"Disapproved" for Hand Gun Purchase... Questions...

novus collectus · Feb 26, 2010

GBMaryland said:
In my case that was pretty much what the Sgt. said... the equivalent crime in Maryland is up to 3 years in prison.

Yeah, but I think the MDSP is possibly getting it wrong. The equivalent crime only applies to the felony drug offenses in title 5 of the PS article and might apply to crimes of violence. All other crimes which MD may have stricter penalties for does not seem to make one a prohibitted person.

But I am not a lawyer.

The really distubring thng is that he pulled up the worng charge; the MD system got that I was somehow convicted of the original charges... which doesn't make ANY sense.

What it is, is that they will not approve and will disapprove if they do not have a disposition on record for any disqualifying crime. Sometimes that is just not in the available records and they have to send a request to the local court system for a hard copy or the person has to get the records themselves. Since they only have seven days to disapprove, they play it safe and disapprove making the individual appeal.
Not defending the system which really sucks, I am just stating how I believe it goes.

erwos · Feb 26, 2010

So, what's the scoop? Did they reverse the "disapproved" to a "not disapproved" after finding out this new info?

GONZOtheMAN · Feb 26, 2010

SMPress said:
Not unheard of. On my 5th or 6th purchase I was denied. Turned out they had on record in another state that I had a speeding ticket that I never paid, and dint show to court for. I had paid it, but didnt have proof, so endedup having to pay for it again. Took about three months to get GA to tell MD that it was all cleared up. This was about 8 years ago, and to this day, when doing the NCIS check, or whatever it is called, I always get a delay or hold response. It is a pain in the ass, as the dealer has to call a live person to run the computer check and give an OK for me. I have no issue when doing a regulated purchase as they have the time to run it through by hand I guess. Still, it sucks!!! I would contact NJ and ask why they didnt give te info over to MD. Atleastyou had the proof and could supply it to MD...

Andy

So was the reason for the being denied was because of the warrent? is it possiblee to be denied for having an unpaid speeding ticket in a none sister state?

GBMaryland · Feb 26, 2010

erwos said:
So, what's the scoop? Did they reverse the "disapproved" to a "not disapproved" after finding out this new info?

Well,

I could appeal the discission... and I'm not really sure if I NEED to from a legal standpoint; The forms don't ask if you every been denied a purchase approval...

Anyway, I went to the store and filled out the paperwork again. (I had to buy something at a nearby store, I was going to wait until next week...)

The Sgt. had already called them to tell them that I could reapply, that I didn't need to pay the application fee again, and that I also did not need to wait for 7 days again; basically the new application would be immeadiately approved.

So it's been one of those days... the gambit from "Huh? Oh shit..." to "You're all set..."

GBMaryland · Feb 26, 2010

novus collectus said:
Yeah, but I think the MDSP is possibly getting it wrong. The equivalent crime only applies to the felony drug offenses in title 5 of the PS article and might apply to crimes of violence. All other crimes which MD may have stricter penalties for does not seem to make one a prohibitted person.

But I am not a lawyer.

One of the things I did note when I went back to fill out the paperwork (again) is that one of the questions on the Maryland form is something like:

"Have you even been convicted of a crime that is a felony in Maryland?"

So, basically, that where I got stung...

Of course, what bothers me about this is: If you were convicted of a misdemeanor in another state, but it turns out to be a felnoy in Maryland, you've just commited a felony by lieing on the application.

Holy crap... and how would you know?

The Sgt. couldn't tell, apparently, that the crime I was (not actually) convicted of was a petty disorderly persons offense... because the equivalent description he found in his Maryland system showed a crime that was a 3 year sentence. I'm sure he errored on the side of caution.

(...and the result was that it was resolved when I called, with the outcome above.)

Splitter · Feb 26, 2010

So....if I get pulled over in jersey and I have a claw hammer under the passenger seat, I am violating the law.....

Splitter

GBMaryland · Feb 26, 2010

Splitter said:
So....if I get pulled over in jersey and I have a claw hammer under the passenger seat, I am violating the law.....

Splitter

Minimum 5 years in prison.

...learn from my screwup, because it's unlikely you'll get lucky enough to have the law on your side.

Of course, if you don't have a record, then it'll probably get lowered as the DA will probably think the cop was just being an ass. ...but IMO, it's not worth it. Put the hammer in the trunk while driving through New Jersey.

I'm not kidding when I say the officer in question (from NJ) told me that if I had a baseball bat in the car's cabin and was not coming or going to a baseball game, he'd have arrested me for that.

That's one of many reasons that I'm glad not to be in NJ anymore... the other is the $7800.00 a year tax on my $346k house.

Splitter · Feb 26, 2010

OMG, terrible. I always keep a rip hammer under the passenger seat just in case I need to nail something.....

Splitter

GBMaryland · Feb 26, 2010

You never know... I suggest you drive around NJ then...

-grin-

SMPress · Feb 26, 2010

GBMaryland said:
You never know... I suggest you drive around NJ then...
QUOTE]

That is a good idea even if you dont have a hammer, isn't it?

SMPress · Feb 26, 2010

GONZOtheMAN said:
So was the reason for the being denied was because of the warrent? is it possiblee to be denied for having an unpaid speeding ticket in a none sister state?

Yes, the warrant was the problem, the speeding ticket is just the cause of te warrant in my case. I am not a lawyer, so I dont know if every state issues a warrant for an unpaid speeding ticket, but I can say that Georgia does, and it shows up in an instant check...

Anyd

Jaybeez · Feb 26, 2010

The X-cops said:
Welcome to New Jersey
It's late at night and you're far from home
Your radio's on and you're driving alone
Until a sign looms from to gloom
The words on that sign are the words to your tomb
It says New Jersey

Shining lights
Bloody face
Rabid dog
Can of mace
He's from New Jersey

Out in the woods, you're cuffed to a tree
The end of my gun is the last thing you'll see
I go through your wallet I take all your cash
Your car I destroy your body I smash
My maniac urges I simply can't stop
The funny thing is I'm not even a cop
Welcome to New Jersey

Shining lights
Bloody face
Rabid dog
Can of mace
He's from New Jersey

Welcome to New Jersey
I hope you enjoy your stay

I always try to avoid jersey, because everytime i go something bad happens, until i went last week. I headed into southern jersey to pick up some materials. I passed one rodeo, and at least 6 "western" wear stores. I think that area needs to be annexed by delaware.

GONZOtheMAN · Feb 26, 2010

SMPress said:
Yes, the warrant was the problem, the speeding ticket is just the cause of te warrant in my case. I am not a lawyer, so I dont know if every state issues a warrant for an unpaid speeding ticket, but I can say that Georgia does, and it shows up in an instant check...

Anyd

would this happen to you if you were to buy a rifle or shotgun? or is the regulated backround check different?

SMPress · Feb 26, 2010

It shows up when they do te instant check, so shotguns and rifles. I am sure it comes up when I do regulated as well, but I dont see it because it is a 7 day wait, and during that period they figure out it is OK, and send the approval. With the instant, when they phone it in, the initial respoonse is a delay, not a denial. If they then talk to a live person, that person gives them a verbal approval on the phone. I can walk into a gun show, and after a 5 minute call between the seller and instant check peoiple, walk away with my gun. It is a pain, but I am able to buy things none the less...

Half-cocked · Feb 26, 2010

NICS check goes through the FBI, but Maryland MSP77's are processed by the Maryland State Police.

Since the MSP program is beholden to the state's political leadership, and have an ongoing need to prove that they're not redundant, they have a vested interest in disapproving applicants, beyond what the NICS check would.

Otherwise, sooner or later word would get around Annapolis that duplicating the federal NICS check is simply a waste of Maryland tax dollars, and during bad fiscal times such as these, even Maryland's anti-gun Democrats might question the sanity of such a waste of money.

novus collectus · Feb 27, 2010

GBMaryland said:
Well,

I could appeal the discission... and I'm not really sure if I NEED to from a legal standpoint; The forms don't ask if you every been denied a purchase approval...

Anyway, I went to the store and filled out the paperwork again. (I had to buy something at a nearby store, I was going to wait until next week...)

The Sgt. had already called them to tell them that I could reapply, that I didn't need to pay the application fee again, and that I also did not need to wait for 7 days again; basically the new application would be immeadiately approved.

So it's been one of those days... the gambit from "Huh? Oh shit..." to "You're all set..."

Actually I think you technically did appeal. The first part of the appeal process is calling them and if it can be taken care of at the firearms division like with what happened to you, then that is a completed appeal from what I understand. I think I read this in the regulations once (COMAR).

GBMaryland · Feb 27, 2010

novus collectus said:
Actually I think you technically did appeal. The first part of the appeal process is calling them and if it can be taken care of at the firearms division like with what happened to you, then that is a completed appeal from what I understand. I think I read this in the regulations once (COMAR).

Well, that sorta answers the questions. I'm actually pretty suprised how quickly this all got resolved.

The folks the store were REALLY suprised, and one of them at said something to the effect that he's only seen this happen that quickly and with a positive resolution 1 other time over all the years he's been selling firearms.

Humph.

SMPress · Feb 27, 2010

Did you go to Atlantic? Thats where my problem poppedup so many years ago. I was able to fix it overnight and return the next day to take possesion...

GBMaryland · Feb 27, 2010

Yeap, that would be them.

Also, I contacted a fellow Terp, who's an attorney in the town... What he suspects is that they simply never removed the inital arrest records, and that somehow Maryland got a hold of those.

jpk1md · Feb 27, 2010

Prior to the 68 GCA folks did not legally "Lose" their rights to KBA if I'm not mistaken.

In either case, these rediculous federal and state laws that allow for the permanent stripping of rights for simple offenses must be overturned.

Lautenberg Amm needs to go as well as all of the other crap.....

Someone commits murder or starts a revolution thats fine but for Traffic offences? Lets get real

"Disapproved" for Hand Gun Purchase... Questions...

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