Let's Talk Drop In Triggers...

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  • Bertfish

    Throw bread on me
    Mar 13, 2013
    12,954
    White Marsh, MD
    It's probably the trigger, and by that I mean, not necessarily the type of trigger.
    I'd try an ALG ACT trigger if you don't mind spending that kind of money on a milspec trigger. They are as strong as a milspec but lack that gritty-grindy feel of a milspec.

    Or...

    If it is a drop-in you seek, Rise Armament makes one for PCCs as well. I little pricey, comparatively speaking, but not ridiculously so.

    https://risearmament.com/product/rise-armament-blitz-trigger/

    Is the ACT rated for PCC use?

    Geiselle is always the name which comes to mind
     

    outrider58

    Who asked ya?
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    37,021
    Is the ACT rated for PCC use?

    Geiselle is always the name which comes to mind

    Not that I've read, though they are sturdy FCGs and I wouldn't hesitate using one in a PCC situation.

    As for Geissele, AFAIK, they don't make a PCC rated FCG nor will they honor any warrant for failures applied to PCC use.

    I have a Geissele in a PCC/pistol(direct blowback) build that has over 2K rounds on it without any issues, but I know full well that if it breaks, it's on me. I have just recently converted that pistol into a delayed buffer system.
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    12,823
    Rockville, MD
    Not that I've read, though they are sturdy FCGs and I wouldn't hesitate using one in a PCC situation.

    As for Geissele, AFAIK, they don't make a PCC rated FCG nor will they honor any warrant for failures applied to PCC use.

    I have a Geissele in a PCC/pistol(direct blowback) build that has over 2K rounds on it without any issues, but I know full well that if it breaks, it's on me.
    https://geissele.com/super-mpx-ssa-m4-curved-trigger.html

    This may be what you seek.

    Sent from my SM-G981U1 using Tapatalk
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    12,823
    Rockville, MD
    I thought they were Sig specific and or not rated for DBB operation.
    The MPX's operation is way, way rougher on hammers than direct blowback is. This is why you see the standard Timney in the MPX has a hammer limiter structure (and so does the Geissele MPX trigger, if you look closely). The MPX uses a standard FCG otherwise (and, indeed, the Hiperfire Eclipse is a very popular trigger in those guns).
     

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    16,118
    PA
    Some triggers will wear out on a harsh blowback AR9, but there is a lot of mass moving around, and they can be prone to bump firing, or hammer follow if the sear gets bumped. Had this issue with a Timney Calvin Elite and impact. Had good luck with The Geissele GRF single stage on a couple AR9s, but got a lot of hammer follow on a short stroke build with a Taccom ESS BCG. Short stroke resets the hammer in a shorter distance, allowing a 2" stroke to limit recoil and dot movement, but it's even harder on triggers than blowback normally is. Went with a hiperfire PDI, and it has run great, full width hammer, but has a crash pad to help with PCCs, and enough sear contact to make it reliable in the short stroke. Feels pretty good too, 2# break, solid reset, and well made, unlike the Hipertouch triggers it works with Radian Talon selectors.
     
    Last edited:

    outrider58

    Who asked ya?
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    37,021
    The MPX's operation is way, way rougher on hammers than direct blowback is. This is why you see the standard Timney in the MPX has a hammer limiter structure (and so does the Geissele MPX trigger, if you look closely). The MPX uses a standard FCG otherwise (and, indeed, the Hiperfire Eclipse is a very popular trigger in those guns).

    Some triggers will wear out on a harsh blowback AR9, but there is a lot of mass moving around, and they can be prone to bump firing, or hammer follow if the sear gets bumped. Had this issue with a Timney Calvin Elite and impact. Had good luck with The Geissele GRF single stage on a couple AE9s, but got a lot of hammer follow on a short stroke build with a Taccom ESS BCG. Short stroke resets the hammer in a shorter distance, allowing a 2" stroke to limit recoil and dot movement, but it's even harder on triggers than blowback normally is. Went with a hiperfire PDI, and it has run great, full width hammer, but has a crash pad to help with PCCs, and enough sear contact to make it reliable in the short stroke. Feels pretty good too, 2# break, solid reset, and well made, unlike the Hipertouch triggers it works with Radian Talon selectors.

    Thanks gents. I've been waiting for your input. :rolleyes: :D :thumbsup:
     

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    16,118
    PA
    Thanks gents. I've been waiting for your input. :rolleyes: :D :thumbsup:

    Battlehawk Armory and Locked&Loaded have the PDI for $125-ish, the trigger is unique from most others in that it has a 1/2 cock safety catch, and if it gets bumped off of the sear, it won't fire. The bumper pad, like some other designs keeps the hammer from getting smashed into the disconnector. The only real downsides are somewhat common to cartridge triggers in general, the small working area can get jammed up with debris that would likely shake out of a mil-spec, it requires anti-walk pins, and it has a spring and plunger that pushes down on top of the selector barrel to take slack out of the trigger, but this leaves the trigger with a tiny bit of play and movement, can't tell hen shooting though. Compared to some of the best triggers it has a little more travel and longer reset, still way better than milspec, but this is from the ample sear engagement that keeps it running as a PCC beats on it.

    Have a couple other options that work, the ATC AR gold runs in everything, including PCCs, it's a single stage with a really light and short takeup, like the tiny bit of "slack" in a 1911 trigger. It's good, it's fast, it's reliable, and it's in my competition PCC with several thousand trouble free rounds. the ONLY problem is the trigger shoe is really thin, I jammed a spare trigger shoe from one of my Timeny Calvin elites on it, and it's great, but kinda uncomfortable without that.

    The Hiperfire Hipertouch series are loved in PCC competition, they have a similar feel to the PDI, but are multi-peice with springs that cam-over to both hit harder and take weight off the pull, also more expensive. They run, and really only occasionally break the toggle spring yoke at high round counts, but Hiperfire will fix that for free. As a bonus, the action uses the first 1/2" of rearward carrier travel to reset the heavy toggle springs, and it kinda has a mild "delayed blowback" action as you have about 10# of added spring pressure on top of the recoil spring for that first bit of movement. It is barely noticeable unless you shoot 2 identical PCCs back to back, one with a hipertouch, 1 without, but primarily seems to cut down on gas in the face.
     

    calicojack

    American Sporting Rifle
    MDS Supporter
    May 29, 2018
    3,627
    East Bumfkgypt
    Is the ACT rated for PCC use?

    Geiselle is always the name which comes to mind

    Last I checked, Geiselle voids the warranty if you use their trigger in a PCC. When I wrote them to ask about it, they recommended I use the ALG trigger instead. Let me see if I find the actual email.
     

    teratos

    My hair is amazing
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 22, 2009
    45,133
    Bel Air
    Last I checked, Geiselle voids the warranty if you use their trigger in a PCC. When I wrote them to ask about it, they recommended I use the ALG trigger instead. Let me see if I find the actual email.

    I used an SSA-E in a 9mm shortie for years. It had a 9 ounce buffer in front of a 308 Tubbs flat wire spring. That trigger took a beating. Now I have the Scheel system on that rifle. The trigger is happier, I’m sure, but it never complained.
     

    calicojack

    American Sporting Rifle
    MDS Supporter
    May 29, 2018
    3,627
    East Bumfkgypt
    If you want to use a Geisselle in a PCC, check here under notes https://geissele.com/super-semi-automatic-ssar-trigger.html

    Super Semi-Automatic (SSA®) Trigger Notes
    Please note, our triggers are designed for mil-spec AR15/M4 carbine rifles. Our AR15 triggers are not compatible with the Sig MPX/MCX weapons or Pistol Caliber Carbine AR15/M4 variants. Using them in these platforms will void the warranty. Please refer to our Super MCX SSA or Super MPX SSA if you are using these platforms.
     

    calicojack

    American Sporting Rifle
    MDS Supporter
    May 29, 2018
    3,627
    East Bumfkgypt
    I used an SSA-E in a 9mm shortie for years. It had a 9 ounce buffer in front of a 308 Tubbs flat wire spring. That trigger took a beating. Now I have the Scheel system on that rifle. The trigger is happier, I’m sure, but it never complained.

    I believe you - just relaying what Geissele's position is on the matter.
     

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    16,118
    PA
    If you want to use a Geisselle in a PCC, check here under notes https://geissele.com/super-semi-automatic-ssar-trigger.html

    Super Semi-Automatic (SSA®) Trigger Notes
    Please note, our triggers are designed for mil-spec AR15/M4 carbine rifles. Our AR15 triggers are not compatible with the Sig MPX/MCX weapons or Pistol Caliber Carbine AR15/M4 variants. Using them in these platforms will void the warranty. Please refer to our Super MCX SSA or Super MPX SSA if you are using these platforms.

    LOL, just like reloads will void the warranty of every firearm on the planet, and 99% of them say not to carry it while loaded. A PCC can be harsh to triggers, less so with a long stroke and ramped BCG. Some geometry might double or have hammer follow, but if there is an actual problem with the trigger, Geissele should fix or replace it. I run a couple Geissele GRFs in AR9s and like them for that purpose
     

    calicojack

    American Sporting Rifle
    MDS Supporter
    May 29, 2018
    3,627
    East Bumfkgypt
    Course there is always LaRue and they have no such restriction.
     

    calicojack

    American Sporting Rifle
    MDS Supporter
    May 29, 2018
    3,627
    East Bumfkgypt
    I actually am interested in a PCC (I almost typed PPC) trigger. I have a couple Timney triggers that I REALLY like and am inclined to be the Timney PCC trigger guinea pig. That being said, you guys like Rave PCC trigger? The Elftmann trigger I referenced above is adjustable. IDK , I like the "curved" Timney trigger because it's almost flat, and I actually like the flat triggers (with a little hook on the end) for single stage. I like the CMC 9mm trigger I have in my Foxtrot Mike 9mm, but I want something more industrial strength for the 45. I think Timney is the ticket.
     
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