I'm in favor of mandatory training to own a gun

[Schipperke]

Shipperke and Danb seem to be hold the same opinion as Woodstock.

Which opinion would that be?

As far as the thread title, that I would be against.

Position on making gun safety training a required class in public school, yes or no. I guess the answer should be no. Buying and owning a firearm is an enumerated right, so training shouldn't be mandatory any time.

Need to draw a picture?

and, from Danb;

Not advocating manadory training, just saying that people who think mandatory training is unconstitutional are fooling themselves and will be disappointed.

I don't disagree with the latter analysis. This will be played out with the HQL case, so we shall see.

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

Heck, mandatory manners training should be at the top of the list. You know before you can post. While we're urinating to windward, annual manners refresher training would be nice too.

Don't forget mandatory spelling and grammar training.

Those will be a good start.

PS. I don't have a vendor of choice.

 

[eruby]

But does he taste just like raisins?

Raisinettes.

 

[Doco Overboard]

I'm in favor of mandatory training to own a gun

Im in favor of people staying the f$%k out of my business with some things.
Nothing worse than someone trying to validate credentials you don't need or want.
I could put an alphabet behind my name too but I don't because nobody really would give a dam.
However, the op feels strongly about a particular subject and surely has prepared himself for criticism and more than likely being dropped like a bag of hot d*^ks, Ill give him that.

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

I'm in favor of mandatory training to own a gun

Im in favor of people staying the f$%k out of my business with some things.
Nothing worse than someone trying to validate credentials you don't need or want.
I could put an alphabet behind my name too but I don't because nobody really would give a dam.
However, the op feels strongly about a particular subject and surely has prepared himself for criticism and more than likely being dropped like a bag of hot d*^ks, Ill give him that.

He may also be of the belief that any publicity is good publicity.









...did i forget to say sadly mistaken belief??

 

[Huckleberry]

Raisinettes.

Then you maybe licking the wrong end

 

[woodstock]

Either you or someone from MSI better clarify mighty quickly if your position on mandatory training is reflective of the organization's position, since you've now conflated two entirely disparate discussions.

And, please learn to use the quote button.

PM inbound.

 

[welder516]

Title change makes sense or is it cents ? I always get that messed up

 

[TargetGrade]

"big fella" is indicative of a negative nature in response. discourse, vent or solicitation? none of the above, just simply stating the facts. knock the chip off your shoulder and open your mind.

Oh please, that's his favorite expression. Lighten up Francis.

 

[hit3961]

ALL constructive input is appreciated. I've been a member here since 2009, been banned once, and have seemingly made some keyboard enemies. took some time off from posting and lurked for quite sometime. There seems to be a commonality in the fraternity et.el. and that really does affect the viewing audience, new to the lifestyle of gun ownership. I think it was DC~W who said "...these threads are nothing to take seriously, just a place to vent..."--or something like that and i agreed. YET, there are some serious statements on these threads that need to be addressed.

First off, would everyone here agree that in order to exercise our 1st amendment free speech rights, we have had MANDATORY training? yes or no? for those who say NO, if you didn't have the training to read and write, you couldn't read this. EDUCATION is mandatory, be it homeschool or public or private, it is mandatory.

next comes the 15th amendment to the constitution, whereby The Voting Rights Act of 1965, signed into law by President Lyndon B. Johnson, aimed to overcome legal barriers at the state and local levels that prevented African Americans from exercising their right to vote as guaranteed under the 15th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. <~~here, there is no mandatory training, yet societally speaking, those who vote have more impact on us as a whole, than any other populace in America. shouldn't some sort of mandatory training in civics/economics and American History be taught to REGISTERED voters? yes/no? in my opinion, if you answer NO, we are doomed as a republic/democracy. cultural influences will change us in unpredicted directions, look at Europe.

It is to my understanding that those who seek citizenship in the USA are required to attend a mandatory training class in American culture and history, plus take the pledge to the country, but this requirement is being phased out as of this writing.

now comes the topic of disapproval from many, mandatory training for gun ownership. before we go down that road, consider the words in the second amendment, "...a well regulated militia..." what does that mean? Word Origin and History for regulate Expand v. early 15c., "adjust by rule, control," from Late Latin regulatus, past participle of regulare "to control by rule, direct," from Latin regula "rule" (see regular ). Meaning "to govern by restriction" is from 1620s. Related: Regulated ; regulating.

According to our 2nd amendment of the constitution of the United States of America "an amendment to the U.S. Constitution, ratified in 1791 as part of the Bill of Rights, guaranteeing the right to keep and bear arms as necessary to maintain a state militia." The state militia at the time was the citizenry. Citizens who knew how to use guns because of their state regulation, an amendment to the U.S. Constitution, ratified in 1791 as part of the Bill of Rights, guaranteeing the right to keep and bear arms as necessary to maintain a state militia.

think about that for a rational moment.

Massad Ayoob and I had this conversation last august and when i told him LEO'S had to qualify on their firearms once per year, mandatorily! he simply said, "good point." and we moved on. matter of fact, this exchange come from : (ahem) I would like to preface this reply by saying I haven’t read all the responses, but after sending this post for review, will begin my evening/late nite reading and absorb the opinions set fourth.

Ma’s, you and I had this brief discussion in Harrisburg, PA. In fact, I find it ironic you told me this story in an abbreviated fashion “… I spoke as an expert witness for a female senior citizen who was charged with criminal homicide after killing her abusive common law husband in self-defense when he tried to murder her for the second time in a matter of a few days. Attorney Mark Seiden won her acquittal, and I was proud to have been a part of that. The lady in question lived in a trailer and could not have afforded training. She couldn’t even afford her own gun. After the first murder attempt, she had borrowed a cheap .22 from her son. The three shots she fired in the self-defense incident – all center mass hits – were the second, third, and fourth shots she had ever discharged from a firearm in her life.

If she’d had to pay for a firearms safety course she couldn’t afford, she would have been helplessly murdered.”

My immediate response was that we in the shooting community need to look out for others who have a shared interest. (I am a Maryland state license/NRA certified/MAG certified/IDPA certified instructor) I said I would give her the instruction under my HARDSHIP DISCOUNT, meaning there would be no fee, so long as the student did the homework AND followed up with the free hour of refresher. I have donated countless hours to hardship cases A Vietnam Vet so riddled with Agent Orange, the health costs are to treat a 400% disabled medals of honor recipient, who has a really nice collection. In Maryland there is a mandatory 4 hour safety course requirement before you can even lawfully buy/transfer/possess a regulated firearm. His wife got a six hour course of instruction for the price of a box of CCI .22LR, copper plated, 50 rds. When it’s “time”, she will be able to retain his collection after the funeral.

So back to Harrisburg conversation, I mentioned all CCW holders should have to shoot one IDPA classifier, if they have the skills and physical ability. You gave me the look like “seriously?” and then as we were going back into the building, I said, my friends who wear a badge have to do the MANDATORY qualification at least once per year, civilians should be held to the same standard. (I don’t know that you heard me as you had entered the building and I was still in the threshold.)

Mas, your level of instruction is much different than where I start with my students. YOUR students are for the most part experienced and TRAINED. Mine? I could tell you horror stories.

Exp: Mrs. Jones comes into my office with a big beach bag. Ms. Jones is 72 years young. She wants to learn how to use her inherited .38SPL Service revolver. Her husband was a city cop. She is on fixed income (hardship discount), and comes into my class with a fully cocked .38 SPL, housing .38 SPL +P, ball ammo, in the bottom of this beach bag, with all her “essentials”, key ring, writing pens, check book, chapstick, change and a couple rolls of dimes. I AM GRATEFUL FOR MANDATORY training as I fixt this problem. Without the mandatory training to acquire the lawful possession of this gun in Maryland, this situation was just an accident waiting to happen.

I could bore you with more examples, but I hope what I have provided is adequate. If not, I can send links to news stories where the three year old toddler shot her mother in the stomach in a Walmart, mom WAS a lawful in CCW and countless other tragedies.

Not only that, we have to consider societal progression vs firearm advancements. Back in the “day” it was shameful for towns folk to NOT show up at public events that promoted safety and accurate shooting. Ball and cap days. Today, shame is a thing of the past, mainstream. Firearm advancements have to be considered juxtaposed to common knowledge.

exp: clerk at a gun store is new and has fetishes about his new love with GLOCK. Everything is GLOCK to him. A customer walks in with no training, never have shot a gun and walks out with a .40CAL, POLY FRAMED semi auto, two 16 round standard capacity magazines. It didn’t occur to her she couldn’t load the magazines and when she did get some in, they were backwards. As well, remembering the slide stop, and how the whole machine was designed for easy and simple function left her at a loss. (sigh) Mandatory training is my vote, hands down. Many instructors I know might donate time, some may not, but ultimately it is up to the gun owner to seek out the training and ASK if the instructor has a HARDSHIP clause. Then again, those who have shame may not seek the instruction because they think it a futile and embarrassing endeavor. And thats the shame.

I’m sure more to come… Thanks.

Stay safe.

Do people need a class on how not to have 7 kids and get welfare ,And teach them not to raise criminals That's a No!!!!!!!

I said when you need a piss test and a class to get a welfare check then maybe.

 

[teratos]

PM inbound.

No PM. Put it out here.

 

[BUFF7MM]

No PM. Put it out here.

I doubt that will happen so I’m not holding my breathe.

 

[Melnic]

Most people get training from family and friends. Good or bad, that is how it is. Not enough certified trainers to make it happen. Not even close in my opinion. There are people in rural areas that certified training is not practical. There are people in Urban areas where cost, availability and shooting ranges are not practical.

Ubsurd to require it.

 

[hit3961]

No PM. Put it out here.

Welfare training after urinalysis

 

[clandestine]

PM inbound.

Aww, how sweet.

 

[outrider58]

There is no true standard for general firearms training...with good reason.

 

[rbird7282]

What about mandatory training to carry a gun in public ? Not a close enough precedent? As far as the thread title, that I would be against. I can own all kinds of things that I may be prohibited to operate. Many executives own airplanes, but would be illegal for themselve to fly them until training and certification. Some people own motorcycles, but can not legally use them on public roads. List could go on and on about ownership vs use. Right now many states require mandatory recurring training to carry a gun. I've seen no cases against that, have there been? Before Maryland HQL, I recall a different less onerous hoop. I had some little paper, I did an online MSP thing about gun safety, and believe that was required before HQL. Not sure how much angst that caused, but do not recall any case against that.

No. No mandatory training to carry a gun in public. Never. People seem to forget about this little thing called personal responsibility.
If someone chooses to carry a gun in public (legally of course) then they also take on the responsibility to do so safely. The government should not be mandating ANY OF THIS.


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[Doctor_M]

While I agree that the new thread title makes sense from a context perspective... it churns my stomach acid every time I see it now.

"Stuff..." was much less offensive.

 

[welder516]

While I agree that the new thread title makes sense from a context perspective... it churns my stomach acid every time I see it now.

"Stuff..." was much less offensive.

Yeah I see your point , stuff could be like dog crap on your feet as well .

 

[rbird7282]

It is for the little boys to learn on. That's why it only has one or two clasps. Easier to get off the subject girl in a hurry. Then faced with those monster six/eight/ten clasp devices, they can achieve the promised land faster.

#setthepuppiesfree

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