Call Out Instructors Providing Incorrect Info

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  • Apr 10, 2020
    108
    Something that may be holding someone back from lighting up the source of their training is the risk that the trainer gets nuked by the state, and now your permit is invalidated. Not sure if that's a thing, but when I saw the UTMs for the live-fire part at WaS I was thinking, "ohhhh boy, I hope I'm not going to lose my permit down the road and be out $350 if they get their certs yanked". It feels like you're acting against your own self-interest to speak up about problems you see in the mandatory training.

    I've wondered if this would happen. I've had people tell me things like "this person I know is taking a class and they said they can do it in 8 hours". To which I told them to be careful with that, because I'd imagine if the instructor gets caught all their students might be jammed up and loose their permit. Then you'll need to spend the money all over again.

    I wouldn't put anything past government.
     
    Apr 10, 2020
    108
    Are there MSP certified instructors offering classes less than 16 hours?

    If so, that's stupid of them.

    And if an instructor is going to give out false/wrong info, and make up requirements on the fly, it would be really stupid to do so in a course advertised as less than 16 hours.

    I don't have first hand knowledge, but I've heard of it through friends of friends kind of thing. I wouldn't put it past people at all. They want their cake and to eat it too right? They want that easy $350 from the student but they probably have no insurance if anything happens, maybe using a range that doesn't know they're doing a class for someone and making money. Shorten the class some and you can still salvage some of your weekend. Students probably wont mind getting out of class early, and they'll keep their mouth shut because they don't want to get in trouble either.
     

    Boondock Saint

    W&C Application Data: https://tinyurl.com/42xwvkht
    Dec 11, 2008
    22,051
    White Marsh
    I've wondered if this would happen. I've had people tell me things like "this person I know is taking a class and they said they can do it in 8 hours". To which I told them to be careful with that, because I'd imagine if the instructor gets caught all their students might be jammed up and loose their permit. Then you'll need to spend the money all over again.

    I wouldn't put anything past government.

    A Zoom call with MSP firearms registration commander confirmed that instructors who skirt the time requirement could lose their QHIC license for a year. Additionally, those who received training from that instructor might have to re-take the course to keep their permit.
     
    Apr 10, 2020
    108
    A Zoom call with MSP firearms registration commander confirmed that instructors who skirt the time requirement could lose their QHIC license for a year. Additionally, those who received training from that instructor might have to re-take the course to keep their permit.

    Good to know, if I hear anyone else mention this I'll be sure to pass that along. I don't like the requirements, but trying to skirt them just makes it worse. You're potentially hurting yourself, your students and all the instructors who are doing it right.
     

    ICW2019

    Member
    Mar 8, 2012
    312
    Eastern Shore
    Are there MSP certified instructors offering classes less than 16 hours?

    If so, that's stupid of them.

    And if an instructor is going to give out false/wrong info, and make up requirements on the fly, it would be really stupid to do so in a course advertised as less than 16 hours.
    Ive been told several on the eastern shore at least.
     

    Mark75H

    HVAC Expert
    Industry Partner
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 25, 2011
    14,817
    Outside the Gates
    No time cheating in my part of the Eastern Shore. If you take a class from me, it’s the real deal full 16 hours. I include enough relevant class material and range exercises such that there is no dead time. I try to group my students by experience and skill level so those with higher knowledge and skill level aren’t bored. I can’t always do that but I try to when I can. Some of my classes have had a full eight hours of shooting. If you have to spend 16 hours with me, you might as well get your money’s worth.
     

    pcfixer

    Active Member
    May 24, 2009
    5,275
    Marylandstan
    On Maryland Firearms laws:

    If Frosh and 4 other previous Attorney Generals were in the room, along with every lawyer holding a seat in the General Assembly was in the room, along with all 24 States' Attorneys from each jurisdiction, you STILL wouldn't get a comprehensive education on gun laws in MD after 16 weeks of instruction.

    IMHO, your best source on Maryland Firearms laws is the MSI website.

    No Doubt's that MSI is comprehensive on gun laws in MD.

    But IF you travel like most us do at some point . There are someone to answer question 24/7
     
    Oct 29, 2021
    740
    Dallas, texas
    First I follow the law and do what is required.

    However, this is what gets me. Time requirements for teaching classes. Most but not all states have them.

    While it might take 16 hours to teach a class of 20 or 30. It does not take that long to teach the same material to a class of 1-3. Which is what my normal niche is for teaching classes. Especially with students that are very experienced with firearms, or who have had several other firearms courses prior to the state required one.

    States should worry more about if the material was taught & taught correctly then how much time was spent in class. However it isn’t the states police or whoever is in charge of monitoring the training is the problem. It’s the state Legislature creating the laws is the problem. As well as the Anti-2A folks that assume everyone without a permit has no experience or training with a firearm.

    While it may have an impact on my pocket book, I believe we should allow testing. A written test, and qualification test. You fail, your required to take the class. You pass, then no class. We as instructors do the testing. For those in Texas that do the online class, I charge $75 to do the qualification. It includes range fees.
     

    BigWilly

    oK, nOw WhAt ?
    Mar 23, 2011
    470
    Dundalk
    I don't think it should lawyers teaching us laws. My point is instructors should not be putting out bad info. Thinking it's better to say something safe, thats incorrect, like no more then 10 rounds in the mag, is doing your students a disservice. If you dont know the material you're instructing then you shouldn't be an instructor. If some asks you something you don't know, say I don't know and get back to them once you've researched the correct answer. I do this multiple times a week in my job. Ultimately, I hope this thread exposes the shams so they can be avoided like the plague. I bet if you look up QHIC numbers, there will be an exponential growth of instructors that are 2022 numbered. Like was said, they are aiming for low hanging fruit.

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk
     

    scottyfz6

    Member
    Dec 22, 2018
    472
    I bet if you look up QHIC numbers, there will be an exponential growth of instructors that are 2022 numbered. Like was said, they are aiming for low hanging fruit.
    Mine should be one of those 22 numbered ones. I am not doing it for money, I will be teaching thru my club/range along with a few other instructors.

    Now the added benefit of not needing training every 2 years is also a HUGE bonus on why I am doing it.
     

    BigWilly

    oK, nOw WhAt ?
    Mar 23, 2011
    470
    Dundalk
    Mine should be one of those 22 numbered ones. I am not doing it for money, I will be teaching thru my club/range along with a few other instructors.

    Now the added benefit of not needing training every 2 years is also a HUGE bonus on why I am doing it.
    I'm sure there are some pretty good instructors with 22 numbers. I just wish there was way to figure out who they are.

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk
     

    Mark75H

    HVAC Expert
    Industry Partner
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 25, 2011
    14,817
    Outside the Gates
    I'm sure there are some pretty good instructors with 22 numbers. I just wish there was way to figure out who they are.

    Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk
    Yes, there are good instructors wint 22's and bad ones with 14's
     

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