The roster has officially gone full-stupid

[erwos]

Latest announced updates to the handgun roster:
http://www.dsd.state.md.us/MDRegister/4208/Assembled.htm#_Toc416770630

I literally cannot believe this idiocy.

First, they're approving the Phoenix Arms HP25A. This gun is a blatant Saturday Night Special - that is to say, the kind of gun that the roster was put in place to NOT approve.

Second, they've decided that a MP5 reverse stretch pistol is now an assault pistol, despite the fact that it is NOT PARTS COMPATIBLE with the SP89! This joins the Uzi 22lr pistol and Bushmaster AR pistols list of complete screwups on the roster. What makes it double-plus stupid is that they approved the POF-5 without any such caveat, despite it being THE SAME GUN.

When is MSI going to spend some resources interceding on this issue? Whomever the hell is giving the "copy of" information to the roster board needs to be removed and replaced with someone competent who gives a damn.

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

So, my question, aside from the emotion that frustration produces...is this: what logic or reason might they be following to produce their decisions???

Clearly, they're running a process that produces a result set. I see the objection as one where we fail to see consistency OR logic in their results.

Maybe we can focus on getting inside their OODA loop. To understand them is to "defeat" them. Make no mistake, they can be understood. While we might not like the answer, the truth is out there somewhere.

Trying to get/determine interim accountability, logic or rationale might not be time well spent. Doesn't mean we shouldn't try though.

 

[StantonCree]

Hahahaha ha they approved the Phoenix? Awesome news!! I always wanted to wasted 75 bucks at a gun shop and come home with more then Accessories and some 123 batteries.

 

[erwos]

Hahahaha ha they approved the Phoenix? Awesome news!! I always wanted to wasted 75 bucks at a gun shop and come home with more then Accessories and some 123 batteries.

My brain just exploded when I saw that. At least the anti-gunners could claim the roster had a legitimate purpose back when they weren't approving SNSs... now it's just a damned joke.

 

[DC-W]

When is MSI going to spend some resources interceding on this issue? Whomever the hell is giving the "copy of" information to the roster board needs to be removed and replaced with someone competent who gives a damn.

They've taken the MSP to task before.
There's also FFLs that keenly follow these things.

Relax.

 

[Biggfoot44]

Eh, as much as we all love to look down on them, the current Pheonix has evolved a long way from a first generation Raven. If the current production has a high enough melting point, it may well have met the minimum standards.

 

[smdub]

First, they're approving the Phoenix Arms HP25A. This gun is a blatant Saturday Night Special - that is to say, the kind of gun that the roster was put in place to NOT approve.

The TTAG review isn't favorable but said it cycled all the rounds he fed it. Criticized the operation of the dual safeties, slide bite, and had a bent mag that wouldn't load the full 9(?) rounds but it still worked w/ everything he fed it. If the gun presented to the roster board safely worked why shouldn't it be approved? Price has nothing to do w/ it. A $50 gun if safe in operation and won't blow up in the users hands should be approved.

Second, they've decided that a MP5 reverse stretch pistol is now an assault pistol, despite the fact that it is NOT PARTS COMPATIBLE with the SP89! ... What makes it double-plus stupid is that they approved the POF-5 without any such caveat, despite it being THE SAME GUN.

Im guessing someone would need to petition to get this corrected?

 

[erwos]

They've taken the MSP to task before.
There's also FFLs that keenly follow these things.

Relax.

You mean like how they fixed those other mistakes on the roster I listed off? Oh, wait, they didn't.

The TTAG review isn't favorable but said it cycled all the rounds he fed it. Criticized the operation of the dual safeties, slide bite, and had a bent mag that wouldn't load the full 9(?) rounds but it still worked w/ everything he fed it. If the gun presented to the roster board safely worked why shouldn't it be approved? Price has nothing to do w/ it. A $50 gun if safe in operation and won't blow up in the users hands should be approved.

That may be so, but the original point of the roster was to disapprove them because they were perceived to be cheap crime guns with no valid legitimate use. This is the same reason you don't see, say, the Kel-Tec P32 on the roster.

Im guessing someone would need to petition to get this corrected?

The problem runs so much deeper than this, and needs to be solved at the source.

 

[NateIU10]

The issue is that there is no way to petition a "comments" section that the Board doesn't have the statutory authority to make anyway.

I wouldn't be concerned until I see a disapproved, though.

 

[71Chevelle427]

Why is the Springfield Armory XD-45 Mod 2 on the list?

 

[traveller]

First, they're approving the Phoenix Arms HP25A. This gun is a blatant Saturday Night Special - that is to say, the kind of gun that the roster was put in place to NOT approve.

By getting it through the roster, someone demonstrated how absurd the roster is.

They approve the Phoenix but initially disapproved the Glock 42. Makes perfect sense.

 

[5.56blaster]

It looks like they did approve a gun from Atlantic Arms that looks like an MP5 K. Or am I looking at the info from MSP wrong? Atlantic Arms AA 89 KFS.

 

[ironpony]

Thank goodness we have a 2A friendly Governor.

 

[erwos]

They approve the Phoenix but initially disapproved the Glock 42. Makes perfect sense.

The Glock 42 story was more of a one-off with them. (I am not at liberty to disclose the story I was told about it, unfortunately. SECRET SQUIRRELS UNITE.)

 

[Name Taken]

Who submitted the FNS9C? Why didn't they put on the petition the FNS40C as well?

I know you can submit several calibers and "similar" firearms under the same petition with varying calibers.

Look at the 229 submission...which was submitted the way it was because the Sig called the 229 15 different names.

 

[SigNerd]

It looks like they did approve a gun from Atlantic Arms that looks like an MP5 K. Or am I looking at the info from MSP wrong? Atlantic Arms AA 89 KFS.

The comment for that line says otherwise: '"Assault Pistol" Not for sale to general public. Purchase by US Gov, Armed Forces, Law Enforce. Agencies ONLY'

 

[smdub]

That may be so, but the original point of the roster was to disapprove them because they were perceived to be cheap crime guns with no valid legitimate use. This is the same reason you don't see, say, the Kel-Tec P32 on the roster.

But the law says they have to approve if "well-made" right (MD legal definition)? I've never held one in my hand but the TTAG article says it looks very well made. I thought just about anything submitted to the board that worked (and had a trigger guard) was approved. Googling says 98% of guns submitted are approved though I don't know where that % comes from. During one of the recent prior reviews, wasn't there something like a HK/Glock that was disapproved for jamming? Was approved the second go round because they submitted a working sample.

Out of curiosity, had anyone even submitted a P-32? Is there any way to check to see what has been rejected? I see the nearly identical P-3AT is approved.

 

[5.56blaster]

The comment for that line says otherwise: '"Assault Pistol" Not for sale to general public. Purchase by US Gov, Armed Forces, Law Enforce. Agencies ONLY'

Got it! Could not open my screen far enough to see that. Maryland really sucks!

 

[Schipperke]

Latest announced updates to the handgun roster:
http://www.dsd.state.md.us/MDRegister/4208/Assembled.htm#_Toc416770630

I literally cannot believe this idiocy.

First, they're approving the Phoenix Arms HP25A. This gun is a blatant Saturday Night Special - that is to say, the kind of gun that the roster was put in place to NOT approve.

The safety system takes a bit getting use to. It will shoot any day. Why wouldn't it be approved. Is it more dangerous than other 25acp? I wouldn't carry this thing over a Bobcat or Bauer if you want 25acp. Do other states approve/disapprove pistols for sale? I know this is a low cost pistol, is that a reason to ban it?

 

[erwos]

The safety system takes a bit getting use to. It will shoot any day. Why wouldn't it be approved. Is it more dangerous than other 25acp? I wouldn't carry this thing over a Bobcat or Bauer if you want 25acp. Do other states approve/disapprove pistols for sale? I know this is a low cost pistol, is that a reason to ban it?

You're missing the historical context. The roster board was created to ban inexpensive cheaply made pistols (Saturday Night Specials), such as the HP25A. Other states have laws that don't let you sell pistols with a low enough melting point. Focusing on whether this thing is 100% safe or not is missing the point. You'll notice the complete lack of other ultra-cheap .25ACP and .32ACP guns on the roster... that's not a coincidence.