Two generations away from losing 2A

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  • MDFF2008

    Active Member
    Aug 12, 2008
    24,053
    I think the GOP is missing opportunities with young people. Huge ones. A lot of my friends, even my liberal friends, are concerned about taxes. (of course there are the 10% who will pay anything the govt asks) but a lot of them are concerned about taxes, Social security, employment, economic security, areas the Dems struggle in.

    But then they hear the GOP start social issue ranting, and they vote Democrat. And these are by no means people like the woman who complained she spent thousands of dollars on birth control. Open the tent more on social issues, get rid of the people who make ignorant comments about rape, and I think you could make inroads with younger people.
     

    Brooklyn

    I stand with John Locke.
    Jan 20, 2013
    13,095
    Plan D? Not worth the hassle.
    I think the GOP is missing opportunities with young people. Huge ones. A lot of my friends, even my liberal friends, are concerned about taxes. (of course there are the 10% who will pay anything the govt asks) but a lot of them are concerned about taxes, Social security, employment, economic security, areas the Dems struggle in.

    But then they hear the GOP start social issue ranting, and they vote Democrat. And these are by no means people like the woman who complained she spent thousands of dollars on birth control. Open the tent more on social issues, get rid of the people who make ignorant comments about rape, and I think you could make inroads with younger people.

    Or these same democrats could work to save the country within the democratic party. Its ok if you want to be a democrat on social issues why not push your party into sanity on economic ones -- we would all be better off then I think.


    The republicans can not save the country alone-- in fact if the democrats stay hard left we are doomed anyway..


    So pick the party you like best and make it see reason. I am working within the republican party right now, because I think its the best hope, but it would be great if we had libertarian wing of the the D party as well. Imaine THE GOVERNING COLATIOTION that could form.


    Come to think of it --- why is there no libertarian wing of the Democratic party? --- it would seem a perfect fit for a party that backs civil rights so nosily...
     

    RightNYer

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    May 5, 2013
    489
    Because

    1. it makes you sound like its what you want not a worst case to be avoided
    2. it makes you sound very naive
    3. it will give your opposition license to ignore you and think you a nut-- and if you look at the tea party experience you will see that its not wise to give them any help in that regard
    4. Civil war is very messy and could in fact fail-- most revolutions in fact fail-- the hardliners in the military step up and take control-- history suggests that if you want liberty fomenting unrest is the best way to not get it.
    5. Economic pressure can be just as effective --- slower but in the end more likely to succeed-- less risk of authoritarian blow back
    6. THINK CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION. I still think the courts will work and the young ( the 10% ) can be made to see reason, but if not the next step is a CC not a war .


    I think young are full of energy and you are likely a patriot, but talk of civil war is foolish at this time.. what we are heading for is a CC. hopefully before the economic crisis not after..


    Fight smart and we can win this.. Its not nearly over-- every day I make fun of young people and every day I start a young person on the path to cluefulness .. I do it my making them communicate with me -- I was here first, I have experience of value to share -- my first task is to get the young to admit that -- otherwise I talk to the wall.


    And the same goes for me. I had the honor last weekend of addressing a Veteran of WWII -- that is he spoke and I listened .. :) I told him I was not going to let his country go to hell -- not on my watch..

    I'd love to avoid civil war! But how is a constitutional convention remotely feasible, when the Hispanic population (a very statist, freedom hating group, on the whole) is growing rapidly, with no signs of letting up? A CC will not lead to a constitution like the one we want, but a "social justice" type constitution.
     

    Mark75H

    HVAC Expert
    Industry Partner
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 25, 2011
    14,799
    Outside the Gates
    6. THINK CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION. I still think the courts will work and the young ( the 10% ) can be made to see reason, but if not the next step is a CC not a war ..

    This will work until states start to ignore the courts and declare their own law ... oh, wait ...
     

    ELEMENT94

    Wild eyed pistol waver.
    Sep 23, 2007
    487
    It will happen by 2035. General public does not care, and pro 2A folks are crazy.
     

    Brooklyn

    I stand with John Locke.
    Jan 20, 2013
    13,095
    Plan D? Not worth the hassle.
    This will work until states start to ignore the courts and declare their own law ... oh, wait ...

    That's all part of the CC. We can dissolve the union By CC. Its the peaceful safety value that the founders built in.. Back then states were sovereign and did have the power to make law, coin money and even make war. The cotus did away with some of those powers--- the safety value was the amendment process and the CC process.

    If needed we can peacefully dissolve the union -- i find that reminding liberals ogf that forces a strange expression of constipation to flash across their faces --- priceless..

    They are trying to bait us into conflict so that the moderates go all Tory on us. Do not take the bait.. CC makes them panic-- with good reason -- take a look at the Shall issue map.. :)
     

    RightNYer

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    May 5, 2013
    489
    I think the GOP is missing opportunities with young people. Huge ones. A lot of my friends, even my liberal friends, are concerned about taxes. (of course there are the 10% who will pay anything the govt asks) but a lot of them are concerned about taxes, Social security, employment, economic security, areas the Dems struggle in.

    But then they hear the GOP start social issue ranting, and they vote Democrat. And these are by no means people like the woman who complained she spent thousands of dollars on birth control. Open the tent more on social issues, get rid of the people who make ignorant comments about rape, and I think you could make inroads with younger people.

    Even if that is true, you have to ask yourself why the "younger generation" is so concerned with the "right" of a woman to vacuum her baby's brain out and the "right" of a man to screw another man in the butt in the first place?
     

    Brooklyn

    I stand with John Locke.
    Jan 20, 2013
    13,095
    Plan D? Not worth the hassle.
    I'd love to avoid civil war! But how is a constitutional convention remotely feasible, when the Hispanic population (a very statist, freedom hating group, on the whole) is growing rapidly, with no signs of letting up? A CC will not lead to a constitution like the one we want, but a "social justice" type constitution.

    Take a look at the shall issue states. CC is not by popular vote it is by state. It is a real threat. There are several wedge issues right now that could force it.


    Now as for Hispanics-- BS -- many are refugees from statist countries . You are being fed BS`by the media--- now they are democratic leaning, but not so much by choice--

    And as far as a social justice constitution the states are free not to sign back on--- the only precedent lead to the deletion of the AOC and then it was game on..


    Remember that our goal is to restore the constitution. If we can do that by the courts great. If we can do that by electing libertarians to congress great. If we can only do this by dissolving the union great --- if it take a civil war --- it only means the liberals have force us to that.

    If you tell a liberal you will succeed they laugh and point to the last civil war which actually increased federal power dramatically ( see my point about blow back ), but if you say CC then start wondering if its possible-- not probable but possible --then we negotiate from strength about what we demand.. Thats right demand.

    But we must prove we are serious. If the Cc fails civil war is still just as problematic but why not take a shot. Our founders were very wise -- lets use all the tools they provided before going off script ok.


    A cc is very possible-- more likely than Civil war anyway-- and more likely to succeed.
     

    RightNYer

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    May 5, 2013
    489
    Take a look at the shall issue states. CC is not by popular vote it is by state. It is a real threat. There are several wedge issues right now that could force it.


    Now as for Hispanics-- BS -- many are refugees from statist countries . You are being fed BS`by the media--- now they are democratic leaning, but not so much by choice--

    And as far as a social justice constitution the states are free not to sign back on--- the only precedent lead to the deletion of the AOC and then it was game on..


    Remember that our goal is to restore the constitution. If we can do that by the courts great. If we can do that by electing libertarians to congress great. If we can only do this by dissolving the union great --- if it take a civil war --- it only means the liberals have force us to that.

    If you tell a liberal you will succeed they laugh and point to the last civil war which actually increased federal power dramatically ( see my point about blow back ), but if you say CC then start wondering if its possible-- not probable but possible --then we negotiate from strength about what we demand.. Thats right demand.

    But we must prove we are serious. If the Cc fails civil war is still just as problematic but why not take a shot. Our founders were very wise -- lets use all the tools they provided before going off script ok.


    A cc is very possible-- more likely than Civil war anyway-- and more likely to succeed.

    I don't agree about Hispanics, but regardless, how can we force a CC? It takes 2/3rds of the states for that.
     

    Brooklyn

    I stand with John Locke.
    Jan 20, 2013
    13,095
    Plan D? Not worth the hassle.
    Even if that is true, you have to ask yourself why the "younger generation" is so concerned with the "right" of a woman to vacuum her baby's brain out and the "right" of a man to screw another man in the butt in the first place?

    Way to make friends and influence people.... :)

    How about not taking the bait. How about asking why they don't influence the d party to have better economic policies.. Every time you take the bait you make it more likely that we drift to the left.

    Do you want to win? Or do you just want to argue ?

    I claim that it is still better for the country to have sound economic policy from the D party.

    Frankly as libertarian I don't care so much about social issues, but, even if I did, I would hope that I was able to contain by rage and be an effective advocate for those other issues I could get support for.

    Think about it -- the clock is ticking -- want to bring about the end of days --- keep going-- want to prevent it-- get as much agreement as you can and move on. Who knows they may see it your way someday anyway--- it has happened.
     

    Brooklyn

    I stand with John Locke.
    Jan 20, 2013
    13,095
    Plan D? Not worth the hassle.
    I don't agree about Hispanics, but regardless, how can we force a CC? It takes 2/3rds of the states for that.

    The last time it was tried we were short by only 2 states.

    It was about the balanced budget amendment. Serious people are taking about this -- it not just me. See Mark Levins New book ( which I have yet to read BTW)

    This a good place to start.
     

    RightNYer

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    May 5, 2013
    489
    Way to make friends and influence people.... :)

    How about not taking the bait. How about asking why they don't influence the d party to have better economic policies.. Every time you take the bait you make it more likely that we drift to the left.

    Do you want to win? Or do you just want to argue ?

    I claim that it is still better for the country to have sound economic policy from the D party.

    Frankly as libertarian I don't care so much about social issues, but, even if I did, I would hope that I was able to contain by rage and be an effective advocate for those other issues I could get support for.

    Think about it -- the clock is ticking -- want to bring about the end of days --- keep going-- want to prevent it-- get as much agreement as you can and move on. Who knows they may see it your way someday anyway--- it has happened.

    Honestly, I don't care much about those issues either, but the fact that the left worships them to the exclusion of everything else (that is actually important) makes me think they're not people that be reasoned with. I think what it comes down to is that I just don't share your optimism. I don't think a CC is possible, nor can it work. I think the only thing the left will understand is violence, and it will have to be ruthless.
     

    Brooklyn

    I stand with John Locke.
    Jan 20, 2013
    13,095
    Plan D? Not worth the hassle.
    Honestly, I don't care much about those issues either, but the fact that the left worships them to the exclusion of everything else (that is actually important) makes me think they're not people that be reasoned with. I think what it comes down to is that I just don't share your optimism. I don't think a CC is possible, nor can it work. I think the only thing the left will understand is violence, and it will have to be ruthless.

    Then you are helping the opposition. And I will not help you to do that.
     

    MDFF2008

    Active Member
    Aug 12, 2008
    24,053
    I don't care if your screwing a dude, a woman, or having an orgy. Why should it be illegal?

    I agree with Brooklyn though about bringing the party back. That's why I love the DINO movement.
     

    K-Romulus

    Suburban Commando
    Mar 15, 2007
    2,369
    NE MoCO
    The Atlantic had an article on the millennials and the future of politics; basically they are the most pragmatic and anti-government group the country has seen in a long while:

    http://m.theatlantic.com/politics/a...als-change-washington-if-they-hate-it/278920/

    I used to despair about that crowd, but as I watch my little bro age (he turned 27 this year), he fits the description in that article to a T. He went from being an anti-gunowner due to college professor brainwashing to being a moderate gun owner himself after being out in the real world.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free
     

    EL1227

    R.I.P.
    Patriot Picket
    Nov 14, 2010
    20,274
    Almost every one has missed the point entirely ...

    It's NOT today's 20 somethings, it's NOT the Millenials, it's NOT the GOP or conservatives ... it's pervasive political correctness in education, and in partcular EARLY education. The examples cited in the GunsSaveLives article are ALL elementary school kids. Text books today abbreviate and distort the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, 2A in particular. Common Core (or Comminist Core) de-emphasizes history and civics 'core' in favor of a 'universal standard'.

    The word “standards” gets an approving nod from the public (and from most educators) because it means “performance that meets a standard.” However, the word also means “like everybody else,” and standardizing minds is what the Standards try to do. Common Core Standards fans sell the first meaning; the Standards deliver the second meaning. Standardized minds are about as far out of sync with deep-seated American values as it’s possible to get.

    Coupled with the dumbing down of American 'yoot' is fear-based conditioning of guns starting in Kindergarten. Thus the conclusion that 2A will be but a mere mention in history books (if there are history books of any merit) in two generations. Unlike old farts like me, the 20-somethings and Millenials here on MDS have a chance to influence change in the right direction with their families BEFORE their kids are indoctrinated.

    CSNY had a song way back when ...



    However, I prefer something more enduring ...

    Matthew 19:14
     

    Bohlieve410

    Active Member
    Feb 21, 2011
    1,575
    I think the GOP is missing opportunities with young people. Huge ones. A lot of my friends, even my liberal friends, are concerned about taxes. (of course there are the 10% who will pay anything the govt asks) but a lot of them are concerned about taxes, Social security, employment, economic security, areas the Dems struggle in.

    But then they hear the GOP start social issue ranting, and they vote Democrat. And these are by no means people like the woman who complained she spent thousands of dollars on birth control. Open the tent more on social issues, get rid of the people who make ignorant comments about rape, and I think you could make inroads with younger people.

    Cucinelli would have a cake walk if he would STFU about brith control and gays. But nooooooo.

    Most people I know in my generation don't give a rats butt about gay marriage, or birth control, or premaritial sex. Hell I love premarital sex! The fundamentalists will be the death of the party, and then we're stuck with Pelosi and Feinstein types running things. Scary.
     

    bulletdrop

    Junior Member
    Jul 23, 2011
    34
    Southern Maryland
    If you think it is happening for real. The only way to stop it is education. And by that i mean take as many of your friends family and country men to the range and teach them about weapons and safety... Make them love it as you do. Show them the fun or running plates/three gun/bowling pin, or shooting a dime group/target at 1000M... That is the only way to reinvigorate the coutry on 2A. Just my 2cents
     

    Brooklyn

    I stand with John Locke.
    Jan 20, 2013
    13,095
    Plan D? Not worth the hassle.
    If you think it is happening for real. The only way to stop it is education. And by that i mean take as many of your friends family and country men to the range and teach them about weapons and safety... Make them love it as you do. Show them the fun or running plates/three gun/bowling pin, or shooting a dime group/target at 1000M... That is the only way to reinvigorate the coutry on 2A. Just my 2cents

    Stay tuned .. This is going to happen ..

    see Project Appleseed for example.

    And if you can stand ready to help-- ideas are brewing I can feel it.
     

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