Patriot Picket Civil Rights Suit FILED!

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

  • No ad networks!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • GTOGUNNER

    IANAL, PATRIOT PICKET!!
    Patriot Picket
    Dec 16, 2010
    5,489
    Carroll County!
    Sorry, poor choice of words on my part. I think I better understand what the result will be.

    SCOTUS Will hopefully find for Appellants ie Hulberts et al. The case would be remanded to the original court which would be where a jury would decide on damages.
     

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    Two weeks from today - - on Monday morning, December 4, 2023 at 9:30 AM - - the Clerk of the Supreme Court will publish orders revealing the disposition of pending cert petitions.

    This will include most or all of the petitions scheduled for consideration at the Friday, December 1, 2023 conference, possibly including “Hulbert v. Pope.”

    Mark W. Smith
    in the “Four Boxes Diner” video below gives a very good explanation of the four typical dispositions of cert petitions at conference, granted, denied, relisted or held, with respect to the Rahimi (recently argued) and Range(cert petition pending) 2A cases:



    (The explanation of how cert petitions are handled at conference begins at the 4:00 minute mark.)

    A “discuss list” of petitions is maintained for each conference by the Chief Justice; only petitions on the discuss list are considered for a vote of the Justices at each conference.

    Before the conference any Justice may request a cert petition be added to the discuss list.

    It is estimated only 20% to 30% of cert petitions “distributed for conference” have been recommended by the Justices’ law clerks for consideration of a cert grant, and are included on the discuss list for that conference.

    We cannot know if our cert petition has been included on the 12/1/23 discuss list, because the list is not made public.

    Petitions distributed for conference but not discussed at that conference are automatically “dead-listed” and denied.
     
    Last edited:

    Adolph Oliver Bush

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Dec 13, 2015
    1,940

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    Sure was nice to see “Rack and Roll” pop up, again…even if only a thread from 2018.

    Yes, thanks, it sure was.

    The pics were posted in the Red Hen Restaurant closing thread in a sentimental remembrance of that Patriot Picket mission; those pics came to mind because of the breaking news about the Red Hen on Thanksgiving Day.

    Today’s news: we are exactly *one week* away from the Friday 12/1 conference of the Justices of the U.S. Supreme Court, where our cert petition will finally be considered.

    Here is a pic of Jeff in our legal counsel Cary Hansel’s office in Baltimore, also in 2018, holding copies of the 3 citations we each received after our arrest that led to this week’s cert petition, now more than five years and nine months later:

    IMG_0335.jpeg


    After all those years without a single day in a trial court, we still want that day.

    We are praying now for the cert grant, and then eventually a ruling from the Court to significantly revise or overturn the doctrine of qualified immunity, to guarantee in the future that under the law no one else will be arrested by their own government for lawfully petitioning that government for a redress of grievances, or for recording video and audio in public, only to have the arresting officer(s) make the claim afterwards that the law in this Circuit (or in half of the other U.S. Circuit Courts of Appeal) prevents any accountability by police or other public officials for violating those rights.

    Your support and encouragement has kept my spirit up, and I’m very grateful to you all for your kind words and support over these many years.

    Now, as this decision nears, I am asking for your prayers.
     

    pcfixer

    Ultimate Member
    May 24, 2009
    5,938
    Marylandstan
    Yes, thanks, it sure was.

    The pics were posted in the Red Hen Restaurant closing thread in a sentimental remembrance of that Patriot Picket mission; those pics came to mind because of the breaking news about the Red Hen on Thanksgiving Day.

    Today’s news: we are exactly *one week* away from the Friday 12/1 conference of the Justices of the U.S. Supreme Court, where our cert petition will finally be considered.

    Here is a pic of Jeff in our legal counsel Cary Hansel’s office in Baltimore, also in 2018, holding copies of the 3 citations we each received after our arrest that led to this week’s cert petition, now more than five years and nine months later:

    View attachment 441839

    After all those years without a single day in a trial court, we still want that day.

    We are praying now for the cert grant, and then eventually a ruling from the Court to significantly revise or overturn the doctrine of qualified immunity, to guarantee in the future that under the law no one else will be arrested by their own government for lawfully petitioning that government for a redress of grievances, or for recording video and audio in public, only to have the arresting officer(s) make the claim afterwards that the law in this Circuit (or in half of the other U.S. Circuit Courts of Appeal) prevents any accountability by police or other public officials for violating those rights.

    Your support and encouragement has kept my spirit up, and I’m very grateful to you all for your kind words and support over these many years.

    Now, as this decision nears, I am asking for your prayers.

    "Now, as this decision nears, I am asking for your prayers."

    :pray for All whose rights are violated.

    Now, as this decision nears, I am asking for your prayers.

     

    babalou

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Aug 12, 2013
    15,918
    Glenelg
    Yes, thanks, it sure was.

    The pics were posted in the Red Hen Restaurant closing thread in a sentimental remembrance of that Patriot Picket mission; those pics came to mind because of the breaking news about the Red Hen on Thanksgiving Day.

    Today’s news: we are exactly *one week* away from the Friday 12/1 conference of the Justices of the U.S. Supreme Court, where our cert petition will finally be considered.

    Here is a pic of Jeff in our legal counsel Cary Hansel’s office in Baltimore, also in 2018, holding copies of the 3 citations we each received after our arrest that led to this week’s cert petition, now more than five years and nine months later:

    View attachment 441839

    After all those years without a single day in a trial court, we still want that day.

    We are praying now for the cert grant, and then eventually a ruling from the Court to significantly revise or overturn the doctrine of qualified immunity, to guarantee in the future that under the law no one else will be arrested by their own government for lawfully petitioning that government for a redress of grievances, or for recording video and audio in public, only to have the arresting officer(s) make the claim afterwards that the law in this Circuit (or in half of the other U.S. Circuit Courts of Appeal) prevents any accountability by police or other public officials for violating those rights.

    Your support and encouragement has kept my spirit up, and I’m very grateful to you all for your kind words and support over these many years.

    Now, as this decision nears, I am asking for your prayers.
    many prayers given brother. I miss your brother a ton. Still look at pics he sent of his time in FL with the rocket take offs and his conversion of the trailer. :) Hope you and your family are well.
     

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    Thanks to all here for your continuing encouragement, kind thoughts and prayers.

    This panel discussion linked below exploring questions about qualified immunity offers a very good explanation about how QI evolved, how the Supreme Court has treated it in recent decisions, what Justice Scalia wrote about it, as well as descriptions of some contemporary cases.

    The presentation notably includes observations from a local lawyer about the practical aspects of litigating QI cases within the Fourth Circuit:

    IMG_6429.jpeg



    This forum occurred less than a month (see red arrow in pic above) after our February 2018 arrest, and less than three weeks after we joined with MSI to file our Section 1983 lawsuit in Federal district court.

    Perhaps it should come as no surprise then that there is a now a direct connection between this discussion by a law professor, a judge and two practicing lawyers and our case: this panel was moderated by Clark Niely III, who also authored the amicus brief submitted in support of our cert petition this month by the CATO INSTITUTE :

    IMG_6410.jpeg


    IMG_6393.jpeg


    Click here for Clark Niely’s amicus brief in “Hulbert v. Pope”:


    I like to think that QI, as with our own case, is now ripe for a Supreme Court decision finally ending this manifest injustice.
     
    Last edited:

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    Two weeks from today - - on Monday morning, December 4, 2023 at 9:30 AM - - the Clerk of the Supreme Court will publish orders revealing the disposition of pending cert petitions.

    This will include most or all of the petitions scheduled for consideration at the Friday, December 1, 2023 conference, possibly including “Hulbert v. Pope.”

    Mark W. Smith
    in the “Four Boxes Diner” video below gives a very good explanation of the four typical dispositions of cert petitions at conference, granted, denied, relisted or held, with respect to the Rahimi (recently argued) and Range(cert petition pending) 2A cases:



    (The explanation of how cert petitions are handled at conference begins at the 4:00 minute mark.)

    A “discuss list” of petitions is maintained for each conference by the Chief Justice; only petitions on the discuss list are considered for a vote of the Justices at each conference.

    Before the conference any Justice may request a cert petition be added to the discuss list.

    It is estimated only 20% to 30% of cert petitions “distributed for conference” have been recommended by the Justices’ law clerks for consideration of a cert grant, and are included on the discuss list for that conference.

    We cannot know if our cert petition has been included on the 12/1/23 discuss list, because the list is not made public.

    Petitions distributed for conference but not discussed at that conference are automatically “dead-listed” and denied.


    Tomorrow is the day our cert petition is considered by the Justices at their Friday 12/1 conference for the first and possibly only time.

    In anticipation of “what’s next?” questions I’ve quoted my own post above regarding the four possible outcomes of this conference: a grant, denial, relist or hold of our petition.

    I again recommend Mark W. Smith’s Four Boxes Diner video posted above as a good explanation of the difference between these outcomes; start at the 4:05 minute mark if you want only this explanation, which is embedded in a larger discussion of the “Rahimi” and “Range” cases.

    (Our petition is in the same “posture” as the “Range” petition in this discussion: awaiting a vote by the Justices.)

    I found this video informative as to how the Court process actually works, since the process is neither intuitive nor like an appeal filed in a lower court.

    A denial of a petition is the only outcome that is reported automatically by late tomorrow or early next Monday morning by the U.S. Supreme Court website.

    If you don’t want to watch/listen to the video, I refer you to this blogpost published on the Patriot Picket website; go to near the bottom for a written explanation:

     

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    Our docket at the U.S. Supreme Court has been updated today.

    Our cert petition was rescheduled for distribution to the conference of the Justices on Friday, December 8, 2023.



    IMG_6448.jpeg
     

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    sooo. this is one of the desired results? a good omen? the fact that it will receive additional review?
    Not certain.

    I was tracking two other cert petitions presenting First Amendment/Qualified Immunity questions that were submitted for other Fourth Circuit cases that, by coincidence, were also distributed for today’s 12/1 conference.

    As with our petition, their dockets show the same notations of “Rescheduled” to the 12/8/23 conference.

    The odds of receiving a cert grant don’t favor all three of our petitions being relisted, but that is possible.

    At this point I suspect the death of Sandra Day O’Conner, announced this morning, altered the schedule at the Court today.
     

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    Could they consolidate any of the cases? Are they similar enough?

    Possibly; the common denominator appears to be the exercise of free speech and the control that police and other authorities seem to want to have over it.

    The two petitions I’m referring to above spring from recent appellate decisions I highlighted here in this thread back in late April and late July.

    There may be other cases petitioned this term that I’m not aware of yet that could be consolidated with ours, because the lawful exercise of the First Amendment is evidently regarded as a growing threat by the government and its agents.
     

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    No news on our cert petition yet, which was on the docket today to be considered for a grant by the Justices at their Friday morning conference; more information may be available first thing this coming Monday morning when additional orders from today’s conference are published.

    Until then I’m reading the Court’s “tea leaves” again today, perusing the disposition of some other cert petitions near ours in the number range, or granted cert today, during the wait for more definitive news.

    Tea Leaf #1: The Court did announce a grant this afternoon for a petition distributed along with ours at today’s conference: it’s an early 2023 petition (“23-21”); it was the only petition granted cert in today’s order.

    It was filed last July and initially slowed by two 30-day extensions of time requested to file a response brief, was first distributed to the conference of 11/9/23, then relisted for distribution at 3 subsequent conferences until today. Multiple relistings seem to be the rule before a cert grant.

    Tea Leaf #2: Petitions near ours in the number range: our cert petition was assigned the docket number “23-385.”

    Research among the petitions already granted reveals petition “23-370” (only 15 petitions BEFORE ours) was granted cert on 11/20/23.

    Petition “23-411” (26 petitions AFTER ours) was granted cert back on 10/20/23; this petition appears to be the highest numbered 2023 cert petition granted this term, as of this afternoon.

    These two petitions bracket ours in the number sequence and are depicted below at the end of current grant list for this term; the US Government is a party in both, so these petitions were more likely to be granted cert expeditiously:

    IMG_6462.png


     
    Last edited:

    Deep Lurker

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Mar 22, 2019
    2,337
    This morning the U.S. Supreme Court denied our petition for a writ of certiorari.
     

    Users who are viewing this thread

    Latest posts

    Forum statistics

    Threads
    274,310
    Messages
    7,231,553
    Members
    33,203
    Latest member
    gdztoyz

    Latest threads

    Top Bottom