House Bill 450, AW Ban Passed

[G O B]

Thank God I migrated to Texas!

 

[ArSoNZ28]

I’ve got a family friend who is in the process of doing a notarized statement of what he owned prior to the ban going into effect in lieu of the state “voluntary certificate of possession”. Would that be a good idea, bad idea, anyone got recommendations?

DE copied the Connecticut law that made the certificate a requirement. I don't know how/if they knows how it's going to work here being optional. The burden of proof of grandfathering seems to be left up to the owner, and with no access to actual 4473 forms that may be difficult. I've somehow managed to keep the Maryland paperwork for many of my firearms but some (AR10's PS90...) didn't require the forms. Many were transferred with cash and don't even have a receipt. Online receipts from purchases don’t list the serial numbers for the firearms or exact date it was transferred at a dealer.

 

[Doctor_M]

At least they didn't ban the AS-007.

 

[smokey]

That may be the case in MD, which I think states that if it has 2 or more features it’s considered banned… but DE seems to have taken it a step further and said that even just 1 feature (even just a flash suppressor) is enough to get it on the banned list as a “copycat weapon”.



I WANT to be wrong on this, but from how I’m reading it, that’s my takeaway. Even just having a flash suppressor is a no-go.

Looks like someone needs to produce an AR grip that is canted off to the side, so that the hand isn't "directly under" the action.

 

[Lmo]

I have a M1 carbine with threaded barrel and flash suppressor. Need to have the threaded barrel to hold the suppressor on. Two strikes against me. If I move to Delaware, it would be illegal once HB 450 is signed.

 

[Lmo]

I have been wondering about transport issues not addressed in HB 450. I own a legal semi-automatic M1 carbine on MD that would be illegal in Delaware under HB 450.

If I cross the line into Delaware on I-95 to get to New England and get stopped for a moving violation, could I be charged for not having a Delaware assault weapon certificate of possession and also for illegally transporting the rifle outside of the VERY limited provisions of HB 450? HB 450 does not address the issues of Interstate transportation of firearms.

 

[Mark75H]

I have been wondering about transport issues not addressed in HB 450. I own a legal semi-automatic M1 carbine on MD that would be illegal in Delaware under HB 450.

If I cross the line into Delaware on I-95 to get to New England and get stopped for a moving violation, could I be charged for not having a Delaware assault weapon certificate of possession and also for illegally transporting the rifle outside of the VERY limited provisions of HB 450? HB 450 does not address the issues of Interstate transportation of firearms.

FOPA covers interstate transport.

 

[Clump]

From DSSA:

The following is being provided as a service to our members. The following is our opinion and is being provided for your information, only. It MAY NOT BE RELIED UPON AS LEGAL ADVICE. You are strongly advised to seek independent legal counsel BEFORE taking any action concerning the contents of HB 450 or this Alert. ​

Read HB 450 w/HA 1

​

Late on the evening of Jun 16, 2022, the Delaware Senate voted to approve HB 450 with House Amendment #1 and sent it to Governor Carney’s desk for signature. As of this Alert, HB 450 has not yet become the law of the land – but it will – probably very soon. Governor Carney, like his fellow Democrats who voted for this bill in both the House and Senate, has nothing but contempt for you, your rights and your guns. Expect him to sign it.

Based upon our reading of HB 450 as amended by HA 1 we believe the following to be true:

1. HB 450 will become law and become effective the moment the Governor signs it.

2. In addition to the 63 firearms specifically listed in the bill, HB 450 also bans

a. All Semi-auto rifles with a detachable magazine – ALL

b. All semi-auto shotguns with a folding or telescoping stock – ALL

c. All pistols with any one (1) of the following – detachable magazine

outside the grip, threaded barrel, barrel shroud.

d. All shotguns with a revolving cylinder

e. All pistols and centerfire rifles with a fixed magazine that can hold more than 17 rounds.

3. You can keep what you currently own at the effective date, but they become worthless – you cannot sell them.

4. You may not transport one of the banned firearms into the State – once it’s out you can never bring it back. No one from outside the State can bring one into the State.

5. You cannot buy one of those firearms in another state and bring it into the State.

6. If you owned one of the firearms but kept it out of state, you may not bring it into Delaware after the effective date.

7. You may not sell, offer for sale, transfer, purchase, receive or possess one of the banned firearms after the effective date – except you can keep what you had on or before the effective date.

8. An FFL can sell or service those firearms to or for a law enforcement agency

9. An FFL can sell out of State – but not in-state – pursuant to federal law

10. An FFL can return a firearm to its lawful owner (meaning (s)he owned it before the effective date) if the FFL had it for repairs.

11. An FFL can keep what (s)he had before the effective date.

12.The burden is on you to prove that you owned the firearm on or before the effective date.

13. If you owned/possessed on or before the effective date you may possess it at home, your place of business, on other property you own or on property where the owner gives you express permission, at a shooting range, other specifically specified events – see the bill.

14. You may transport the firearm between any of the legally permissible places but you may only do so if the firearm is cased and locked.

15. You may not carry, either openly or concealed, one of the banned firearms for self-protection or for protection of your family.



The list above is just a brief overview of HB 450. There is more to this bill. Again, you MAY NOT rely on this synopsis of HB 450 for legal purposes. You SHOULD seek legal counsel before taking any action with regard to HB 450. Read The bill for yourself.



We sincerely hope that you will find the information which we have provided as a service to our members to be helpful.

CALL TO ACTION​

1. Call or contact Governor Carney and ask him to veto HB 450 – he won’t do it, but ask him anyway. He knows this bill is unconstitutional on a number of issues so he should veto this bill. 302-744-4101 or 302-577-3210; or facebook.com/JohnCarneyDe/ ;or Twitter.com/johncarneyde/; or Instagram.com/johncarneyde/



2. DSSA has retained legal counsel and is preparing to challenge HB 450 in court – WE NEED YOUR HELP! Please donate and help us fight for your rights.





Lawsuits are expensive – and HB 450 isn’t the only unconstitutional bill the Democrats have rammed through the General Assembly this year that must be fought in the Courts.

 

[daggo66]

Try to Open Carry in MD. See how far you get.

Open carry is actually legal in MD with a wear and carry permit.

 

[Sundazes]

Open carry is actually legal in MD with a wear and carry permit.

Doesn't make it smart to do though.

 

[19mace92]

Doesn't make it smart to do though.

Agreed. Delaware is open carry without a permit. I hate it. Makes people nervous when they see it. It can cause panic in some cases which may or may not turn out well when a cop gets on scene after being told about an individual walking around with a gun.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[smdub]

Agreed. Delaware is open carry without a permit. I hate it. Makes people nervous when they see it. It can cause panic in some cases which may or may not turn out well when a cop gets on scene after being told about an individual walking around with a gun.

BGOS. Visit the free world. At somewhere like a Sheetz near Fredericksburg VA about 1/4 of the ppl I see are open carry (and who knows how many concealed.) No one bats an eye.

 

[Sundazes]

BGOS. Visit the free world. At somewhere like a Sheetz near Fredericksburg VA about 1/4 of the ppl I see are open carry (and who knows how many concealed.) No one bats an eye.

While it may be BGOS, it is the fact of life around here. This area is NOT free America. I agree with people wanting to do whats legal, but you will most likely get a visit from a badged member of the community.

 

[19mace92]

BGOS. Visit the free world. At somewhere like a Sheetz near Fredericksburg VA about 1/4 of the ppl I see are open carry (and who knows how many concealed.) No one bats an eye.

I'm all for exercising one's freedoms and rights, however, given a choice between concealing a firearm and open carrying, I would argue concealment is a more responsible decision all day long.

Open carry is a great way to make yourself a target. Certain training environments teach Boyd's OODA loop. Observe Orient Decide, and Act. The process your mind goes through between the moment that a threat appears to the moment you act on that threat. By open carrying, you've made yourself an obvious target, therefore, allowing the threat the opportunity to observe, orient, and decide what to do about you before your brain even starts to run through its own OODA loop. You've now given up a massive amount of tactical advantage before you even know anything is going wrong.

 

[smdub]

I understand the tactical advantage of concealment. But it would take a first class idiot to try to rob anywhere w/ a ton of ppl open carrying (and unknown additional concealed.) Yes, people try to shoot up police stations were EVERYONE is open carrying but its not the norm.
Its sort of like vaccine herd immunity. At some percentage level of open carry, you are pretty f-in safe. You are not an 'obvious target' when everyone around you is the exact same.
I know MD and DE don't fall into these scenarios (yet), but you don't have to go far to see it exhibited.
I still submit its a form of BGOS.

 

[6-Pack]

Open carry is actually legal in MD with a wear and carry permit.

Open carry of a rifle/shotgun is legal too, but no permit is required. If you read the statute carefully, it says you need a permit for a handgun, but it never mentions rifles or shotguns. In fact, Frosh admitted as much when he was fighting against shall issue.

 

[chilipeppermaniac]

While it may be BGOS, it is the fact of life around here. This area is NOT free America. I agree with people wanting to do whats legal, but you will most likely get a visit from a badged member of the community.

Speaking of a visit. BOY did I open a can of worms one day during a particularly stressful time dealing with Bureaucrats about violating the " operating a junk yard" cease owning and having untagged vehicles on my own property in Carroll.

I had just spent a week traveling between Carroll and South Jersey to haul a greenhouse frame home, so I could erect a cheap temporary building to house my collection. Put in a call to the Zoning office to converse with the MAN. I was informed by the office lady that he was gone for the day. Then she asked if she could help me. I mentioned that I was calling to inform him about my plan to erect a structure for the cars, at which time she asks, do I want her to tell me the setbacks, regulations yadda yadda? She then spouts off distances from property lines, center of road etc. And I tell her, hell, even our houses don't conform in how close they are. Then I said, "thanks anyway, if those are the regs,,, I'm screwed."

When she asked me, if there was anything else,,,,,,,,,,,,,, and I responded, " not unless you have the 800 number for the Suicide Prevention Hotline, we were through."

 

[chilipeppermaniac]

I had called Zoning from my buddy's office in Manchester, 10 minutes from home. As I was headed in to my neighborhood, I happened to see 2 Sheriff's cars pass me heading toward Manchester about a mile away from my place. Once I arrived home, my fiancee in Arbutus called to see if I was ok. As she said some Balto County police paid her a visit to check on me, and said Carroll County had also been looking for me. Then said, they now needed me to do a Pow Wow or else possibly take a ride with the men in white suits and butterfly nets.

Needless to say, The Carroll County sheriffs gave me a questioning and asked more than just a few times if I wasn't sure I didn't want to have a little chat with a crisis worker.

By the time he and I finished our conversation, I think he understood I had just made a flippant comment due to a slip in judgement caused by being hassled by a Karen who called the Zoning on me to " comply" with the BS law about tagging vehicles. How I had been steadily acquiring materials to house and fence in my property to make the cars essentially disappear and comply and really just needed to catch a break. At this, he even offered to grab an end of some of my 6foot x12 foot chain link sections of fencing and set them in the places I was storing them in till fence building time.

Imagine, if we could see the unexpected results from a few seconds of questionable speak. LOL
I never saw 2 cop departments would worry about little ol me like they did.

 

[lazybones]

Open carry is a great way to make yourself a target. Certain training environments teach Boyd's OODA loop. Observe Orient Decide, and Act. The process your mind goes through between the moment that a threat appears to the moment you act on that threat. By open carrying, you've made yourself an obvious target, therefore, allowing the threat the opportunity to observe, orient, and decide what to do about you before your brain even starts to run through its own OODA loop. You've now given up a massive amount of tactical advantage before you even know anything is going wrong.

Thanks for the video link. It is important to understand the mental loops and processes involved before ending up in a crisis situation. Deciding to carry is the easy part. Making the right decisions after that is something completely different.

 

[BlackInjun]

Just like here in MD Colt AR15 H-bar does not fall under the bill