45acp reloading question

[James04]

I am new to reloading like many others. I have been playing around with my press for the past month and I am finally feeling ready to start producing some rounds.

One of my concerns, I have noticed that my 45acp brass measures from
.886 to .891

the lyman book lists my TTL as .888 and my OAL to 1.235

I have read threads that say I do not need to trim and to just use the brass. The lyman book also says to only trim when necessary. If i do not trim to .888 how do i keep a consistent OAL of 1.235 ?

If i do not trim the round, when I seat the bullet it will be at different depths and could this increase the internal pressures?

If i do trim to .888 will this affect the headspace of the round since the 45acp headspaces on the mouth?

concern 2- The Lyman book says never to crimp the 45acp. It says to taper if needed that would be a separate die. Do I actually need to taper this round or will I be fine just seating it with my Hornady 3 piece die kit?

These rounds will be shot through a springfield xd45

Thanks, James

TTL= .888
OAL=1.235
200gr #2 alloy cast round
WST 4.6 grains

 

[noylj]

OAL (overall length) can just refer to the length of the case or the bullet or the press or your height or anything.
Do you mean COL (cartridge overall length)? What part of that is based on the case length? As long as the case is long enough to seat the bullet, then the distance from the bullet (meplat or datum of the ogive) to the case head is NOT affected by the case length.
COL is based on each bullet and the gun the cartridge is fired in. There is no universal COL. The manual's COL is the minimum that the data applies to. You may need a longer COL for reliable feeding or, hope not, a shorter COL due to the bullet's ogive hitting the lede/rifling.
All straightwall cases I have ever fired tend to shrink with shooting. Also, case length is measured after resizing, and not on a fired case.
Next, all cases I have ever procured have been too short (see your measurements compared to max case length of 0.898")--and only the bottleneck cases grow and ever need trimming. They reference TTL for straightwall semi-autos so they can be "consistent" and they can sell trimming tools, not that you will ever need one for .45 Auto. Richard Lee himself says he has no idea why anyone would trim a .45 Auto, 9x19, or .40S&W case, but he will happily sell trimmers for those who want them.
People will trim rimmed rounds for revolvers that headspace on the rim and require a roll crimp. Cases of differing lengths will range from insufficient roll crimp to too much crimp and crushing the case. Thus, consistent case length is desirable.
There is nothing new under the sun and you haven't discovered some unknown secret.
Use a taper crimp and be happy. The .45 Auto does well with almost any thing.
Also, if you do trim a .45 Auto case, and remember it headspaces on the case mouth, you have just increased head space which is NOT a desirable thing to do.

 

[DaemonAssassin]

I am new to reloading like many others. I have been playing around with my press for the past month and I am finally feeling ready to start producing some rounds.

One of my concerns, I have noticed that my 45acp brass measures from
.886 to .891

the lyman book lists my TTL as .888 and my OAL to 1.235

I have read threads that say I do not need to trim and to just use the brass. The lyman book also says to only trim when necessary. If i do not trim to .888 how do i keep a consistent OAL of 1.235 ?

If i do not trim the round, when I seat the bullet it will be at different depths and could this increase the internal pressures?

If i do trim to .888 will this affect the headspace of the round since the 45acp headspaces on the mouth?

concern 2- The Lyman book says never to crimp the 45acp. It says to taper if needed that would be a separate die. Do I actually need to taper this round or will I be fine just seating it with my Hornady 3 piece die kit?

These rounds will be shot through a springfield xd45

Thanks, James

TTL= .888
OAL=1.235
200gr #2 alloy cast round
WST 4.6 grains

What kind of press are you using? Single stage, turret, or progressive?

Concern 1-
Your seating die determines the OAL. You will need to run uncharged and FL resized brass into it in order to get it set correctly. You will also need a set of calipers in order to do this. Measuring the OAL after each seating will allow you to set the die correctly. It may take you 3 pieces of bras, or it may take you 50. It all depends on how long it takes for you to get it dialed in. Once your die is set to the correct depth, be sure to lock it in that setting, so it will not change.

Concern 2-
You should not need to taper your 45 loads unless you absolutely need to according to the bullet manufacturer or you start running into problems with the bullets not staying in place. The pressure/friction will create a "lock" that will prevent the bullets from moving, so you should be ok without a crimp/taper.

 

[Pinecone]

I taper crimp my semi auto rounds to make SURE there is not a lip from the expanding step.

I don't think I have ever measured a .45 ACP case. I just use them. My experience is that they will split before they grow too much in length.

COL is VERY important and needs to be set up properly. As mentioned, that is set by the seating die. And if you go shorter than the book length, you need to reduce the powder load and work the load up again to ensure a safe load.

 

[byf43]

I taper crimp my semi auto rounds to make SURE there is not a lip from the expanding step.

I don't think I have ever measured a .45 ACP case. I just use them. My experience is that they will split before they grow too much in length.

COL is VERY important and needs to be set up properly. As mentioned, that is set by the seating die. And if you go shorter than the book length, you need to reduce the powder load and work the load up again to ensure a safe load.

^^^This.

In all of my years of loading .45 acp (30+!), I've NEVER trimmed a piece of .45 acp brass!!!!

That short, stubby cartridge is a reloader's delight.

One word of caution - NEVER "roll crimp" a .45 acp cartridge.
The round headspaces on the casemouth, and if you have a "roll crimp" the case will sit in a different place in the chamber and CAN cause problems.

A very mild "taper crimp" is all that's needed or recommended.
(You want to remove "the bell" that you put in the casemouth, that helps to get the bullet started into the case.)

Also, IF you are loading a SWC bullet, the "COAL" will be different that if you're using a LRN or JHP bullet.


Read, understand and follow the reloading manuals. (Keyword - manuals!)

 

[camobob]

"Also, IF you are loading a SWC bullet, the "COAL" will be different that if you're using a LRN or JHP bullet."

+1 on this - I read a LOT of concerns about OAL. Don't get hung up on a 'standard' number - lots of good threads out there on how to set OAL for different bullets that will work in your gun.

 

[Wreck]

I use a round that I know works in my gun to set my seating die. I was having some chambering issues with some rounds when I didn't taper crimp. Now I taper crimp all rounds and all is good. Good luck.

 

[DocAitch]

I agree with the above: I think that the Lyman book should say that "a roll crimp" should not be applied to .45ACP.
I have never measured a .45 case, only OAL.
There are two kinds of pistol die sets out there-
The first type both seats(with the stem) and applies a taper crimp(with the body of the die) to the round. Lee 3 die sets follow this method.
The second type seats with one die and crimps with a separate die. Dillon 4 die sets work this way.
I use a hybrid method with the Lee dies, seating the bullet only- the body of the die is backed out enough to only use the stem with the seater/crimper, and apply the taper crimp separately with the Factory Crimp die.
The Factory Crimp die not only removes the flare and applies a taper crimp, it also runs most of the length of the loaded round through a carbide ring, reducing the round to "factory" dimensions.
DocAitch

 

[Jackrum]

One thing that may be worth mentioning is I doubt calipers that cost less than a couple hundred dollars are especially accurate in the thousands of an inch range. So a .005 difference wouldn't freak me out.

 

[LGood48]

"Also, IF you are loading a SWC bullet, the "COAL" will be different that if you're using a LRN or JHP bullet."

+1 on this - I read a LOT of concerns about OAL. Don't get hung up on a 'standard' number - lots of good threads out there on how to set OAL for different bullets that will work in your gun.

++1! You will have to reset your seating die for each bullet type and weight. Get multiple manuals. I personally like the Lee Modern Reloading 2d Edition.

Also I use the Lee Factory Crimp Die for all my reloads, both 9mm and .45. Applies a nice taper crimp and cannot over crimp. The Lee 4 die deluxe carbide dies for .45 come with the factory crimp die. Haven't had a feed problem yet with any profile bullet.

 

[byf43]

One thing that may be worth mentioning is I doubt calipers that cost less than a couple hundred dollars are especially accurate in the thousands of an inch range. So a .005 difference wouldn't freak me out.

When I started reloading, I looked in several catalogs and several local vendors.

I wound up buying a Sears Craftsman (stainless steel) dial caliper that cost me a whoppin' $65.00 (or so) and it's extremely accurate.
I trust this dial caliper!!

I have no idea if it's even still marketed/sold.

 

[Pinecone]

The modern digital calipers are accurate and very cheap.

But I would not worry about 5 thousandths in a pistol round. In a long range rifle round, you may be holding accuracy of case and seating this closely.

 

[Winterborn]

I've had feeding issues with 45 until I began using a lee factory crimp die. The problems disappear and they chamber in anything.

Highly recommend one.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

 

[pcfixer]

I've had feeding issues with 45 until I began using a lee factory crimp die. The problems disappear and they chamber in anything.

Highly recommend one.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

+1... Agree the major issue I had with the first loads was the use of crimp die.
measure what the case is on factory loads at the point where the bullet and case meet. Make you reloads the same and you'll have no issues with FTF