rumor: ATF to do away with CLEO sign off on form 4..

jmira · Dec 4, 2011

From Griffin Armament's FB page:

Unofficial/secondhand: According to NFATCA at the recent SAR show, the ATF should be dropping the CLEO sign off individual form 4 transfer requirement in the coming year, but the local LEO's would still receive a copy of the form, so people who like their privacy may still benefit from use the trust or corporate transfers which will continue to be unreported AFAIK.

•NFATCA submitted a proposal to ATF several years ago to remove the CLEO signature requirement from NFA Forms
•Proposal was reviewed and massaged based upon ATF comments
•Proposal was reviewed and approved by ATF
•ATF submitted the formal request to DOJ
•DOJ reviewed and returned to ATF with requests for changes and clarifications
•ATF made changes and resubmitted to DOJ
•DOJ went through formalized review process
•DOJ *approved* request and returned to ATF
•ATF entered regulation formulation phase (writing the reg)
•Regulation phase completed
•Regulation submitted to OMB
•OMB initiates formal process for implementation
The formal process includes posting in the federal register, invitation for commentary, proposed new forms, etc. Count on anywhere from 90 to 270 days.

wreckdiver · Dec 4, 2011

That would be nice. MSP took longer than the feds on my last transfer.

zombiehunter · Dec 4, 2011

It's a huge waste of time/money/gas. Why is it in Pikesville? I STILL haven't made my way up there for my paperwork and I paid a month ago

IMBLITZVT · Dec 5, 2011

Has this been around for a year at this point? Would be great but until they actually do it... I am not holding my breath. I have heard people have called the ATF about it and its news to them...

yellowfin · Dec 5, 2011

While nice, I think the bigger problem by far is the single person owner/possession limit which pretty much requires a trust if you're married and/or have kids and relatives.

IMBLITZVT · Dec 5, 2011

yellowfin said:
...the single person owner/possession limit ...

What are you talking about? I have no clue? What limit is there on anything?

LAD3DER · Dec 5, 2011

While this would be nice I would worry about the increase in requests bogging down the ATF process more than it already is. Hopefully they would use common sense and hire more examiners, though that would be a surprise.

IMBLITZVT · Dec 5, 2011

I mean I have to wonder how much time it really takes... you know they just sit on them and that there is not actually a 6 month back log.

Anyway, I suggest the priority goes: MGs, DDs, Suppressors, SBSs, SBRs, AOWs since you can usually get the last three in none NFA form... So they can wait the longest!

rsideout · Dec 5, 2011

IMBLITZVT said:
Anyway, I suggest the priority goes: MGs, DDs, Suppressors, SBSs, SBRs, AOWs since you can usually get the last three in none NFA form... So they can wait the longest!

M, Don't move suppressors to 3rd place behind DD's, unless you really want to get on my sh*t list! :evilgrin3

Hopalong · Dec 5, 2011

IMBLITZVT said:
What are you talking about? I have no clue? What limit is there on anything?

I think he's referring to the fact that each NFA item has to have a single, specific owner, be it an individual or a trust/corp./etc.

boricuamaximus · Dec 5, 2011

if they do away w. fingerprints and id's wed be in business.

IlikeNFA · Dec 5, 2011

if they do away w. fingerprints and id's wed be in business.

They already have...its called a trust :irule:

IMBLITZVT · Dec 6, 2011

Hopalong said:
I think he's referring to the fact that each NFA item has to have a single, specific owner, be it an individual or a trust/corp./etc.

Ha! I do see understand now. That "possession limit" part really confused me. Yeah it does suck that the gun is tied to you.

r, sorry man, DDs go before Suppressors. There are not many DDs moving around and they are just cooler than Suppressors, sorry! A day with the best suppressor in the world can't touch The day I get to fire a Lahti anti tank rifle. Lets face it the auto shotguns don't really count! Lets face it you don't ask what kind of Muffler is on a Muscle car...

One day I would not mind getting into the DD world. I would love to pick up a nice T-Gewehr at some point! But this would take the crown of all DDs if you ask me: http://www.securityarms.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1989 A 13mm Maxim would have utterly destroyed those WWI tanks! And now we know where we get the M2HB from!

ericoak · Dec 6, 2011

Can't we all just get along and throw a suppressor on that 13mm maxim so we have a suppressed DD MG?

I went the trust route so I can skip the whole prints/Ids and Pikesville wait. I figured if I buy around 10 NFA items in my life the money for the trust will be made up for all the prints/pictures I didn't have to send or mail. And then when you consider the wait and the fact that you don't even have to tell MSP about your suppressors, it was a no brainer.

IMBLITZVT said:
Ha! I do see understand now. That "possession limit" part really confused me. Yeah it does suck that the gun is tied to you.

r, sorry man, DDs go before Suppressors. There are not many DDs moving around and they are just cooler than Suppressors, sorry! A day with the best suppressor in the world can't touch The day I get to fire a Lahti anti tank rifle. Lets face it the auto shotguns don't really count! Lets face it you don't ask what kind of Muffler is on a Muscle car...

One day I would not mind getting into the DD world. I would love to pick up a nice T-Gewehr at some point! But this would take the crown of all DDs if you ask me: http://www.securityarms.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1989 A 13mm Maxim would have utterly destroyed those WWI tanks! And now we know where we get the M2HB from!

Hopalong · Dec 7, 2011

ericoak said:
Can't we all just get along and throw a suppressor on that 13mm maxim so we have a suppressed DD MG?

Side note, in that situation would you need tax stamps for both a DD and an MG or just one of them? I know that once something is stamped as an MG it does not need a separate tax stamp for AOW or SBR/SBS. Just curious.

rcpd34 · Dec 7, 2011

Saw this posted on another site:

http://www.theoutdoorwire.com/archived/2011-12-05_tow.html

Scroll way down.

Inigoes · Dec 7, 2011

IMBLITZVT said:
I mean I have to wonder how much time it really takes... you know they just sit on them and that there is not actually a 6 month back log.

Anyway, I suggest the priority goes: MGs, DDs, Suppressors, SBSs, SBRs, AOWs since you can usually get the last three in none NFA form... So they can wait the longest!

rsideout said:
M, Don't move suppressors to 3rd place behind DD's, unless you really want to get on my sh*t list!

Keep AOWs from last. There is no way you can have a KEG12 in non-NFA form :mad54:

yellowfin · Dec 7, 2011

IMBLITZVT said:
What are you talking about? I have no clue? What limit is there on anything?

If NFA items are purchased as an individual, rather than as a trust or corporation, possession is restricted to that individual or at least in that person's presence only. It would be FAR more worthwhile to have gotten rid of that stipulation or expanded it at very least to spouses and immediate household rather than just the CLEO signoff.

IMBLITZVT · Dec 8, 2011

yellowfin said:
If NFA items are purchased as an individual, rather than as a trust or corporation, possession is restricted to that individual or at least in that person's presence only. It would be FAR more worthwhile to have gotten rid of that stipulation or expanded it at very least to spouses and immediate household rather than just the CLEO signoff.

Yeah someone else already cleared it up. I thought you were saying there was a limit to how many an individual could own. I agree with what is above.

Nope AOWs last as they are the least worth having IMHO.

Yes a suppressor is another tax stamp even if put on a MG. MP5SD is a perfect example of a gun that must have two stamps.

ericoak · Dec 8, 2011

Hopalong said:
Side note, in that situation would you need tax stamps for both a DD and an MG or just one of them? I know that once something is stamped as an MG it does not need a separate tax stamp for AOW or SBR/SBS. Just curious.

There was a 40mm DD MG on subguns for $140,000, registered during the Amnesty. It said it would require a stamp for both a MG and DD.

I read an ATF letter that suppressors permanently attached to the receiver of an MG do not need to be registered, but that could have been overturned.

Found the letter. Depends on if the silencer is integral:
http://www.nfaoa.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=237&sid=3ad13be8fe65b0cf9d090012d775e44a

rumor: ATF to do away with CLEO sign off on form 4..

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

VA Rocks.

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Pro 2A Gastronome

Ultimate Member

Member

Ultimate Member

Senior Member

Man of Many Nicknames

Ultimate Member

Certified Gear Queer

Ultimate Member

don't drop Aboma on me

Man of Many Nicknames

Peoples Republic Maryland

Head'n for the hills

Pro 2A Gastronome

Ultimate Member

don't drop Aboma on me

Users who are viewing this thread

Log in

Forum statistics