Not a 2nd Amendment issue, but a Constitutional one

[fabsroman]

Can officers go door to door and search houses, without the homeowner's consent, as they search for a fugitive?

I just read that this is what was done in Watertown, Massachusetts to catch the last of the two fugitives.

I really need to catch up on Constitutional law.

 

[frogman68]

think it would fall under pursuit of suspect , from the step son of the guy that owns the boat it was only 3/8ths of a mile from last nights shoot out

the AG even mentioned that they used some federal law not to have to read him his Miranda Rights

 

[-Z/28-]

There are different rules when police are in "hot pursuit". Honestly, I doubt any of the residents up there were objecting. They did have a crazy terrorist running around.

 

[fabsroman]

There are different rules when police are in "hot pursuit". Honestly, I doubt any of the residents up there were objecting. They did have a crazy terrorist running around.

I know there are, but the question becomes what is "hot pursuit". Going door to door to search people's homes does not sound like hot pursuit to me. We are going down a slippery slope here. Might not want to live next to a prison. Anytime somebody escapes, they might be in hot pursuit. Good way to clean out bad neighborhoods might be to locate a prison in the middle of them, allow people to escape on a regular basis, and then search every house while in "hot" pursuit. Clear out the crack houses right away.

 

[MDFF2008]

I've heard mixed reports, some saying they were forcing their ways in, some saying they were telling people to lock their doors and windows if they declined.

Just like staying inside, they never ordered the bostonians to stay inside, just asked them.

 

[-Z/28-]

I know there are, but the question becomes what is "hot pursuit". Going door to door to search people's homes does not sound like hot pursuit to me. We are going down a slippery slope here. Might not want to live next to a prison. Anytime somebody escapes, they might be in hot pursuit. Good way to clean out bad neighborhoods might be to locate a prison in the middle of them, allow people to escape on a regular basis, and then search every house while in "hot" pursuit. Clear out the crack houses right away.

There are a number of court cases that have defined the issue. Also the police can only search where a person could be hiding. It's not like they can start tossing the place and going through stuff.

 

[fabsroman]

There are a number of court cases that have defined the issue. Also the police can only search where a person could be hiding. It's not like they can start tossing the place and going through stuff.

People can hide in some small spaces, and yes there is plenty of SCOTUS caselaw on this. A google on it brings a bunch of it up, but I don't think there is a single case on point regarding a fugitive and going house by house searching for him. Man, I wish I had way more time in every day.

 

[fabsroman]

I've heard mixed reports, some saying they were forcing their ways in, some saying they were telling people to lock their doors and windows if they declined.

Just like staying inside, they never ordered the bostonians to stay inside, just asked them.

Yeah, guess I should not rely on the "facts" from reporters until I see a battering ram being used on a house by house basis. Still a fascinating legal question though.

Who here would know whether or not they had to open their door to LEO in this case and allow them to search their house.

 

[MDFF2008]

Yeah, guess I should not rely on the "facts" from reporters until I see a battering ram being used on a house by house basis. Still a fascinating legal question though.

Who here would know whether or not they had to open their door to LEO in this case and allow them to search their house.

I get what your saying, but I had to laugh a little at the "facts" comment considering how many retractions the news people have done since Monday.

 

[fabsroman]

I get what your saying, but I had to laugh a little at the "facts" comment considering how many retractions the news people have done since Monday.

It is quite sad. It used to be that the weather reporter was the only one that could get paid for being wrong. The other reporters have caught on to that too, including investigative journalists.

You have to wait 6+ months to find out the actual news.

 

[hogarth]

What did the cops do when they got to houses where no one answered the door?

 

[Jat1668]

In hot pursuit means that the police are actively chasing the suspect. If during the course of the pursuit, they see the suspect go into your house, they may enter w/o a warrant to apprehend the suspect. This goes for all of your property.

The police may not conduct random searches (of your house) for a suspect. They must obtain a warrant for each house that they want to search. However, if the police see you walking down the street and you match the description of a suspect, then you may be stopped until your identity can be ascertained. If you do not have any form of Id on you at the time, the officer may place you into custody until your identity is confirmed.

Heavens..once I get to typing.

 

[fabsroman]

In hot pursuit means that the police are actively chasing the suspect. If during the course of the pursuit, they see the suspect go into your house, they may enter w/o a warrant to apprehend the suspect. This goes for all of your property.

The police may not conduct random searches (of your house) for a suspect. They must obtain a warrant for each house that they want to search. However, if the police see you walking down the street and you match the description of a suspect, then you may be stopped until your identity can be ascertained. If you do not have any form of Id on you at the time, the officer may place you into custody until your identity is confirmed.

Heavens..once I get to typing.

Thank you.

 

[Brooklyn]

Can officers go door to door and search houses, without the homeowner's consent, as they search for a fugitive?

I just read that this is what was done in Watertown, Massachusetts to catch the last of the two fugitives.

I really need to catch up on Constitutional law.

Well thats a good question...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exigent_circumstance_in_United_States_law

Exigent circumstance would likely allow a broad search, but in the event that any evidence were discovered there is a good chance that it would be thrown out if it had no connection to the original justification for the search.

But the courts have been less than kind to the 4th amendment of late..

reasonable expectation of privacy comes into play as well, for example this forum is public so we have reasonable expectation of privacy.


Frankly until the court rules no one knows, and even after they rule the government will claim emergency powers anyway. If you think its bad now learn a bit of the abuses during WW II ( think interment camps ).


IANAL.

 

[Brooklyn]

It is quite sad. It used to be that the weather reporter was the only one that could get paid for being wrong. The other reporters have caught on to that too, including investigative journalists.

You have to wait 6+ months to find out the actual news.

This may be the most important thing you can learn by watching the news

They are paid to talk. If there is no data, they will still talk. You will miss nothing if you do not watch ....

 

[Onequickfamilysedan]

Boston was under martial law http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-martial-law.htm Civil rights are suspended.

 

[Brooklyn]

think it would fall under pursuit of suspect , from the step son of the guy that owns the boat it was only 3/8ths of a mile from last nights shoot out

the AG even mentioned that they used some federal law not to have to read him his Miranda Rights

First, in the interest of avoiding a slippery slope, Its a Miranda warning, the rights exist regardless, and generally can not be waived without counsel. This is by court decision http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miranda_v._Arizona


The new law may or may not be constitutional, but regardless of the miranda warning, if a suspect is aware of and invokes his rights, the government is on very thin ice in denying counsel..

Not saying they will not do it, just saying they risk losing the use of any evidence thereby acquired. Of course if the government does not care, or has other plans for the suspect this will not matter.