DaemonAssassin
Why should we Free BSD?
A sub-MOA 30 AR-10 is within possible, with the right amount of work, during the build process. You just have to be willing to buy once, cry once on components, and build it properly.
I think there is probably some truth to the idea that accuracy issues with large frame ARs can be traced to the lack of parts compatibility akin to AR15s. That said I also think it can be attributed to a lack of QC from manufacturers and know how when they are assembled. Building an AR in any size properly requires a lot more work than is commonly thought by many gunsmiths and amateurs alike.
Personally I would go with a black hole weaponry or criterion barrel if I were working on a project that I was hoping to turn into a consistently sub MOA gas rifle just because I have good luck with them. Much higher end than that and I'd probably just start looking for a reputable gunsmith or builder and have them take care of it. I might luck out and manage to build something that accurate on my own with something mid tier, but once really expensive components get in the mix I'm going to have a non-amateur build it. Their fees can be high, but they are cheaper than irreparably jacking up an $800+ barrel or $500+ receiver set.
Okay let's be honest I'd probably bring Clandestine in on it from the start, and once he gets his FFL I'd probably just have him build me something if he were offering that service. Somehow I doubt the prospect of building $3k-$5k designer rifles is what gets him out of bed in the morning though.
I think I’m going to completely change the direction of this build. I want to make it a fun 200-600yd gun that’s pretty accurate, but not break the bank, sub MOA accurate.
With that being said, is a stainless “match” barrel necessary? Or will a regular chrome lined barrel work just fine?
I think I’m going to completely change the direction of this build. I want to make it a fun 200-600yd gun that’s pretty accurate, but not break the bank, sub MOA accurate.
With that being said, is a stainless “match” barrel necessary? Or will a regular chrome lined barrel work just fine?
Same things I mention apply, but you can get by with a shorter barrel.
Believe it or not, I built a AR-10 for a family friend that is sub-MOA with match ammo. It is even sub-MOA with the handloads I made for it for deer hunting. I was using AE 168gr SMK ammo that was optimized for the M1A. The handloads I was using were running 165gr SGK projectiles.
The kicker is that I was using a Aero Precision M5 upper/lower set with a Aero Precision nitrided BCG, a Aero M5 handguard (never again with the timing of the barrel nut...), a YHM Phantom flash hider/comp, a 16" KAK Value Line 308 barrel that was $125, and a G2S trigger. I'm not going to complain about the other issues that occurred because I found out where I was wrong on the handloads, by talking to Sierra, but the rifle runs flawlessly with factory ammo. Total cost of the rifle was around 1500, not sure if that price tag included the optic and mount or not, it has been a while since I looked at the spreadsheet.
^^^^This man knows his stuff.
Thank you for the kind words my friend.
Believe it or not, I built a AR-10 for a family friend that is sub-MOA with match ammo. It is even sub-MOA with the handloads I made for it for deer hunting. I was using AE 168gr SMK ammo that was optimized for the M1A. The handloads I was using were running 165gr SGK projectiles.
The kicker is that I was using a Aero Precision M5 upper/lower set with a Aero Precision nitrided BCG, a Aero M5 handguard (never again with the timing of the barrel nut...), a YHM Phantom flash hider/comp, a 16" KAK Value Line 308 barrel that was $125, and a G2S trigger. I'm not going to complain about the other issues that occurred because I found out where I was wrong on the handloads, by talking to Sierra, but the rifle runs flawlessly with factory ammo. Total cost of the rifle was around 1500, not sure if that price tag included the optic and mount or not, it has been a while since I looked at the spreadsheet.
^^^^This man knows his stuff.
The barrel nut has 4 slots for the gas tube to pass through. It also comes with a 5 pack of shims. I needed more than 5 shims to get it to time properly.What was so bad about timing the aero handguard? I was looking at them for my build. I have their upper and lower and a Brownell’s bolt (still need to check it over for gas key torque and of course need a barrel to confirm head space). No barrel picked out yet, but I’d like to find a fluted 18” HBAR.
The barrel nut has 4 slots for the gas tube to pass through. It also comes with a 5 pack of shims. I needed more than 5 shims to get it to time properly.
Ugh. That stinks. One of my generic handguards is sort of that way. Barely was able to get it to time. Not a gas hole issue, but the handguard is cocked a tiny bit (one side is about .05” “long” and one side .05” short if that makes sense). Probably wouldn’t be an issue if I had a handguard front sight. But I don’t and run it scoped. But a little annoying if you look close.
But for a $35 ebay handguard...I won’t complain. Much.
At the risk of exposing my ignorance here, I'll say that one can shoot sub MOA with an AR10. Unless I'm missing something (which is entirely possible) the only thing holding me back from doing this repeatedly or improving, isn't the rifle, but my own lack of skill and consistency. This is with a purchased complete DPMS upper and an 80% lower.
Not to knock your groupings at all, but some would argue that a 3 shot group is too small of a sample size to validate overall performance. Their thought process is to use a 5 shot group depending or purpose or application.
Some benchrest shooters will use an even longer sample 10-20 rounds to determine group sizing.
1 million percent agree. 5 shot group is a "standard minimum". 3 shots is more of a "wow i did great let me stop shooting before i get a flyer"
Would a 4th or 5th shot "flyer" be more of an indication of the limitations of the rifle or of my abilities as a shooter?
Would a 4th or 5th shot "flyer" be more of an indication of the limitations of the rifle or of my abilities as a shooter?