Who will transfer all HBARs as non regulated

Mason-Dixon · Dec 19, 2011

The only thing on AR-15's that is regulated are the lower receivers. Everything else can be purchased separately w/o any paperwork. All Colt HBAR's are marked "HBAR" on the magazine well. I'm not certain but I believe another identifying characteristic of a cash and carry HBAR is an A-2 stock and a non-removable carry handle/and iron sights. If someone modified an HBAR to have an adjustable stock and sold it to a gun dealer or a private citizen it may not qualify as cash and carry. I just don't know if that would change anything or not for sure. Gray area?

mikec · Dec 19, 2011

Mason-Dixon said:
The only thing on AR-15's that is regulated are the lower receivers. Everything else can be purchased separately w/o any paperwork. All Colt HBAR's are marked "HBAR" on the magazine well. I'm not certain but I believe another identifying characteristic of a cash and carry HBAR is an A-2 stock and a non-removable carry handle/and iron sights. If someone modified an HBAR to have an adjustable stock and sold it to a gun dealer or a private citizen it may not qualify as cash and carry. I just don't know if that would change anything or not for sure. Gray area?

Sorry, I have a cash and carry M4 clone that doesn't have a carry handle or rear sights. The buttstock is also collapsible.

gamer_jim · Dec 19, 2011

I'm confused, if it's unregulated (I thought all HBARs were) do you have to transfer it through and FFL?

mikec · Dec 19, 2011

gamer_jim said:
I'm confused, if it's unregulated (I thought all HBARs were) do you have to transfer it through and FFL?

If it is unregulated, you can sell FTF. (As long as the buyer is a MD resident and you have no belief they are prohibited or under the legal age).

browning guy · Dec 19, 2011

GNLaFrance said:
I believe The Gun Shop (Essex) 410-686-7333 and FreeState Gun Range 410-335-5100 will, but call them first to make sure.

the gun shop
We treat hbars as regulated firearms, Because of the inconstant information from the state police. It seems like everyone you talk to at the statre police gives you a diffrent story on Hbars.

Markp · Dec 19, 2011

Mason-Dixon said:
The only thing on AR-15's that is regulated are the lower receivers.

Lowers are not regulated... ONLY complete assault weapons are.

Check the law, Only "handguns", "specific assault weapons", and their copies are regulated, not their frames or receivers.

Did they write the law poorly, yes they did.

Abacab · Dec 19, 2011

Markp said:
Lowers are not regulated... ONLY complete assault weapons are.

Check the law, Only "handguns", "specific assault weapons", and their copies are regulated, not their frames or receivers.

Did they write the law poorly, yes they did.

Lowers are most certainly regulated. I have never encountered a dealer who sold AR-15 lowers cash and carry.

mikec · Dec 19, 2011

Abacab said:
Lowers are most certainly regulated. I have never encountered a dealer who sold AR-15 lowers cash and carry.

Mark has written this many times before, I feel like I can channel him...

Where in MD law does it say that receivers are regulated? The law only mentions complete firearms. We have yet to find a FFL who will agree but the law doesn't include forearms.

Markp · Dec 19, 2011

Abacab said:
Lowers are most certainly regulated. I have never encountered a dealer who sold AR-15 lowers cash and carry.

Really, based on what law??? While the dealers are playing CYA, and I respect their right to do so, they are NOT regulated.

Dealers sell Mossberg 500 receivers as unregulated (yet they can be used to build the Mossburg Bullpup Assault Shotgun). So why would an AR receiver be regulated just because you "could" build a regulated firearm with it.

It's NOT regulated by LAW... Show me where I am wrong in the law.

WHY DO PEOPLE HATE TO HEAR THAT RECEIVERS ARE NOT REGULATED???

Is it BGOS?

Abacab · Dec 19, 2011

mikec said:
Mark has written this many times before, I feel like I can channel him...

Where in MD law does it say that receivers are regulated? The law only mentions complete firearms. We have yet to find a FFL who will agree but the law doesn't include forearms.

.......... :sad20:

The lowers do not include an HBAR. The law says AR-15s and copies. They are regulated. End of story.

We've been through this a million times.

mikec · Dec 19, 2011

BTW, anyone here remember the old Maryland AR15 Shooters Site, that was hosted as part of MSN's groups? I remember seeing there once a person posting that they got a MD FFL to transfer a receiver cash and carry because the guy brought a HBAR kit in to show the FFL what the rifle was going to be.

Markp · Dec 19, 2011

Abacab said:
..........

The lowers do not include an HBAR. The law says AR-15s and copies. They are regulated. End of story.

We've been through this a million times.

Clearly you have difficulty reading...

5-101(p) "Regulated firearm" means:

(1) a handgun; or

(2) a firearm that is any of the following specific assault weapons or their copies, regardless of which company produced and manufactured that assault weapon:

Not all AR receiver based weapons are AR-15's... Pretty simple. Receivers are NOT regulated... No where does it say that they are. Unless you can cite case law or other legal precedent, I don't know why else you feel compelled to make things more restrictive than they really are. Is this so difficult to grasp?

End of story.

lasher9999 · Dec 19, 2011

Buddy said:
Call the Gun Conection they know the laws, and they are great people to deal with.

LOL. Not my experience.

Abacab · Dec 19, 2011

Markp said:
Clearly you have difficulty reading...

5-101(p) "Regulated firearm" means:

(1) a handgun; or

(2) a firearm that is any of the following specific assault weapons or their copies, regardless of which company produced and manufactured that assault weapon:

Not all AR receiver based weapons are AR-15's... Pretty simple. Receivers are NOT regulated... No where does it say that they are. Unless you can cite case law or other legal precedent, I don't know why else you feel compelled to make things more restrictive than they really are. Is this so difficult to grasp?

End of story.

I highly recommend buying a receiver with a serial number without doing the MSP paperwork. Make sure you call the Licensing Division after you do it. See how well that goes over in Pikesville.

You can sit here and bitch and whine keyboard commando style but the fact is the MSP considers the receiver a regulated firearm without an HBAR upper BECAUSE IT CAN BE SETUP AS A PISTOL AND/OR A RIFLE (aka AR-15 REGULATED firearm). Not to mention all stripped lowers require a FFL to transfer. Both pistols and standard AR-15s (non HBARs) are regulated. Thus, the MSP regulates all receivers because of its many permutations because IT DOESN'T HAVE A HBAR. Unless it goes out the door with one, it's regulated.

I am not making it more restrictive; I'm choosing not to be an idiot. It's like having a carry permit and open carrying. "But the law doesn't say I can't!!?!?!" Aw, damn, now you lost your permit. But hey, it isn't specifically spelled out you can't legally, now is it? Moral victory. :clap:

Markp · Dec 19, 2011

I highly recommend buying a receiver with a serial number without doing the MSP paperwork. Make sure you call the Licensing Division after you do it. See how well that goes over in Pikesville. <- Sure, I'd be happy to... I live in VA now.

You can sit here and bitch and whine keyboard commando style but the fact is the MSP considers the receiver a regulated firearm without an HBAR upper BECAUSE IT CAN BE SETUP AS A PISTOL AND/OR A RIFLE (aka AR-15 REGULATED firearm). Both pistols and standard AR-15s (non HBARs) are regulated. <- show me one document that proves this statement. Please stop making up shit that doesn't exist.

Thus, the MSP regulates all receivers because of its many permutations because IT DOESN'T HAVE A HBAR. <- Seriously, you don't have any reference, any letter to point to from any legal authority, and you simply believe that only AR receivers can be regulated firearms... ALL receivers could be built into a pistol, by your logic they should all be regulated.

But hey, it isn't specifically spelled out you can't legally, now is it? Moral victory. <- umm the law matters.

atblis · Dec 19, 2011

I highly recommend buying a receiver with a serial number without doing the MSP paperwork. Make sure you call the Licensing Division after you do it. See how well that goes over in Pikesville.

It wouldn't surprise me if they couldn't even figure out what you were trying to tell them.

I still haven't figured this out. I need two AR15s transferred. Both are HBARS, one being a straight up A2 HBAR clone, and the other a heavy barreled varmint/target rig. The hangup I had with the last dealer I inquired about was that they were both built on new stripped lowers. The issue being that there was no documentation of it being an HBAR gun.

EDIT: Does Colt own the term HBAR? Bushmaster has used it in the past. I wonder if we could talk a manufacturer into making a run of HBAR marked lowers and or even barrels.

lasher9999 · Dec 19, 2011

Second Amendment said:
HBAR'S are not regulated. But don't waste your money, they all seem to get lost in boating accidents.

LOL. But why lose them if they are FTF!

Abacab · Dec 19, 2011

Markp said:
Coward? So I should have told the Military I couldn't PCS?

Still have your MD driver's license? Or are you now using that privilege of your duty station to buy in Virginia?

Markp · Dec 19, 2011

Abacab said:
Still have your MD driver's license? Or are you now using that grey area of "dual residency"?

Never had a MD license... Was a Texas resident prior to joining and remained a Texas resident.

And yes, I legally purchased weapons in MD and TX while living in MD. Nothing "gray" about it.

Abacab · Dec 19, 2011

Markp said:
Never had a MD license... Was a Texas resident prior to joining and remained a Texas resident.

And yes, I legally purchased weapons in MD and TX while living in MD. Nothing "gray" about it.

Then why the hell are you on here? You can't vote for anyone that can change anything, can't buy a gun and don't even pay a dime in state taxes? Is it just to pretend you know something and run your mouth?

I'm done with this conversation. When you have a chip in the game, get back to me.

Who will transfer all HBARs as non regulated

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