Montgomery County Bill 21-22

[esqappellate]

Folks: I may need to talk to people who live in Montgomery Co. and who are adversely affected by the bill as amended by staff report. Specifically, people who live within 100 yards of any of these publicly or privately owned places. Please PM me. The more places the better:
Place of public assembly: A “place of public assembly” is:
(1) a [place where the public may assemble, whether the place is] publicly or
privately owned:[, including a]
(A) park;
(B) place of worship;
(C) school;
(D) library;
(E) recreational facility;
(F) hospital;
(G) community health center, including any health care facility or
community-based program licensed by the Maryland Department of
Health;
(H) long-term facility, including any licensed nursing home, group
home, or care home; [or]
(I) multipurpose exhibition facility, such as a fairgrounds or conference
center; or
(J) childcare facility;
(2) government building, including any place owned by or under the control of
the County;
(3) polling place;
(4) courthouse;
(5) legislative assembly; or
(6) a gathering of individuals to collectively express their constitutional right
to protest or assemble.
A “place of public assembly” includes all property associated with the place, such
as a parking lot or grounds of a building.

Staff report attached, for context.

 

[Biggfoot44]

All this will do is suck up resources we can use to attack the state

Give generously and often to MSI Legal Fund .

 

[Sunrise]

Folks: I may need to talk to people who live in Montgomery Co. and who are adversely affected by the bill as amended by staff report. Specifically, people who live within 100 yards of any of these publicly or privately owned places. Please PM me. The more places the better:
Place of public assembly: A “place of public assembly” is:
(1) a [place where the public may assemble, whether the place is] publicly or
privately owned:[, including a]
(A) park;
(B) place of worship;
(C) school;
(D) library;
(E) recreational facility;
(F) hospital;
(G) community health center, including any health care facility or
community-based program licensed by the Maryland Department of
Health;
(H) long-term facility, including any licensed nursing home, group
home, or care home; [or]
(I) multipurpose exhibition facility, such as a fairgrounds or conference
center; or
(J) childcare facility;
(2) government building, including any place owned by or under the control of
the County;
(3) polling place;
(4) courthouse;
(5) legislative assembly; or
(6) a gathering of individuals to collectively express their constitutional right
to protest or assemble.
A “place of public assembly” includes all property associated with the place, such
as a parking lot or grounds of a building.

Staff report attached, for context.

Take the strip of Arlington Road in Downtown Bethesda which runs south from where it intersects with Old Georgetown Road and Wilson Lane: You've got Bethesda Elementary School on the corner, the Connie Morella Public Library just to the south of that with its huge parking lot, and then a County Park (Caroline Freeland Urban Park). This covers at least six blocks of Bethesda going North/South (not including East/West). If this Bill passes, you won't be allowed to conceal carry down this major thoroughfare, even if you're on the other side of the street. Ridiculous.

 

[swinokur]

I think the court will agree


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[jmcgonig]

I don't live within 100 yards of those, but I don't think I could get out of my area w/o passing 100 yards of one of those.

What's the legal action on something like this? Is this one of those things that take years to get removed again?

Edit: If Google Earth is right I guess I am within 100 yards of a park.

 

[Sunrise]

I don't live within 100 yards of those, but I don't think I could get out of my area w/o passing 100 yards of one of those.

What's the legal action on something like this? Is this one of those things that take years to get removed again?

Edit: If Google Earth is right I guess I am within 100 yards of a park.

When you add in the "parking lot" inclusion for these places, it's blatantly obvious what they're trying to accomplish here.

Look at this map of Downtown Bethesda: Between the schools, parks, library and their respective parking/grounds, it'll effectively be a gun-free zone.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

goo.gl

 

[Occam]

When you add in the "parking lot" inclusion for these places, it's blatantly obvious what they're trying to accomplish here.

Look at this map of Downtown Bethesda: Between the schools, parks, library and their respective parking/grounds, it'll effectively be a gun-free zone.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

goo.gl

Not to mention every doctor's office, clinic, daycare, assisted living condo, and other item on the None Shall Pass list. To comply with this list, we literally can't get out of our neighborhood while heeled. We can't even leave our driveway! Every errand to local grocery stores or other routine trips takes us past all sorts of show stoppers that are within 100 yards of the roads we travel. Our daily neighborhood walks would be off-limits for my wife to carry while passing dense woods by herself. Inclined to list things, it would be simpler to identify the nearest spots that would NOT be prohibited.

Just for fun, I mapped out Atlantic Guns in Rockville. I don't think it's possible to reach (or leave!) their store without being in violation. There are county properties, medical practices, parks, and other Oh No You Don't places along every road that might take you to their location. This would effectively shut down their business.

 

[Sunrise]

Not to mention every doctor's office, clinic, daycare, assisted living condo, and other item on the None Shall Pass list. To comply with this list, we literally can't get out of our neighborhood while heeled. We can't even leave our driveway! Every errand to local grocery stores or other routine trips takes us past all sorts of show stoppers that are within 100 yards of the roads we travel. Our daily neighborhood walks would be off-limits for my wife to carry while passing dense woods by herself. Inclined to list things, it would be simpler to identify the nearest spots that would NOT be prohibited.

Just for fun, I mapped out Atlantic Guns in Rockville. I don't think it's possible to reach (or leave!) their store without being in violation. There are county properties, medical practices, parks, and other Oh No You Don't places along every road that might take you to their location. This would effectively shut down their business.

Absolutely right. I believe this Bill will ultimately be held unconstitutional for these restrictions, but the Montgomery County leadership has no qualms about wasting taxpayer money pursuing this anyway. It's not their money. Failing gives them something to run and grift on for their base of gun grabbers.

 

[erwos]

Unfortunately, the only way to really stop this kind of abuse is for SCOTUS to better define sensitive places as "places with armed security and metal detectors". I mean, think about it: if it's sensitive, you guard it and check people coming in. If you're not doing that, it's clearly not sensitive. I know I'm preaching to the choir here, it just drives me crazy to see MoCo trying to tell me the park around the corner is equivalent to the local courthouse.

 

[Sunrise]

Folks: I may need to talk to people who live in Montgomery Co. and who are adversely affected by the bill as amended by staff report. Specifically, people who live within 100 yards of any of these publicly or privately owned places. Please PM me. The more places the better:
Place of public assembly: A “place of public assembly” is:
(1) a [place where the public may assemble, whether the place is] publicly or
privately owned:[, including a]
(A) park;
(B) place of worship;
(C) school;
(D) library;
(E) recreational facility;
(F) hospital;
(G) community health center, including any health care facility or
community-based program licensed by the Maryland Department of
Health;
(H) long-term facility, including any licensed nursing home, group
home, or care home; [or]
(I) multipurpose exhibition facility, such as a fairgrounds or conference
center; or
(J) childcare facility;
(2) government building, including any place owned by or under the control of
the County;
(3) polling place;
(4) courthouse;
(5) legislative assembly; or
(6) a gathering of individuals to collectively express their constitutional right
to protest or assemble.
A “place of public assembly” includes all property associated with the place, such
as a parking lot or grounds of a building.

Staff report attached, for context.

I think it would be incredibly effective and useful to have a large poster board map of Downtown Bethesda which shows all of these “places of public assembly” with marked 100-yard zones from them overlaid on it.

The same should be done for Rockville and other areas of Montgomery County.

These could be shown in any future proceeding or litigation to illustrate the actual scope of these restrictions.

 

[Sunrise]

Unfortunately, the only way to really stop this kind of abuse is for SCOTUS to better define sensitive places as "places with armed security and metal detectors". I mean, think about it: if it's sensitive, you guard it and check people coming in. If you're not doing that, it's clearly not sensitive. I know I'm preaching to the choir here, it just drives me crazy to see MoCo trying to tell me the park around the corner is equivalent to the local courthouse.

Indeed. DC wound up repealing its "20 round rule" when sued by Heller: https://thereload.com/dc-repeals-gun-carry-ammunition-limit-hands-heller-another-legal-win/

DC actually folded on it before any legal precedent was set by litigation. The Police Chief's statement on it reflecting their concerns about "accruing liability for legal fees" is really something.

The same thing needs to happen here, and I think MoCo will blink on it as well.

 

[swinokur]

Mo Co will not blink because of money. They have more money than sense


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[Sunrise]

Mo Co will not blink because of money. They have more money than sense


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DC saw the writing on the wall and realized what was headed their way. I predict the same will happen with the 10 Round Magazine Limit and the prohibition to carry on Metro.

Maybe we'll be surprised with MoCo when they're put to the test.

 

[swinokur]

Mo Co has more money to piss away than DC. Like NY they will go down swinging .

Liberalism is a religion to them. I lived there for 50 years

But I share your optimism


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[RFBfromDE]

MOCO will try to ruin the lives of as many wrong thinking non party members as they can before being reversed after appeal.

Destroying disobedient nonconformists is worth the investment to them.

 

[swinokur]

^^^^^^^^^^

This


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[Doctor_M]

What a bunch of clowns

Petty tyrants. EVERY LAST ONE.

You got to love the thought process. Don't get me wrong, we'd like to ban everything everywhere, but we may be limited in how much tyranny we can shove down people's throats all at once. What a reprehensible peanut gallery.

 

[Occam]

MOCO will try to ruin the lives of as many wrong thinking non party members as they can before being reversed after appeal.

Destroying disobedient nonconformists is worth the investment to them.

Yes. It’s impossible to overstate the degree to which MoCo power players viscerally, personally hate people like us. They go out of their way to find low hanging punitive fruit that they’re pretty sure will only hurt us. This sounds hyperbolic but it’s literally true. They act like vindictive twelve year olds with new-found power. Fueled by your money.

 

[Doctor_M]

How does this skirt state preemption on firearms laws?

 

[swinokur]

4-209 doesn’t prohibit counties from designating or defining places of public assembly


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