my press kit as a present for Father's day.

JasonMD85 said:
I have always been interested in reloading. The ONLY reason I haven't gotten into it, is because I am afraid of making a bad load or a bad round, and hurting my firearms or even myself. I see a lot on different boards about people that did something wrong and didn't realize it, and caused a lot of damage.

The .40 is tempting though. There are a LOT of different agency's that use that round, and casings can be found dirt cheap (including the local PD). Maybe I should look into it.

If you take your time, and follow directions, is it really that easy to make a bad load?

I personally think that as long as you are paying attention that it's pretty hard to put together a load that will be dangerous. Just get a good reloading manual and follow those directions and it's actually a lot easier than most people think....well, for handgun loads anyway. I haven't loaded for rifle yet and the pressures and velocities are considerably higher so more care must be made for that.

I check, re-check and check again when doing powder charges, and some powders meter better than others, but I load everything pretty middle of the road so if my powder charge is a bit light or heavy from what I think I'm loading, it really won't matter if it's off by one or two a tenths of a grain because most loads can be loaded within a pretty fair range - for instance the .45 ACP, 200 gr Lead SWC with Alliant Bullseye powder can be loaded anywhere between 3.0 gr and 5.0 gr and it's safe, although the lighter loads might need a lighter spring in the .45 for it to fully function the slide.

alucard0822 · Sep 29, 2008

I reload for 16 different calibers, sometimes because of a lack of modern ammo, mostly for cost savings, and also for accuracy, or to come up with specialty loads.

Some calibers seem to cost more for no good reason, take 9mm vs 38 super vs 380acp, of the 3 9mm costs 1/2 as much as the other 2, but it costs just about the same to reload the three, about $6 a box.

Some of my favorite calibers are are either somewhat obsolete, uncomfortable to shoot, or neutered in their factory form. Full power 38 super loads can rival 357 magnum for performance, 130gr bullets going 1400fps, but most factory loads are downloaded to be relatively safe if they are used in a 38 auto, and rarely are much more powerful than 9mm, so the only way to get them loaded to their true performance is to handload. In the case of something like 44 magnum, you can load mild target loads below 44 special velocities that are comfortable to shoot all day, but in longer magnum cases so you don't have the ring of fouling at the front of the chambers like shooting a shorter alternate caliber can cause. I have also been experimenting with severely underloaded shells, mostly cast lead bullets in front of pistol powder going 1400FPS in a 30-30, more or less a cheap load ballistically similar to 357 magnum, but feels like a 22 out of my marlin 336.
I have also been researching and testing different loads for years to squeeze out every bit of accuracy I can out of target rifle calibers, and constantly learn little peices of information or tricks of the trade.

IMO reloading is in and of itself a hobby, and another useful skill to have in the quest to learn all there is to learn about firearms, and for those that like to tinker, it can be more fun than shooting itself. That is all before the fact that you can shoot a whole lot more for the same money as occasionally shooting with factory ammo and come up with loads that do not exist on the commercial market.

trickg · Sep 29, 2008

Good post Alucard - my main thing though is so that I can shoot the guns I want to shoot as much as I want to without having to worry about the cost so much. I'd go broke trying to shoot my .44 Magnum as much as I want to shoot it.

My main reason for doing this thread was to maybe steer some other folks in the direction of reloading because until this evening after doing some really basic and rounded math, I didn't realize how large the margin was between the cost of factory loads and the cost of my reloads, and for my purposes, there is just no reason to buy factory ammo.

alucard0822 · Sep 30, 2008

trickg said:
Good post Alucard - my main thing though is so that I can shoot the guns I want to shoot as much as I want to without having to worry about the cost so much. I'd go broke trying to shoot my .44 Magnum as much as I want to shoot it.

My main reason for doing this thread was to maybe steer some other folks in the direction of reloading because until this evening after doing some really basic and rounded math, I didn't realize how large the margin was between the cost of factory loads and the cost of my reloads, and for my purposes, there is just no reason to buy factory ammo.

Thanks, I was trying to show that there is a whole lot more to be had from reloading than just saving money. In some cases like 7.62X25, 7.62X39, and 7.62X54R I shoot a lot of surplus ammo, it is cheaper than I can handload for, but handloading brings a lot more versatility, from cast bullet "carnival loads" that are easy for even new shooters to fire to specialty hunting and target ammo. For instance, I can load 357 magnum from 300fps rubber bullets for quick draw practice, up to 125gr at 2200fps out of a lever action carbine, basically putting it squarely in 7.62X39 territory, and just shy of 30-30 ballistics.

Mark, if you find yourself aroud York, PA anythime, give me a shout, I would be glad to help show you my setup, and give you some pointers, I taught Smokey how to reload 9mm, and he has gone through a few thousand rounds over the last couple months, he could probably help you too. The best place to start though is a decent manual, I would reccomend Speer or Lee, they break down most of the operations fairly well which is important, reloading is fairly easy to do, but there is 0 room for mistakes.

txiyo · Sep 30, 2008

alucard0822 said:
Mark, if you find yourself aroud York, PA anythime, give me a shout, I would be glad to help show you my setup, and give you some pointers, I taught Smokey how to reload 9mm, and he has gone through a few thousand rounds over the last couple months, he could probably help you too. The best place to start though is a decent manual, I would reccomend Speer or Lee, they break down most of the operations fairly well which is important, reloading is fairly easy to do, but there is 0 room for mistakes.

Smokey can reload 9? I thought he never started, I kept asking him, haha but ok.

I've watched some videos and downloaded some pdfs on my servers outside the US.

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4405930/Competition_Reloading_with_Brian_Enos

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4314637/Reloading_manuals_for_rifles_Hodgdon_IMR_Alliant_Accurat

Topher · Sep 30, 2008

For getting started with reloaing...
I don't reccomend this as your sole source of learning but if you are interested in seeing what it take to reload go to YouTube.com. There are plenty of demonstrations.
I learned alot from asking people at the range.

trickg · Sep 30, 2008

alucard0822 said:
Thanks, I was trying to show that there is a whole lot more to be had from reloading than just saving money. In some cases like 7.62X25, 7.62X39, and 7.62X54R I shoot a lot of surplus ammo, it is cheaper than I can handload for, but handloading brings a lot more versatility, from cast bullet "carnival loads" that are easy for even new shooters to fire to specialty hunting and target ammo. For instance, I can load 357 magnum from 300fps rubber bullets for quick draw practice, up to 125gr at 2200fps out of a lever action carbine, basically putting it squarely in 7.62X39 territory, and just shy of 30-30 ballistics.

Absolutely! I had started into doing it because of the idea that I would save some money doing it, but as soon as I got into doing it, I realized that the reason my Dad did it for all of those years was as much to have control over the final outcome of the round as anything else. There are so many options when you roll your own. Take the .45 ACP as one example. I can use a multitude of different powers (HP38/W231, Unique, Bullseye, Clays, etc) and I get to choose the bullet weight and type. Then, I get to find the load that I like for whatever application I choose by deciding on how much of a powder charge to give it - all within published manual specs of course.

I think that one of the most interesting things that comes up in a conversation is the subject of recoil for various calibers of guns. Some people think that recoil is a static thing depending on the gun and the caliber chosen, which really couldn't be further from the truth. Even a .44 Magnum can have mild recoil if you reload and choose to load it light. I shoot .38 special wadcutter target loads out of my .357s and the recoil for that is exceptionally light - almost like firing a .22 pistol.

I find that reloading is pretty relaxing. I'm never in a rush to simply get more rounds loaded. I get caught up in the process and it allows my mind to really unwind as I'm caught up in the repetition. Before I know it, an hour has passed, I have a bunch of fresh ammo to shoot and I've set aside the stresses of life for a while.

So I completely agree - not only is there the opportunity to save a lot of money (or shoot more - whichever you choose) but it is a great hobby as well.

trickg · Sep 30, 2008

I thought I would jump on here and post what I thought was a very good page on basic reloading safety tips.

http://www.darkcanyon.net/john_wooters_reloading_safety_tips.htm

I do all of those things - mostly due from watching the great example set by my Dad, who was also very careful about what he did in his reloading, and how and where he stored his components. My reloading ledger that I keep I started because I knew he did it, and I figured it was a good idea, but it's right there in that tips page. At some point I hope to obtain all of his reloading ledgers that he kept from the 1950s when he started reloading. I'll have all the load recipes I need!

For those of you who don't reload....

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