Kolbe v O'Malley being Appealed to CA4

[dblas]

How can you just "not answer"? This is a question from a judge in direct cross-examination.

It wasn't cross examination, it was direct questions, and he eventually answered the question after throwing out two or three answers to other issues.

Justice Agee finally pinned him down.

 

[dblas]

Those of you in the know, please post a link to the audio when it's available. This whole case is ridiculous, from the enactment to the lower court ruling. At a minimum, I truly believe that the 4th Circuit has no choice but to remand the case for further fact finding and deliberation. Even under the intermediate scrutiny test, the state has completely failed to meet its burden of showing that it tried to achieve the end through less restrictive means. If the 4th Circuit were to uphold the District Court's ruling, it would really turn the law on its head. And if and when they do remand, I hope they appropriately chastise the District Court for completely failing to do its duty.

Actually, there is nothing to remand or further fact finding at this point, they just need to rule in our favor that the AWB portion and the Magazine capacity portion are unconstitutional and thus null and void.

 

[dblas]

If the State conceded that a Glock with a 15 round magazine is protected, didn't it necessarily concede that the law is unconstitutional?

The discussion finally got around to any semi automatic handgun, regardless of the magazine capacity, "let's take the magazine capacity out of the equation, would a semi-automatic handgun be constitutionally protected?"

Fader, reluctantly answered yes, with his new boss (Frosh) sitting at the table behind him.

Really a no win situation for Fader to be in.

 

[swinokur]

So here is a question that maybe cannot be answered yet. If we were to win, would the now banned firearms be regulated again or just not illegal? And what of copycats?

I know I may be premature. Just musing.

 

[dblas]

I believe it was Sweeney, the attorney representing the State.

Regarding the post about remanding it back down to the lower court, I personally don't want that. Let this court make it's decision, hopefully a win for us, and see what the State (Frosh as AG) does.

Sweeney represents us, and very well I might add, Fader represented the state.

 

[Inigoes]

So here is a question that maybe cannot be answered yet. If we were to win, would the now banned firearms be regulated again or just not illegal? And what of copycats?

I know I may be premature. Just musing.

If the law is found unconstitutional, then the banned list goes bye-byes

SB281 obsolesced the previous law.

 

[dblas]

So, the good Baron was in attendance trying to intimidate us or the Court?

(like either would work......)

Nah, no intimidation at all, and his body language to some of the questions was less than "comfortable", I would have like to have seen his facial expression on some of those questions.

 

[frogman68]

If the law is found unconstitutional, then the banned list goes bye-byes

SB281 obsolesced the previous law.

so then all sporting rifles will be cash and carry?
If the decision comes out after 4/13 they can't do anything till next year unless Hogan calls them back?

 

[Inigoes]

so then all sporting rifles will be cash and carry?
If the decision comes out after 4/13 they can't do anything till next year unless Hogan calls them back?

Not just sporting rifles, all those EBRs that have been feared for years.

UZIs (the 29 inch law will be tossed also) with folding stocks will be cash and carry

 

[dblas]

Could the court go one step further and say that the whole Maryland Regulated Gun List (AKA Handgun Roster) is unconstitutional?

No, that is not at issue in this case.

 

[frogman68]

Not just sporting rifles, all those EBRs that have been feared for years.

UZIs (the 29 inch law will be tossed also) with folding stockes will be cash and carry

same page but all those fall under sporting rifles for me

Seriously what can Frosh do as AG if this goes the way of my scenario? What can he interpent the law to say?

 

[esqappellate]

Sweeney represents us, and very well I might add, Fader represented the state.

Can't wait to hear the tape. That will tel me a lot.

 

[Mr H]

same page but all those fall under sporting rifles for me

Seriously what can Frosh do as AG if this goes the way of my scenario? What can he interpent the law to say?

His first step, I think, would be to ask for a stay pending appeal.

So... 2 weeks.

 

[Inigoes]

same page but all those fall under sporting rifles for me

Seriously what can Frosh do as AG if this goes the way of my scenario? What can he interpent the law to say?

If SB281 will be found unconstitutional, there is no law to interpret.

The only things Frosh can do are: request an appeal, and/or a stay.

 

[dblas]

Judge Blake's decision was a punt. she took all the state's arguments at face value, and ignored all of the plantiff's arguments. she basically said "not it" and passed the case along. her ruling was so short and so devoid of any reasoning, that it demands another look by the 4th circuit by that fact alone.
the fact that she ignored all the judicial precendent in Chester, and both of the majority opinions from Chester are hearing kolbe's appeal, are just icing on the cake.

IMO Blake figured either side would appeal, so just gave it the boot out of her court. Her reasoning is pretty bad IMO but I think she just wanted to get rid of it.

We knew going into the Circuit court that she was probably going to rule against us, and she was advised that is would be appealed to the 4th Circuit regardless of her ruling. So she accommodated both sides by expediting the case and getting to the 4th Circuit as fast as possible.

Is that good jurisprudence? I would say no. But it furthers our goals in a quicker fashion and that is ultimately SCOTUS. Which this case will be appealed to regardless of the ruling of the 4th Circuit. The only question is, will there be a beef detour through en banc or not.

 

[dblas]

So here is a question that maybe cannot be answered yet. If we were to win, would the now banned firearms be regulated again or just not illegal? And what of copycats?

I know I may be premature. Just musing.

If we prevail, the AWB and magazine capacity law are gone and those two provisions of FSA 2013 go back to what they were pre Oct 2013. Regulated, 77R, 7 day wait, no copycat listing.

20 round magazines.

 

[dblas]

If the law is found unconstitutional, then the banned list goes bye-byes

SB281 obsolesced the previous law.

If found unconstitutional the goes back to what it was pre-Oct 3013.

 

[Mr H]

You forgot the blood in the streets.

Oh... wait....

 

[Applehd]

Silly rainbow and unicorn question... Couldn't Hogan put his hand on Frosh's shoulder and say..."Son, there will be no need to appeal that decision..."?

 

[Inigoes]

If we prevail, the AWB and magazine capacity law are gone and those two provisions of FSA 2013 go back to what they were pre Oct 2013. Regulated, 77R, 7 day wait, no copycat listing.

20 round magazines.

I doubt that, the legislature deliberately struck provisions of the old law for SB281.

It would be up to the legislature to reenact them by passing another law.