MD takes your registered guns when you die???

[teratos]

Smile and nod, but verify.

 

[Half-cocked]

Registration is voluntary.

And, "If you like your guns, you can keep your guns".

 

[dblas]

We'll of course!!! I was trying to just get a popular opinion answer quick! After all, I could die at anytime. Lol

As stated previously, I'm thinking maybe it was "banned items". I will talk to my co-worker again on Monday and get more info on what exactly was said.

There is an exemption in MD law for transfers to heirs.

Criminal Code - 4-302(5) & (6)

4–302.

This subtitle does not apply to:

(1) if acting within the scope of official business, personnel of the United States government or a unit of that government, members of the armed forces of the United States or of the National Guard, MEMBERS OF THE MARYLAND DEFENSE FORCE, or law enforcement personnel of the State or a local unit in the State, OR A RAILROAD POLICE OFFICER AUTHORIZED UNDER TITLE 3 OF THE PUBLIC SAFETY ARTICLE OR 49 U.S.C. § 28101;

(2) a firearm modified to render it permanently inoperative;

(3) POSSESSION, IMPORTATION, MANUFACTURE, RECEIPT FOR MANUFACTURE, SHIPMENT FOR MANUFACTURE, STORAGE, purchases, sales, and transport to or by a licensed firearms dealer or manufacturer who is:

(i) providing or servicing an assault [pistol] WEAPON or detachable magazine for a law enforcement unit or for personnel exempted under item (1) of this section; or

(ii) acting to sell or transfer an assault [pistol] WEAPON or detachable magazine to a licensed firearm dealer in another state OR TO AN INDIVIDUAL PURCHASER IN ANOTHER STATE THROUGH A LICENSED FIREARMS DEALER; OR

(III) ACTING TO RETURN TO A CUSTOMER IN ANOTHER STATE AN ASSAULT WEAPON TRANSFERRED TO THE LICENSED FIREARMS DEALER OR MANUFACTURER UNDER THE TERMS OF A WARRANTY OR FOR REPAIR;

(4) organizations that are required or authorized by federal law governing their specific business or activity to maintain assault [pistols] WEAPONS and applicable ammunition and detachable magazines;

(5) the receipt of an assault [pistol] WEAPON or detachable magazine by inheritance, AND POSSESSION OF THE INHERITED ASSAULT WEAPON OR DETACHABLE MAGAZINE, if the decedent lawfully possessed the assault [pistol] WEAPON OR DETACHABLE MAGAZINE AND THE PERSON INHERITING THE ASSAULT WEAPON OR DETACHABLE MAGAZINE IS NOT OTHERWISE DISQUALIFIED FROM POSSESSING A REGULATED FIREARM; or

(6) the receipt of an assault [pistol] WEAPON or detachable magazine by a personal representative of an estate for purposes of exercising the powers and duties of a personal representative of an estate; OR

(7) POSSESSION BY A PERSON WHO IS RETIRED IN GOOD STANDING FROM SERVICE WITH A LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY OF THE STATE OR A LOCAL UNIT IN THE STATE AND IS NOT OTHERWISE PROHIBITED FROM RECEIVING AN ASSAULT WEAPON OR DETACHABLE MAGAZINE IF:

(I) THE ASSAULT WEAPON OR DETACHABLE MAGAZINE IS SOLD OR TRANSFERRED TO THE PERSON BY THE LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY ON RETIREMENT; OR

(II) THE ASSAULT WEAPON OR DETACHABLE MAGAZINE WAS PURCHASED OR OBTAINED BY THE PERSON FOR OFFICIAL USE WITH THE LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY BEFORE RETIREMENT; OR

(8) POSSESSION OR TRANSPORT BY AN EMPLOYEE OF AN ARMORED CAR COMPANY IF THE INDIVIDUAL IS ACTING WITHIN THE SCOPE OF EMPLOYMENT AND HAS A PERMIT ISSUED UNDER TITLE 5, SUBTITLE 3 OF THE PUBLIC SAFETY ARTICLE; OR

(9) POSSESSION, RECEIPT, AND TESTING BY, OR SHIPPING TO OR FROM:

(I) AN ISO 17025 ACCREDITED, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF JUSTICE–APPROVED BALLISTICS TESTING LABORATORY; OR

(II) A FACILITY OR ENTITY THAT MANUFACTURES OR PROVIDES RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT TESTING, ANALYSIS, OR ENGINEERING FOR PERSONAL PROTECTIVE EQUIPMENT OR VEHICLE PROTECTION SYSTEMS.

 

[TheSubieNinja7]

Just perused the MD Law of Estates and the only possible way that this could happen, according to the statutes I read, is if you die intestate or even with a will, but the heir is disqualified from ownership. Even then, the statute says that a "guardian" would be appointed to manage any property that a minor/DQ'ed person couldn't possess due to age, capacity, disqualification.

MD Law of Estates and Trusts 13-201 (cross-referencing Public Safety Article 5-133).

IAALawStudent.

 

[fabsroman]

Crim Law §4–302.

This subtitle does not apply to:

(1) ......

(5) the receipt of an assault weapon or detachable magazine by inheritance, and possession of the inherited assault weapon or detachable magazine, if the decedent lawfully possessed the assault weapon or detachable magazine and the person inheriting the assault weapon or detachable magazine is not otherwise disqualified from possessing a regulated firearm;

With that said, things can get pretty tricky if a person dies intestate (i.e., without a will), there are more than one beneficiary to the estate, and the single assault weapon in the estate is wanted by more than one beneficiary. Not only that, but the personal representative has the discretion to liquidate all tangible personal property/assets via sale and convert them into cash to be distributed to the beneficiaries.

Short of it is, the instructor is not entirely right, but chances are that if an assault weapon is not inherited via a specific bequest in a will, it just isn't going to happen.

Now, there is a difference between an assault weapon and a regulated firearm. Regulated firearms or pretty much only handguns right now. However, the same issue comes into play when a person dies intestate. Who is getting the firearms.

Make this stuff simple ahead of time, and save a lot of grief and money on the back end. Get a will in place right now. After tax season, I am going to edit mine and my wife's to take into account the 2013 firearm acquisitions.

This truly is an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. I've seen where people have died without a Will in place and it created a complete disaster.

 

[pbharvey]

Crim Law §4–302.

This subtitle does not apply to:

(1) ......

(5) the receipt of an assault weapon or detachable magazine by inheritance, and possession of the inherited assault weapon or detachable magazine, if the decedent lawfully possessed the assault weapon or detachable magazine and the person inheriting the assault weapon or detachable magazine is not otherwise disqualified from possessing a regulated firearm;

With that said, things can get pretty tricky if a person dies intestate (i.e., without a will), there are more than one beneficiary to the estate, and the single assault weapon in the estate is wanted by more than one beneficiary. Not only that, but the personal representative has the discretion to liquidate all tangible personal property/assets via sale and convert them into cash to be distributed to the beneficiaries.

Short of it is, the instructor is not entirely right, but chances are that if an assault weapon is not inherited via a specific bequest in a will, it just isn't going to happen.

Now, there is a difference between an assault weapon and a regulated firearm. Regulated firearms or pretty much only handguns right now. However, the same issue comes into play when a person dies intestate. Who is getting the firearms.

Make this stuff simple ahead of time, and save a lot of grief and money on the back end. Get a will in place right now. After tax season, I am going to edit mine and my wife's to take into account the 2013 firearm acquisitions.

This truly is an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. I've seen where people have died without a Will in place and it created a complete disaster.

You have underage children. Is there a way for you to will your regulated/assault firearms to an entity that can hold them so to speak until the children grow up?

 

[Ab_Normal]

It was a class. He said it was given from a retired Baltimore police officer. She didn't quote the statute number. But it sounds like from a previous comment that maybe this isn't true. Thank God!

But I guess it wouldn't hurt to leave them to someone just in case.

Except for police officers that are firearms enthusiasts like many on this board, it has been my experience that police officers usually aren't well versed on the finer points of the laws outside of traffic/domestic/drug/theft and a couple other issues they deal with day to day.

Clif notes: don't rely on the police for legal advice.

YMMV

 

[fabsroman]

You have underage children. Is there a way for you to will your regulated/assault firearms to an entity that can hold them so to speak until the children grow up?

As far as I know, they cannot be held in an entity. NFA trusts can only hold NFA items.

The plan is for me to leave mine to my wife and vice versa. Should the survivor of the two of us pass before the kids are adults, then they will be left to my dad and his Will will leave them to our kids if they are of age, or if they are still minors his Will will leave them to my mother. Next on the list is my brothers. I am going to have to draft this thing pretty good to make sure that anybody that is prohibited is considered to predecease the decedent. It is going to be a good project for the end of April, beginning of May.

As it is right now, my Will leaves everything to my wife right now, so unless we both die, then we are covered in the short term.

 

[fabsroman]

Just perused the MD Law of Estates and the only possible way that this could happen, according to the statutes I read, is if you die intestate or even with a will, but the heir is disqualified from ownership. Even then, the statute says that a "guardian" would be appointed to manage any property that a minor/DQ'ed person couldn't possess due to age, capacity, disqualification.

MD Law of Estates and Trusts 13-201 (cross-referencing Public Safety Article 5-133).

IAALawStudent.

When did Towson get a law school? lol

Article - Estates and Trusts

§13–201.

(a) Upon petition, and after any notice or hearing prescribed by law or the Maryland Rules, the court may appoint a guardian of the property of a minor or a disabled person.
(b) A guardian shall be appointed if the court determines that:
(1) A minor owns or is entitled to property that requires management or protection; or
(2) Funds are needed for his support, care, welfare, and education and protection is necessary or desirable to obtain or provide funds.
(c) A guardian shall be appointed if the court determines that:
(1) The person is unable to manage his property and affairs effectively because of physical or mental disability, disease, habitual drunkenness, addiction to drugs, imprisonment, compulsory hospitalization, confinement, detention by a foreign power, or disappearance; and
(2) The person has or may be entitled to property or benefits which require proper management.

That section would be a stretch to have a guardian appointed to "protect" or "manage" assets that consist of regulated firearms. Essentially, that statute is in place to prevent a young child from getting his/her hands on a large sum of money via inheritance. Kind of like the Uniform Gifts/Transfers to Minors Act.

The guardian would still be holding the firearms in trust. This really needs some serious research to see if a regular trust can hold firearms in it. I spent an entire evening last summer trying to figure this out and came to the conclusion that a trust cannot legally own anything but NFA items, but I didn't document my research since it was only for myself. Might delve further into this subject at the end of April. It really would be nice if a trust could own a banned firearm for the benefit of the designated beneficiaries within the trust, but I don't think that is going to fly.

 

[pbharvey]

As far as I know, they cannot be held in an entity. NFA trusts can only hold NFA items.

The plan is for me to leave mine to my wife and vice versa. Should the survivor of the two of us pass before the kids are adults, then they will be left to my dad and his Will will leave them to our kids if they are of age, or if they are still minors his Will will leave them to my mother. Next on the list is my brothers. I am going to have to draft this thing pretty good to make sure that anybody that is prohibited is considered to predecease the decedent. It is going to be a good project for the end of April, beginning of May.

As it is right now, my Will leaves everything to my wife right now, so unless we both die, then we are covered in the short term.

If you left them to your brother, then would your boys have to wait until he passed to get them? Its not legal for him to transfer the guns to them right?

 

[fabsroman]

If you left them to your brother, then would your boys have to wait until he passed to get them? Its not legal for him to transfer the guns to them right?

I've got two girls and a boy and bought 2 AR-15's for each of them, but that is beside the point.

You are correct. My brother would have to leave them to my kids via his Will.

Ultimately, I am hoping that we don't have this problem, that my kids go away to college, and/or they take jobs in another state. Then, they will be in Free America (with a couple exceptions like California, Connecticut New York, New Jersey) and they could buy whatever they want. This is all a backup plan should we all stay here, but the plan is to move when we retire, and if the kids stay in Maryland buy a little condo here so we can visit and drive them nuts later on in life.

I just have to try to stay alive, as does my wife, and this becomes a non-issue. I can also put her parents in the mix. Her mom is 62 years old, so chances are she will live another 17 years for my youngest to hit the age of majority.

Just going to put a lot of contingencies in place just in case a lot of bad things happen over the years.

 

[Blacksmith101]

Not a lawyer and don't pretend to be one. I think it would be wise for any registered, regulated, or "Banned" firearms that the government already knows about to be specifically listed in your will with it's intended distribution according to your wishes. Estate law seems to take a very strong view of dead peoples wishes and works hard to see they are carried out, overturning a properly drawn will is difficult. Interesting question could a will be written so I leave my AR-15 SN XXXXXX to my minor child Jane Doakes to be held in trust by John Doe until she reaches her majority. (Of course worded in proper legalese)

Now if I had some legally owned things they did not know about I would probably distribute them myself before death as I wished.

 

[Biggfoot44]

Hers's the kernal of fire behind all the smoke.

A person , being a single person household become deceased , and the Police are at the scene to investagate. All the firearms will be swept up "for safekeeping" . Anyone subsequently making a claim for them will have to provide "proof of ownership" among other hoops.

( Long and indirect story , but Mrs Biggfoot had a tangental involvement in such in late '13 )

 

[Ab_Normal]

I already gave my possessions to my children before the laws took effect so I wouldn't have to worry about it later. Now I am just waiting for them to get to the point where I think they may not be prohibited from possessing them before I transfer my possessions to them.

 

[K31]

Please ask your friend to provide the statute or regulation that the instructor gave as the foundation for this.

It was taken from The Instructor's Article 55 manual usually referred to simply as A55.

If you hear an instructor say he pulled it from his A55 this is what he means.

 

[Ab_Normal]

It was taken from The Instructor's Article 55 manual usually referred to simply as A55.

If you hear an instructor say he pulled it from his A55 this is what he means.

I'm stealing borrowing that and I'm not giving you credit.

ETA - OOPS! I had to correct the above statement so I don't become a prohibited person.

 

[Ab_Normal]

Funny, when I google this term, one of the first links is to *this* thread. Is "The Instructors Article 55 manual" a real thing, or something where I can just write a bunch of stuff I decide should be "taught" and then call it MY Article 55 manual?

If it's a real thing, does anyone know where it can be obtained? Thanks.

I think your sarcasm meter is low on coffee.

 

[K31]

Funny, when I google this term, one of the first links is to *this* thread. Is "The Instructors Article 55 manual" a real thing, or something where I can just write a bunch of stuff I decide should be "taught" and then call it MY Article 55 manual?

If it's a real thing, does anyone know where it can be obtained? Thanks.

If you have a copy of Articles, Numbered Uniformed Statutes you can obtain it from yours, just like this instructor apparently did.

 

[TTMD]

It was taken from The Instructor's Article 55 manual usually referred to simply as A55.

If you hear an instructor say he pulled it from his A55 this is what he means.

I think your sarcasm meter is low on coffee.

If you have a copy of Articles, Numbered Uniformed Statutes you can obtain it from yours, just like this instructor apparently did.

Hopefully my morning fog regarding the implementation of regulations pulled from one's A55, has brightened everyone's morning. You're all very welcome. :-)

 

[TheSubieNinja7]

When did Towson get a law school? lol

They didn't, but their mascot makes for a better avatar than UB Law's.

That section would be a stretch to have a guardian appointed to "protect" or "manage" assets that consist of regulated firearms. Essentially, that statute is in place to prevent a young child from getting his/her hands on a large sum of money via inheritance. Kind of like the Uniform Gifts/Transfers to Minors Act.

The guardian would still be holding the firearms in trust. This really needs some serious research to see if a regular trust can hold firearms in it. I spent an entire evening last summer trying to figure this out and came to the conclusion that a trust cannot legally own anything but NFA items, but I didn't document my research since it was only for myself. Might delve further into this subject at the end of April. It really would be nice if a trust could own a banned firearm for the benefit of the designated beneficiaries within the trust, but I don't think that is going to fly.

Considering that this section specifically cross references the public safety article mentioning who could possess regulated firearms in MD, one would think it's at least somewhat relevant to the topic at hand.

Regardless, I think it's clear that there is no statutory basis for the notion that MD automatically gets your regged firearms when you die. Plus, one would think that there would be serious grounds for a replevin action by the executor/administrator if a portion of someone's estate automatically escheated to the state before probate.