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Guess where I carried megathread

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  • camo556

    Active Member
    Aug 29, 2021
    2,634
    COMAR regulations are pretty clear- no firearms on State property (and the State owns the entre airport and surrounding parking lots, roads, pathways and so on) per:

    COMAR 04.05.01.03B. Except for official purposes and by authorized personnel, an individual on the property may not carry open or concealed firearms, explosives, incendiary devices, or dangerous or deadly weapons.
    That section of COMAR only refers to "A. "Property" means State public buildings, improvements, grounds, and multiservice centers under the jurisdiction of the Department of General Services."


    Important to read COMAR and statutes in context.
     

    antco

    Active Member
    Apr 28, 2010
    6,256
    Calvert, MD
    I’m no expert in reading legalese or COMAR’s, but it looks to me your link applies only to the restricted side of the airport.


    11.03.01.09

    .09 Airport Security.​

    A. Restricted Areas. An individual entering any restricted area on the Airport requires the authorization of the Administration.

    B. Security Regulations.

    (1) Tampering or interfering with the lock or security access electronics of any door, window, gate, or other opening leading to the air operations area or any other restricted area at the Airport, or breaching any other security device is prohibited except under emergency conditions.

    (2) Interference with security procedures or violation of security regulations or directives is prohibited.

    (3) It is unlawful for an individual to knowingly and willingly enter an aircraft or an Airport restricted area including the air operations area, contrary to security requirements established by the federal government or the State.

    C. Weapons.

    (1) Weapons, except those properly packaged for shipment, are prohibited.

    (2) Exceptions to §C(1) of this regulation are:

    (a) Law enforcement officers of the federal government, of the State of Maryland, its political subdivisions, and of the Maryland Aviation Administration and any other State agency, if weapons are required in performance of their duties;

    (b) Enplaning and deplaning passengers authorized by 49 CFR §1544.219 to carry weapons aboard aircraft; and

    (c) Uniformed employees of licensed armored transport services under contract to any tenant of the Airport carrying handguns when actually transporting monies or valuables.

    (3) Discharge of any weapon on the Airport except in the performance of official duties or in the lawful defense of life or property is prohibited.

    (4) Furnishing, giving, selling, or trading any weapon or simulated weapon on the Airport is prohibited. Toys sold by Airport concessionaires and approved by the Administration are excepted from this regulation.
     

    BurtonRW

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 19, 2007
    838
    Pasadena
    I’m no expert in reading legalese or COMAR’s, but it looks to me your link applies only to the restricted side of the airport.


    11.03.01.09

    .09 Airport Security.​

    A. Restricted Areas. An individual entering any restricted area on the Airport requires the authorization of the Administration.

    B. Security Regulations.

    (1) Tampering or interfering with the lock or security access electronics of any door, window, gate, or other opening leading to the air operations area or any other restricted area at the Airport, or breaching any other security device is prohibited except under emergency conditions.

    (2) Interference with security procedures or violation of security regulations or directives is prohibited.

    (3) It is unlawful for an individual to knowingly and willingly enter an aircraft or an Airport restricted area including the air operations area, contrary to security requirements established by the federal government or the State.

    C. Weapons.

    (1) Weapons, except those properly packaged for shipment, are prohibited.

    (2) Exceptions to §C(1) of this regulation are:

    (a) Law enforcement officers of the federal government, of the State of Maryland, its political subdivisions, and of the Maryland Aviation Administration and any other State agency, if weapons are required in performance of their duties;

    (b) Enplaning and deplaning passengers authorized by 49 CFR §1544.219 to carry weapons aboard aircraft; and

    (c) Uniformed employees of licensed armored transport services under contract to any tenant of the Airport carrying handguns when actually transporting monies or valuables.

    (3) Discharge of any weapon on the Airport except in the performance of official duties or in the lawful defense of life or property is prohibited.

    (4) Furnishing, giving, selling, or trading any weapon or simulated weapon on the Airport is prohibited. Toys sold by Airport concessionaires and approved by the Administration are excepted from this regulation.
    But how? C is not subordinate to A. It is directly under .09 Airport Security.
     

    BurkeM

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2014
    889
    Baltimore
    That section of COMAR only refers to "A. "Property" means State public buildings, improvements, grounds, and multiservice centers under the jurisdiction of the Department of General Services."


    Important to read COMAR and statutes in context.
    The entire BWI complex is State owned property. The terminal (all of it) is a State public building.

    from:

    Real Estate

    The Department of General Services is responsible for establishing policy, and directing and coordinating the acquisition, disposal, valuation and leasing of real property for all state agencies with the exception of the Department of Transportation which is responsible for its own acquisition and disposal.

    However, it's possible I'm reading the regulation incorrectly.

    Feel free to contact Maryland Transportation Authority Police for their position on the question. Their officers patrol the entire airport - inside and outside the SIDA.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------

    Baltimore/Washington International Thurgood Marshall Airport

     

    joppaj

    Sheepdog
    Staff member
    Moderator
    Apr 11, 2008
    42,064
    MD
    I REALLY thought I saw the "no weapons" signs posted on the doors last time I was there, but I may be wrong. It's happened before.
     

    BurkeM

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2014
    889
    Baltimore
    That section of COMAR only refers to "A. "Property" means State public buildings, improvements, grounds, and multiservice centers under the jurisdiction of the Department of General Services."


    Important to read COMAR and statutes in context.
    In quite a bit of research over the years, I can't find ANY property that's not under DGS jurisdiction in Maryland. DGS even retains jurisdiction over the Military Department and all State National Guard Armories.
     

    camo556

    Active Member
    Aug 29, 2021
    2,634
    The entire BWI complex is State owned property. The terminal (all of it) is a State public building.

    from:

    Real Estate

    The Department of General Services is responsible for establishing policy, and directing and coordinating the acquisition, disposal, valuation and leasing of real property for all state agencies with the exception of the Department of Transportation which is responsible for its own acquisition and disposal.

    However, it's possible I'm reading the regulation incorrectly.
    It literally says in your quote "with the exception of the Department of Transportation which is responsible for its own acquisition and disposal."

    BWI is under the jurisdiction of the Dept of Transportation.

    Those rules are in a different part of COMAR, posted upthread.
     

    BurkeM

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2014
    889
    Baltimore
    It literally says in your quote "with the exception of the Department of Transportation which is responsible for its own acquisition and disposal."

    BWI is under the jurisdiction of the Dept of Transportation.

    Those rules are in a different part of COMAR, posted upthread.
    The exception is ONLY for "acquisition and disposal" of real estate.

    DOT falls under DGS for all other purposes, and DOT has its own codes that prohibit firearms other than the specific exceptions.

    DOT and DGS make no allowances for the HGP.

    IMHO.
     

    Stoveman

    TV Personality
    Patriot Picket
    Sep 2, 2013
    23,467
    Cuba on the Chesapeake
    COMAR regulations are pretty clear- no firearms on State property (and the State owns the entre airport and surrounding parking lots, roads, pathways and so on) per:

    COMAR 04.05.01.03B.
    Except for official purposes and by authorized personnel, an individual on the property may not carry open or concealed firearms, explosives, incendiary devices, or dangerous or deadly weapons.

    You might not be prosecuted, but you will be directed to leave the property if discovered to be carrying. TSA also has jurisdiction over the entire terminal, and they are also looking for firearms, ammunition and explosives. It would not be pleasant if a K-9 alerted on you for explosive residue.

    In the traffic loop, you're unlikely to be noticed if staying in your vehicle.

    TSA Fines

    Under federal law, the TSA has the authority to assess civil penalties of up to $13,000 for weapons violations. Typically, a first offense for carrying a handgun into a checkpoint is $3,900.

    In 2019, the TSA confiscated 4,432 guns at security checkpoints in US airports nationwide. 87% percent of those guns were loaded. With the total number of guns consociated up 7% since 2017, more and more people each year are forgetting their firearms in their carry-on baggage.

    According to former TSA federal security director at Midway Airport, Kevin McCarthy, Most people just forget . . [t]he two most common excuses are, ‘I didn’t know it was there’ and ‘I just forgot.’ The ones we’ve encountered don’t have any ill intent.
    By that logic there would be no carry allowed on state owned roads.
     

    GTOGUNNER

    IANAL, PATRIOT PICKET!!
    Patriot Picket
    Dec 16, 2010
    5,148
    Carroll County!
    Trooper I swear i wasn’t appendix carrying at the rest stop. I had an pop up erection.


    Sent from an undisclosed location.
     

    Stoveman

    TV Personality
    Patriot Picket
    Sep 2, 2013
    23,467
    Cuba on the Chesapeake
    After tonight's posts in this thread I'm going to change my party affiliation to D and fake my death so I can vote Squaregrouper multiple times in the next MSI election.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    41,268
    Glen Burnie
    Where do you see that?

    I’d love to have overlooked something and be wrong.

    -Rob
    Cfr 1544.219 deals with Leo's flying armed. Meaning who can carry on aircraft. That has to do with the secure side of the airport.
    That would have no bearing pre security. Why even have it mentioned?
    It has to with SIDA... Secured Identification Display Areas of an airport.
     

    BurtonRW

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 19, 2007
    838
    Pasadena
    Cfr 1544.219 deals with Leo's flying armed. Meaning who can carry on aircraft. That has to do with the secure side of the airport.
    That would have no bearing pre security. Why even have it mentioned?
    It has to with SIDA... Secured Identification Display Areas of an airport.
    And that has absolutely no bearing on the COMAR section I referenced.

    -Rob
     

    sbmike

    Active Member
    Feb 19, 2011
    1,592
    Almost Heaven, WV
    Living in West Virginia, I finally had a need to drive up to Fredrick today at lunch. It was nice not having to plan ahead and make sure I was not armed.
    I hope you actually have a MD CCW permit because if you don't, it is still illegal for you to carry in MD. No reciprocty between WV and MD and probably not likely anytime soon. It's sadly ironic that MDers, whether they have a CCW permit or not, can legally open or concealed carry in WV, but not the other way around.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    41,268
    Glen Burnie
    And that has absolutely no bearing on the COMAR section I referenced.

    -Rob
    Yes. Airport Security. Those few exemptions have to do with the SIDA portions of the airport. Past security and inside the whole fence line around the airport. There is no outside "airport security" per se.
    LEO's flying armed do not need an exemption to be on the airport grounds pre security, only inside SIDA. There would be no need to list that exemption.
     

    BurtonRW

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 19, 2007
    838
    Pasadena
    Yes. Airport Security. Those few exemptions have to do with the SIDA portions of the airport. Past security and inside the whole fence line around the airport. There is no outside "airport security" per se.
    LEO's flying armed do not need an exemption to be on the airport grounds pre security, only inside SIDA. There would be no need to list that exemption.
    Okay, so you're reading the entire section ".09 Airport Security" as applying only to the secure areas (SIDA) of the airport.

    I don't read it that way and would certainly not advise a client that their Maryland permit was valid outside of security. Maybe you're right. The problem is, we can't ask MDTA (we all know how well they interpret the law). So... the best we're likely to get is an unofficial opinion from someone in the AG's office. I still wouldn't want to be the test case based on the way that section of COMAR is written.

    Again - not trying to pick a fight, and I'd love to be wrong. It would be very convenient for me if I was.

    -Rob
     

    eruby

    Confederate Jew
    MDS Supporter
    I will either stay in the car with gun on hip, while The Boss loads her luggage in the trunk, or I will get out of the car, with gun on hip, and load the luggage in the trunk, or I will be unarmed, and rely on the goodwill of my fellow man, and the forbearance of reptiles, and get out of the car and load the luggage in the trunk.

    Regardless, I'll be cracking foxy with a snoot-full of high end hooch.

    Or smack in my veins.

    Or both.
     

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