My Simson Suhl Makarov

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

  • No ad networks!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • TaoHaus

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 7, 2023
    15
    Gaithersburg, MD
    Got this early this year, then had to wrestle the HRB into adding it to the Roster without making me send it to their lab to test fire as it’s a pretty rare collectable. But they allowed it. Only took like 4 months.
     

    Attachments

    • IMG_3833.jpeg
      IMG_3833.jpeg
      267.6 KB · Views: 80
    • IMG_3830.jpeg
      IMG_3830.jpeg
      385.1 KB · Views: 76
    • IMG_3829.jpeg
      IMG_3829.jpeg
      492.1 KB · Views: 81
    • IMG_3832.jpeg
      IMG_3832.jpeg
      533.2 KB · Views: 68
    • IMG_3831.jpeg
      IMG_3831.jpeg
      471.6 KB · Views: 65
    • IMG_3834.jpeg
      IMG_3834.jpeg
      281.5 KB · Views: 64
    • IMG_3836.jpeg
      IMG_3836.jpeg
      435.6 KB · Views: 69
    Jul 1, 2012
    5,698
    Cool Suhl :)
    Great to get the complete CDI package with the spare mag, manual and box.
    This one isn't recorded; see the relatively new book "The Makarov Pistol - Soviet Union & East Germany" by Henry Brown and Cameron White. They have a pic of S/N 000670 with the same 6KH date code (1997) and note 21 observed serial numbers (not including this one). Estimated production from 800-1000 pistols with unknown number imported to US - but not very many!
     
    Jul 1, 2012
    5,698
    Technically it's a C&R so you'd think it would be exempt from the handgun roster, not sure how that works though?
    Section II of ATF 5300.11: "Makarov, pistol, Russian and East German, cal. 9mm Makarov" - although the Russian IJ-70 isn't considered C&R, so maybe this one isn't either since it's a commercial pistol not military/police. Then again you could have a solid argument based on rarity and higher value.
     

    mawkie

    C&R Whisperer
    Sep 28, 2007
    4,320
    Catonsville
    I know absolutely nothing about Makarovs but can certainly appreciate rare when I see it. If somd_mustangs is impressed, then I'm onboard! Congrats on a hard to find gem.
     

    54rndball

    take to the hills
    Mar 16, 2013
    1,479
    Catonsville
    Those markings are unusual. Just wondering if that is a 1990s era manufacture. It does not have the standard serial number, etc. for East German Makarov.
     

    Bob A

    όυ φροντισ
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Nov 11, 2009
    30,435
    A bit more info:


    One was sold recently on GB for $1710.

    From another site:
    The Makarov Page - The Simson Suhl Makarov
    Post-Unification German Makarovs
    As early as the 1960s, the Russian Makarov pistol design was licensed to other socialist states, including East Germany. After the German reunification, the German Bundeswehr and republic came into possession of not only Makarov pistols, but the manufacturing site of Ernst Thaelmann in Suhl (state of Thueringen).
    After some negotiations, the site became the Suhler Jagd- und Sportwaffen GmBH (Suhl Hunting and Sport Arms Ltd). The site included a substantial amount of manufacturing equipment, spare parts, drawings, and highly skilled personnel.
    In 1994, the idea was spawned to once again make Makarov pistols from the existing stock of parts. One of the design features that was criticized was a cam that held the hammer in place (forward) when the safety was on "safe." This was removed on the new pistols such that the slide can now be racked when the pistols is on "safe," clearing the chamber if a round is present.
    This retrofit can also be done on existing Makarov pistols by modifying the hammer and safety. At one time we carried these parts, but we are running low on original safeties. Also, minor variations in customers' pistols required some minor fitting, which most people are unwilling to do.
    Several prototypes with various finishes and serial numbers V000001 to V000005 were made and V000006 through V000016 received a black finish. "V" is from Versuchsserie (trial series). One pistol was also made in 9mm Kurz (.380 ACP).
    In 1995 then production of the mini-series starting with serial # 000001 began. The left of the slide was marked "SIMSON SUHL/THUR" (with Umlaut - the two dots - on the "U" in "THUR") and the right is marked with a blacksmith symbol and "MAKAROV 9x18mm". There appears to be some variation on this, since the pistols with serial numbers in the mid-400s and the ones in the 700s only say "SIMSON SUHL" without the "THUR." (see pictures below) Considering that the original production run was only scheduled to yield approximately 300 pistols and that serial numbers in the 700s are now being sold, it is conceivable that full-scale production has been resumed.
    The pistols were shipped in either a black or blue plastic box with a manual and 2 new magazines that have the same raised area as the East German magazines. The manual gives the basic safety and operation of the pistol and a short paragraph on the history. The finish is black and the grips are a hard plastic with thumbrest and fine stippling on the sides and above the thumbrest.
    The ones that found their way into the US are also marked with the importer's mark of "C.D.I. Swan. VT." The pistols were sold for a brief period during October-November 1997 by SOG.
     
    Last edited:

    TaoHaus

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 7, 2023
    15
    Gaithersburg, MD
    Technically it's a C&R so you'd think it would be exempt from the handgun roster, not sure how that works though?
    Section II of ATF 5300.11: "Makarov, pistol, Russian and East German, cal. 9mm Makarov" - although the Russian IJ-70 isn't considered C&R, so maybe this one isn't either since it's a commercial pistol not military/police. Then again you could have a solid argument based on rarity and higher value.
    It is not C&R — and made after 1985. E German Makarovs are all C&R (production stopped in 1965). This is post-German reunification.
     

    TaoHaus

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 7, 2023
    15
    Gaithersburg, MD
    A bit more info:


    One was sold recently on GB for $1710.

    From another site:
    The Makarov Page - The Simson Suhl Makarov
    Post-Unification German Makarovs
    As early as the 1960s, the Russian Makarov pistol design was licensed to other socialist states, including East Germany. After the German reunification, the German Bundeswehr and republic came into possession of not only Makarov pistols, but the manufacturing site of Ernst Thaelmann in Suhl (state of Thueringen).
    After some negotiations, the site became the Suhler Jagd- und Sportwaffen GmBH (Suhl Hunting and Sport Arms Ltd). The site included a substantial amount of manufacturing equipment, spare parts, drawings, and highly skilled personnel.
    In 1994, the idea was spawned to once again make Makarov pistols from the existing stock of parts. One of the design features that was criticized was a cam that held the hammer in place (forward) when the safety was on "safe." This was removed on the new pistols such that the slide can now be racked when the pistols is on "safe," clearing the chamber if a round is present.
    This retrofit can also be done on existing Makarov pistols by modifying the hammer and safety. At one time we carried these parts, but we are running low on original safeties. Also, minor variations in customers' pistols required some minor fitting, which most people are unwilling to do.
    Several prototypes with various finishes and serial numbers V000001 to V000005 were made and V000006 through V000016 received a black finish. "V" is from Versuchsserie (trial series). One pistol was also made in 9mm Kurz (.380 ACP).
    In 1995 then production of the mini-series starting with serial # 000001 began. The left of the slide was marked "SIMSON SUHL/THUR" (with Umlaut - the two dots - on the "U" in "THUR") and the right is marked with a blacksmith symbol and "MAKAROV 9x18mm". There appears to be some variation on this, since the pistols with serial numbers in the mid-400s and the ones in the 700s only say "SIMSON SUHL" without the "THUR." (see pictures below) Considering that the original production run was only scheduled to yield approximately 300 pistols and that serial numbers in the 700s are now being sold, it is conceivable that full-scale production has been resumed.
    The pistols were shipped in either a black or blue plastic box with a manual and 2 new magazines that have the same raised area as the East German magazines. The manual gives the basic safety and operation of the pistol and a short paragraph on the history. The finish is black and the grips are a hard plastic with thumbrest and fine stippling on the sides and above the thumbrest.
    The ones that found their way into the US are also marked with the importer's mark of "C.D.I. Swan. VT." The pistols were sold for a brief period during October-November 1997 by SOG.
    I have seen some low low SNs go for a lot more on GB. $1710 is cheap. I got a good price bc it was listed with awful blurry pics at BIN of $1500 but represented as NIB and a check of seller’s feedback and real website led me to believe it would be what they said so I took the risk. And it was, thank God.
     

    mawkie

    C&R Whisperer
    Sep 28, 2007
    4,320
    Catonsville
    Stuff like this is catnip to me. I'm drawn to the little foot notes of firearm history, the one-offs and short runs. Thanks TaoHaus for the thread. Also thanks to Bob A for the concise history. A mystery is more fun when you have an explanation that ties all the loose threads neatly, like a good murder mystery novel. Yet again another great learning experience.
     

    TaoHaus

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 7, 2023
    15
    Gaithersburg, MD
    Those markings are unusual. Just wondering if that is a 1990s era manufacture. It does not have the standard serial number, etc. for East German Makarov.
    It is from a post-reunification run in the 1990s. They were made at same physical factory as the E German era ones.
     

    Users who are viewing this thread

    Latest posts

    Forum statistics

    Threads
    274,310
    Messages
    7,231,553
    Members
    33,203
    Latest member
    gdztoyz

    Latest threads

    Top Bottom