VERY Disturbing MSI Email

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    Huckleberry

    No One of Consequence
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 19, 2007
    23,099
    Severn & Lewes
    I suddenly have this urge to purchase ammunition from Walmart. And let them have the address on my DL. I'd love to see them try to attempt that play.

    God I love being active duty! I knew there was a reason I kept the parents' place as home of record!

    Unless they pay a visit to dear old Mom and Dad at O'Dark-30 looking for you.

    "Yea, Mom. I'm real sorry that the state trooper put you in a choke hold. And I'm sorry they maced Dad. Is Sparky, OK? How long did the vet say for GSW to heal?"

    That'll make for a fun Thanksgiving or Christmas at home.
     

    Bill

    Active Member
    Mar 14, 2008
    382
    Ocean City, MD
    Don't buy from dealers who cave to the State Police's silly "guidelines". Simple as that.

    More or less, this gentleman purchased ammunition from someone who recorded his purchase and personal information in one of their "log manuals".
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,081
    St Mary's County
    I received a note from a LEO who wishes to remain anonymous that this may be bigger than it seems. This is not an isolated incident (the last victim that this person is aware of was a 94 year old woman), this is just the only one that was publicly reported. The LEO is fairly certain that this isn't the MSP Licensing Division, but rather it is some sort of new Firearms Enforcement Division created by the same MSP bureaucrat that has made it clear that he cares nothing about civil rights or guarantees of law.

    The first thing that I urge every member to do is to not buy ammunition from any vendor that records ID information. And make sure that you tell the store management exactly why you will not comply with their unreasonable and unnecessary requirements to purchase ammo. Urge every shooter that you know that may not be a member here to do the same, as the MSP database is only useful to them if it contains data. We can stop the flow of data.

    Second, don't let this issue die. Contact your legislator and express your concern about this issue. See if they can get this issue added to the list of complaints on the upcoming MSP spy hearings.

    Third, be prepared. The way I understand it, if my anonymous LEO's tip is accurate, the probability of getting a visit for doing nothing wrong just went up exponentially. Make sure everyone in your household knows their rights in regard to a visit by police. I gave my wife the "don't volunteer any info / no warrant = no entry / slam the door on their face and don't open it if no warrant / if warrant, leave the house" speech last night just in case. I hope that it never comes to that, but after some of the stuff that I have learned recently, I'll just say that my paranoia meter is pegging at 10, and I'm not usually like that.

    This is a very big deal, and we cannot let it fall by the wayside. We need to come up with a strategy for bringing this to the public's attention, so if anyone has any suggestions then please speak up.
     

    Half-cocked

    Senior Meatbag
    Mar 14, 2006
    23,937
    Ditto... Sounds like borderline black-helicopter stuff to me. Before I start to believe MSP are conducting Nazi-style nighttime raids, using KGB-style surveillance on our own citizens, I would like to see some credible evidence.
     

    hughmon

    Ultimate Member
    Mar 5, 2008
    1,630
    Putting together a good document that of this incident that can be cut and pasted into an email to our representatives, and other cases would be a big help

    The MSP spying case, and the Berwyn Heights case have been all over the news so much that if they do not already know about it, they either could care less, are against our constitutional rights, or are too dim to understand and should be voted out.

    What about the possibility of a class action suite? Could the ACLU actually be useful on this one?
     

    Drmsparks

    Old School Rifleman
    Jun 26, 2007
    8,441
    PG county
    Let's get busy- we can start hitting them with FOIA requests-

    If we can prove this and document multiple events, this will go national.

    Where should we start?
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,081
    St Mary's County
    Ditto... Sounds like borderline black-helicopter stuff to me. Before I start to believe MSP are conducting Nazi-style nighttime raids, using KGB-style surveillance on our own citizens, I would like to see some credible evidence.

    You are right. I've got it from a good source that it most certainly is happening, but we need something to show the public. Unfortunately the press will most likely not report on this issue since it only involves ignorant gun owners :rolleyes:, so we need to do the work ourselves. I'm going to see what I can do about contacting the guy in La Plata to see what I can learn.
     

    Norton

    NRA Endowment Member, Rifleman
    Staff member
    Admin
    Moderator
    May 22, 2005
    122,819
    I'm going to see if I can get in contact with the original letter writer.

    Give me 24 hours before we do anything else.
     

    Cadet08

    Gone
    Nov 13, 2006
    496
    A few people need to get together and buy every piece of ammunition they have from stores that record the ammo sales. Then they need to invite the press eg Lou Dobbs, Fox News to come and wait and record the police and do there media thing. or better yet have someone with a home security system and cameras all over the property do this and then contact the press.
    If this happens enough and the honorable MSP (yes they are honorable, this is one of those situations where good people are ordered to do dishonorable things) starts to look like Omalie's personal KGB. Then hopefully this will stop
     

    Norton

    NRA Endowment Member, Rifleman
    Staff member
    Admin
    Moderator
    May 22, 2005
    122,819
    I'm going to see what I can do about contacting the guy in La Plata to see what I can learn.

    Don,

    If you get hold of him before me, I'll be willing to drive down and meet with you guys.
     

    Kharn

    Ultimate Member
    Mar 9, 2008
    3,568
    Hazzard County
    Hm, I'm kinda suprised I haven't recieved a visit based on how much 9mm I was buying from Walmart when they were recording info and the fact that I never volunteered to register my 9mm. :innocent0

    I dont open the door after dark, so all they'll get at 1am is "If you dont have a warrant, come back after sunrise like a civilized person."
     

    Drmsparks

    Old School Rifleman
    Jun 26, 2007
    8,441
    PG county
    If there is a special unit shouldn't we be able to find out about it (and who is in charge) through a FOIA request? I'm sure in light of everything that has been going on (CointellMD and Berwynn,) some papers would run with what we can find out...
     

    IronicEnigma

    Active Member
    Apr 6, 2008
    235
    Abingdon
    Found this and it appears that AG Gansler or his office has some knowledge of what is going on:

    "Attorney General Gansler’s Firearms Trafficking Unit, in cooperation with the Firearms Licensing and Registration Division and the Firearms Enforcement Section of the Maryland State Police, participates in the seizure of hundreds of firearms every year, and performs hundreds of traces of recovered firearms. In its effort to eliminate illegal purchases, sales, transfers and possessions of firearms, the Firearms Trafficking Unit investigates a substantial number of applications to purchase regulated firearms–resulting in the Unit bringing charges against a number of individuals who do not have the right to possess regulated firearms."

    "With the cooperation of several gun dealers across the state, the Firearms Trafficking Unit has also initiated a program that maintains ammunition logs that include identification information of purchasers of ammunition. Review of these logs results in the investigation of individuals who are prohibited from possessing regulated firearms and who are believed to have purchased ammunition which could be used in such firearms. The Firearm Trafficking Unit’s continuing investigations have led to charges and arrests of individuals and the seizure of handguns from those that violate the law."

    Full link here: MD Attorney General Law Enforcement

    Also with Norton's lead, this is potentially Gene Paluzzi's latest information, including email...and seems like he got a promotion to Lieutenant...Lt. Gene Paluzzi.
     

    SigMatt

    Ultimate Member
    Mar 17, 2007
    1,181
    Shores of the Bay, MD
    Found this and it appears that AG Gansler or his office has some knowledge of what is going on:

    "With the cooperation of several gun dealers across the state, the Firearms Trafficking Unit has also initiated a program that maintains ammunition logs that include identification information of purchasers of ammunition. Review of these logs results in the investigation of individuals who are prohibited from possessing regulated firearms and who are believed to have purchased ammunition which could be used in such firearms. The Firearm Trafficking Unit’s continuing investigations have led to charges and arrests of individuals and the seizure of handguns from those that violate the law."

    Full link here: MD Attorney General Law Enforcement

    Emphasis mine.

    Can someone help me out here? How is this legal? Can any unit in the MSP impose such a policy on the sales of ammunition and/or firearms in the absence of legislation permitting them to do so? It sounds like they are making up policy as they see fit and then because they have done so, given it the force of law by their say-so.

    An explanation of how this is not an abuse under the color of law by someone more knowledgeable than I would be appreciated. Because all I see right now is an outrageous violation of our rights, specifically 4th and 5th Amendment.

    Matt
     

    Drmsparks

    Old School Rifleman
    Jun 26, 2007
    8,441
    PG county
    Sounds like a cross check of warrants and registered firearms sales and addresses may have popped the LaPlata case due to the brothers bench warrant.

    I'm also curious....isn't checking these things why we have a waiting period to start with?

    Are they retroactively searching based on name and address when new warrants come out? Sounds like a spin off of the federal data mining projects...

    I'd be interested in hearing about the other cases to see if there are any similarities....

    If all these cases follow the issuance of warrants how do we stand?

    Continuing with IronicEnigma's post....

    Following those links we have a very disturbed AG....

    http://www.oag.state.md.us/Press/guns.pdf

    What a total bunch of B*llsh*t!!!!:mad54:
     
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