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  • joppaj

    Sheepdog
    Staff member
    Moderator
    Apr 11, 2008
    39,508
    MD
    The nice thing about the 45/70 and .444 was that they showed up on the used market with very light usage. I wanted them both but finally realized I'd just never use them.
     

    Occam

    Recovering Lurker
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    15,171
    Montgomery County
    That's one sexy gun

    Showed that new Ruglin to my wife. She says, "Give me a nice oiled walnut stock and lose that ugly rail on the top. We can talk about the fiber optic front sight." That's my girl, she's a traditionalist. BTW, she nailed a twelve inch gong at 100 yards on her first shot with my 45-70 Sharps over the weekend. That was fun! Says it also instantly cured that tight spot in her upper back. At $2 a round these days, it's nice to get more than one good thing out of pulling that trigger.
     

    Diesel-Dad

    Member
    Jun 25, 2016
    241
    HARFORD COUNTY
    d840b9ae264541282a40be3d22bd7613.jpg

    Saw this today. Looks like things are progressing.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    rseymorejr

    Active Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 28, 2011
    21,788
    Harford County
    Showed that new Ruglin to my wife. She says, "Give me a nice oiled walnut stock and lose that ugly rail on the top. We can talk about the fiber optic front sight." That's my girl, she's a traditionalist. BTW, she nailed a twelve inch gong at 100 yards on her first shot with my 45-70 Sharps over the weekend. That was fun! Says it also instantly cured that tight spot in her upper back. At $2 a round these days, it's nice to get more than one good thing out of pulling that trigger.

    I agree with your wife. In rifles I can go with laminated stocks and SS barrels, but not in lever actions. Something is not quite rigth about that.
     

    lazarus

    Active Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    8,752
    I agree with your wife. In rifles I can go with laminated stocks and SS barrels, but not in lever actions. Something is not quite rigth about that.

    I won’t argue with ya’ll much, but I am glad the barrel is threaded. This day and age there isn’t much excuse not to. And threading a lever gun is often $$$ as you often need to redo the front sight and possibly the mag tube depending.

    I’d prefer the top rail to be an accessory that can mount to scope base screw holes. And I do prefer wood or laminate to plastic.

    But since I really want a .357, threaded and with the option to mount a 2-3x micro prism or red dot for a straight wall lever gun, and then use QD mounts so I can take the optics off and plink at the range. All this suppressed….

    I’ll sacrifice wood and a clean top for proper optics mount, that isn’t a scout mount, and a threaded barrel.
     

    Doobie

    Active Member
    Jan 23, 2013
    1,775
    Earth
    My brother wants one of the new Marlin 1895 45/70s. Anyone have a lead/idea where he can get in line to get one?
     

    308Scout

    Active Member
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 27, 2020
    2,432
    Washington County
    Five months later and the second new Marlin model was just launched. 1895 Trapper in 45-70. I'm curious when they're going to start cranking out some volume on the released models. The SBL still seems to be a rare duck in the wild. Sellers for the few that I've seen online are listing at 2-3X MSRP and I don't think that's going away until supply catches up.

    https://marlinfirearms.com/s/model_1895trapper/
     

    lazarus

    Active Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    8,752
    That's something. Not sure why they are going so slow. Could be they are still working out their process. Or converting/purchasing more machine tools to increase production. Or they just might not plan to increase production any and they are working on the other models. For Ruglin, it would suck to invest a ton in production tools to meet demand, only to find out that high demand only lasts 2 years to satisfy the backlog and then ongoing demand is half and Ruglin has invested all of that in tools and employees.

    Same reason that the oil companies aren't busy drilling thousands of new wells. It has little to nothing to do with the Biden administration. The oil companies shareholders are telling them to hold fast. They've been burned twice HARD in the last decade or so. By the shale oil collapse from low oil prices and then with the 2020 demand collapse. They lost billions. Well prices are sky high, so profits are sky high. Shareholders want that money, not invest in new wells that MIGHT increase profits...but also prices might have fallen back to Earth by the time they've finished the new wells and now they spent billions and the well only is profitable at $100 a barrel oil and oil is down to $60. Opps!

    Anyway, I don't know if "capitol discipline and anticipating long term demand" is what Ruglin is doing here. It would not surprise me though. Better to plan production for long term demand, than over build to meet existing demand and then have long term demand be significantly lower.
     

    Bisleyfan44

    Active Member
    Jan 11, 2008
    1,642
    Wicomico
    That's something. Not sure why they are going so slow. Could be they are still working out their process. Or converting/purchasing more machine tools to increase production. Or they just might not plan to increase production any and they are working on the other models. For Ruglin, it would suck to invest a ton in production tools to meet demand, only to find out that high demand only lasts 2 years to satisfy the backlog and then ongoing demand is half and Ruglin has invested all of that in tools and employees.

    Same reason that the oil companies aren't busy drilling thousands of new wells. It has little to nothing to do with the Biden administration. The oil companies shareholders are telling them to hold fast. They've been burned twice HARD in the last decade or so. By the shale oil collapse from low oil prices and then with the 2020 demand collapse. They lost billions. Well prices are sky high, so profits are sky high. Shareholders want that money, not invest in new wells that MIGHT increase profits...but also prices might have fallen back to Earth by the time they've finished the new wells and now they spent billions and the well only is profitable at $100 a barrel oil and oil is down to $60. Opps!

    Anyway, I don't know if "capitol discipline and anticipating long term demand" is what Ruglin is doing here. It would not surprise me though. Better to plan production for long term demand, than over build to meet existing demand and then have long term demand be significantly lower.
    I disagree. Buyers standing there with money in hand should be served. Demand has never been higher. You have customers that you don't have to convince to spend their money on your product. Produce it and it's sold. Otherwise, you make them wait too long, they'll find another product from a competitor instead.

    I gave up on waiting for a Ruglin 357 as I don't think they'll get to the popular calibers/models that folks actually want for a long while, maybe years. Example the new 45-70 carbine is the 2nd model from this line?? How many 45-70 levers before that market is saturated??? Oh well. The Henry 357 X model I found is pretty awesome and will fill the place I was holding for a Marlin.

    BTW, OPEC is just getting even with us for us moving to energy independence under Trump and not needing to buy their oil. Then Biden comes in and reduces domestic production and all of a sudden, we need foreign oil again. And now we're depleting our strategic reserve, great move (sarcasm). The high energy prices today are 100% Biden's doing. 100%. Build Back Better?? More like Make Everything Worse.
     

    lazarus

    Active Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    8,752
    I disagree. Buyers standing there with money in hand should be served. Demand has never been higher. You have customers that you don't have to convince to spend their money on your product. Produce it and it's sold. Otherwise, you make them wait too long, they'll find another product from a competitor instead.

    I gave up on waiting for a Ruglin 357 as I don't think they'll get to the popular calibers/models that folks actually want for a long while, maybe years. Example the new 45-70 carbine is the 2nd model from this line?? How many 45-70 levers before that market is saturated??? Oh well. The Henry 357 X model I found is pretty awesome and will fill the place I was holding for a Marlin.

    BTW, OPEC is just getting even with us for us moving to energy independence under Trump and not needing to buy their oil. Then Biden comes in and reduces domestic production and all of a sudden, we need foreign oil again. And now we're depleting our strategic reserve, great move (sarcasm). The high energy prices today are 100% Biden's doing. 100%. Build Back Better?? More like Make Everything Worse.
    Not sure you understand economics/business that well. I’ve got no idea Ruger’s situation with Marlin’s machinery. But from what I’ve read, it’s mostly needing new machinery to make the guns. Or massive retooling if the old stuff. To service pent up demand might mean investing $40-60 million in machines and bring on a couple hundred employees to crank out just the .45-70 stuff. And then what do they do with all of the extra tooling if demand is 1/3rd it is now?

    It generally doesn’t make sense to invest in CAPEX to satisfy short term demand. Same reason oil companies now aren’t and their inverters are insisting as much.

    Current administration is somewhat at fault. But Trump and last Congress started the snowball with the first stimulus and here we are today. Build back better, most of that money hasn’t even been spent yet.

    You give any president too much credit. They have limited influence on energy prices. Good or bad.
     

    whistlersmother

    Peace through strength
    Jan 29, 2013
    7,971
    Fulton, MD
    Not sure you understand economics/business that well. I’ve got no idea Ruger’s situation with Marlin’s machinery. But from what I’ve read, it’s mostly needing new machinery to make the guns. Or massive retooling if the old stuff. To service pent up demand might mean investing $40-60 million in machines and bring on a couple hundred employees to crank out just the .45-70 stuff. And then what do they do with all of the extra tooling if demand is 1/3rd it is now?

    It generally doesn’t make sense to invest in CAPEX to satisfy short term demand. Same reason oil companies now aren’t and their inverters are insisting as much.

    Current administration is somewhat at fault. But Trump and last Congress started the snowball with the first stimulus and here we are today. Build back better, most of that money hasn’t even been spent yet.

    You give any president too much credit. They have limited influence on energy prices. Good or bad.

    Keystone closed
    Alaska range closed
    Numerous drilling permits canceled

    Who was responsible? And here we are at $4.50/gal gas. Just two years ago, it was $1.90. So what's changed?

    Even if those things would have been years out to bringing oil to market, they had an affect now.
     

    Bisleyfan44

    Active Member
    Jan 11, 2008
    1,642
    Wicomico
    Not sure you understand economics/business that well. I’ve got no idea Ruger’s situation with Marlin’s machinery. But from what I’ve read, it’s mostly needing new machinery to make the guns. Or massive retooling if the old stuff. To service pent up demand might mean investing $40-60 million in machines and bring on a couple hundred employees to crank out just the .45-70 stuff. And then what do they do with all of the extra tooling if demand is 1/3rd it is now?

    It generally doesn’t make sense to invest in CAPEX to satisfy short term demand. Same reason oil companies now aren’t and their inverters are insisting as much.

    Current administration is somewhat at fault. But Trump and last Congress started the snowball with the first stimulus and here we are today. Build back better, most of that money hasn’t even been spent yet.

    You give any president too much credit. They have limited influence on energy prices. Good or bad.
    I do understand it. But this is not short term unlike the ammo shortages from years past. And It's not just ammo, it's also guns. When you have companies saying they won't be able to fill current backorders for years, it's more than short term. And, demand won't return to "normal" levels we used to know for a long time, if ever, unless manufacturing is increased.

    If we are to believe what everybody is saying, that the pandemic, the riots and all the other stuff brought millions of new gun owners into the fold then there will be more demand than was normal in the past just due to the increase in sheer numbers of shooters. More customers need more product. It behooves them to increase capacity. For the long term. I think I got a handle on things.

    The current administration is 100% at fault. Trump did promote the 1st stimulus package and at the time it was passed, I believe it was needed to cover the loss of employment due to Corona-forced shutdowns. But the subsequent 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 40th stimulus packages (which were passed solely by Dems) did nothing except keep our workforce home when we needed them most and brought on an inflation which will damage the personal wealth of citizens and the national economy for years. Thank you Brandon! But by all means, go ahead and vote for him again.
     

    lazarus

    Active Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    8,752
    I do understand it. But this is not short term unlike the ammo shortages from years past. And It's not just ammo, it's also guns. When you have companies saying they won't be able to fill current backorders for years, it's more than short term. And, demand won't return to "normal" levels we used to know for a long time, if ever, unless manufacturing is increased.

    If we are to believe what everybody is saying, that the pandemic, the riots and all the other stuff brought millions of new gun owners into the fold then there will be more demand than was normal in the past just due to the increase in sheer numbers of shooters. More customers need more product. It behooves them to increase capacity. For the long term. I think I got a handle on things.

    The current administration is 100% at fault. Trump did promote the 1st stimulus package and at the time it was passed, I believe it was needed to cover the loss of employment due to Corona-forced shutdowns. But the subsequent 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 40th stimulus packages (which were passed solely by Dems) did nothing except keep our workforce home when we needed them most and brought on an inflation which will damage the personal wealth of citizens and the national economy for years. Thank you Brandon! But by all means, go ahead and vote for him again.
    Yes, but the machine tools don't pay for themselves in a year or two, even with sky-high demand. Maybe it is just Ruger is realizing its really hard to make a quality lever gun. I don't know. I am just speculating as to the reason they do not appear to be ramping up production. Maybe it is just taking a ton of time to bring up all of the machine tools. But a lot of gun companies and ammo makers have gotten burned in the past by investing a ton in meeting demand of the day, only time find it slacken off in 2 or 3 years.

    Same thing with ammo makers. Most of them haven't invested in expanding production much. Most hired on extra shifts and that has been about it.
     

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