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Old November 1st, 2010, 06:44 PM #1
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H2 Buffer

The other thread regarding tier one gear and necessary upgrades brought up something I was doing some reading on without conclusively coming up with an answer.

H2 buffers seem to be all the rage for hard running carbines, but the internet warriors seem to think that the gun won't run cheap civilian ammo and that mil-spec 5.56 is required.

For the basic RRA carbine for us range warriors who have one "go to" rifle is this a worthwhile upgrade or am I not going to get any sort of benefit with my occasional class and range time?
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Old November 1st, 2010, 07:06 PM #2
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9mm Buffers in all of mine, and mine cycle Wolf.

If you are worried Spikes has a buffer thats really nice too (ST-T2).

IMHO everyone serious about AR's should have the following in theor AR bag:

Carbine
H
H1
H2
H3
9mm


Lots of people dont know about this issue:

One buffer wont solve problems, youhave to try everything to see whats truly best for your gun.



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Old November 1st, 2010, 07:22 PM #3
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The gun runs good now with whatever I put through it so I guess I'll take the "if it ain't broke" position on it.
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Old November 1st, 2010, 07:29 PM #4
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Quote:
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The gun runs good now with whatever I put through it so I guess I'll take the "if it ain't broke" position on it.
Sounds good.
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Old November 1st, 2010, 07:38 PM #5
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Sounds good.
yeah...I've got plenty of other crap to spend money on.
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Old November 1st, 2010, 07:40 PM #6
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yeah...I've got plenty of other crap to spend money on.
You sure do, you have to get better prepared better for WV Hillbilly Defenses.
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 01:18 AM #7
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Is there any practical way to see if we have bolt bounce on our ARs without resorting to highspeed videography?
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 02:09 AM #8
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Quote:
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Is there any practical way to see if we have bolt bounce on our ARs without resorting to highspeed videography?
Not that im aware of.

I thought of offering it as a service since I have access to the gear, but things didnt work out at Scotts.

Perhaps Ill have my own gig one day and offer things like this.
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 02:14 AM #9
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I have 9mm buffers in my carbines also. I also used one in a 24" rifle with a collapsing stock with no issues due to the rifle gas system. It now has a Spike's 6oz buffer and runs fine.
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 07:21 AM #10
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what would be the negative of the bolt bounce.
My Stag ( before I lost it in the boating accident ) runs well and it seems the company would put good stuff in it. I'm still not sure what the heavier buffer will do for a rifle like the OP refers to.
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 01:55 PM #11
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i just got a ST-T2 from spikes, it came included with my upper
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 02:47 PM #12
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I though I would be slick and had put a pneumatic buffer in my Wilson combat 20" super sniper. but the thing was so heavy that the bolt wouldn't cycle back enough to pick up another round (using several different types of ammo). I ended up switching it to an H2 and haven't looked back
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 04:09 PM #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdt91 View Post
what would be the negative of the bolt bounce.
My Stag ( before I lost it in the boating accident ) runs well and it seems the company would put good stuff in it. I'm still not sure what the heavier buffer will do for a rifle like the OP refers to.
Yeah, what's the deal? Wear and tear on bolt, carrier or upper? Danger of OOB discharge? ?
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 06:43 PM #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdt91 View Post
what would be the negative of the bolt bounce.
My Stag ( before I lost it in the boating accident ) runs well and it seems the company would put good stuff in it. I'm still not sure what the heavier buffer will do for a rifle like the OP refers to.
Quote:
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Yeah, what's the deal? Wear and tear on bolt, carrier or upper? Danger of OOB discharge? ?
Bolt bounce can cause more weapon movement between shots and cause the gun not to be as controlable as it should (its just a slight amount of movement but it still movement).

Bolt bounce will also cause the gun to fail to fire. When the bolt bounces it goes slightly out of battery and when the Hammer falls, the Firing Pin cant hit hard enough to detonate the primer. As the gun gets dirtier the BCG wont bounce "back" into batery at all, you will have to use the forward assist, or do a tap, rack, bang. With a dirty gun, a buffer or gas system that induces bolt bounce, and a full mag the gun will have more friction on the bolt causing failure to fire. Throw in an unshrouded carrier, notched hammer and a gun with bolt bounce and problems can start to add up real fast.

An overgassed barrel port can or a sound suppressor cause this too, if the gas in the tube cant vent all the way as the bolt comes forward it wants to push the bolt rearward again.
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 06:53 PM #15
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Oh, OK, got it, kinda
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Old November 3rd, 2010, 08:35 AM #16
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I have a standard Carbine buffer, and BCM H and H3 buffers. With a BCM M16 carrier and H buffer my 11.5" franken-AR ran like a dream. I just traded it away though (along with my old crappy AR-15 BCG and carbine buffer.
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Old November 6th, 2010, 02:35 AM #17
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The video was fascinating. But I don't understand why the 3.9oz buffer had less bounce than the 5.5oz 9mm buffer. It seems like the heaviest buffer would have the most inertia and therefore the least bounce. But this is clearly not the case.

2.5oz - huge bounce
3.9oz - zero bounce
5.5oz - bounce

Can someone explain that?
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Old November 6th, 2010, 02:40 AM #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudskipper View Post
The video was fascinating. But I don't understand why the 3.9oz buffer had less bounce than the 5.5oz 9mm buffer. It seems like the heaviest buffer would have the most inertia and therefore the least bounce. But this is clearly not the case.

2.5oz - huge bounce
3.9oz - zero bounce
5.5oz - bounce

Can someone explain that?
Its one of those gun things. Its like barrels and favorite bullets. You can have 2 barrels (One made after the other), and one may shoot great with a certain round, the other may not.

Same goes for buffers, you have to try each one to see what the gun likes best. You have to remember that when you test for this issue, and switch ammo th ebounce may begin again.

This is why its best to own on e of each buffer and make notes to know what ammo likes what buffer.

Overall theres no need to overthing this, this issue only really aplies to SERIOUS defensive carbines. I would estimate 99% of AR owners just hang their AR's in a safe, shoot them at a static range or do mild competition with them. Bolt bounce or a minor malfunction isnt an issue in these cases.
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Old November 6th, 2010, 09:14 AM #19
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If we can't see it then how do we know which buffer to run?
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Old November 6th, 2010, 09:30 AM #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudskipper View Post
The video was fascinating. But I don't understand why the 3.9oz buffer had less bounce than the 5.5oz 9mm buffer. It seems like the heaviest buffer would have the most inertia and therefore the least bounce. But this is clearly not the case.

2.5oz - huge bounce
3.9oz - zero bounce
5.5oz - bounce

Can someone explain that?
I remember reading somewhere that it has to do with the way the weights inside the buffers work. I believe the one slinding weight inside the H buffer works to keep the bolt from bouncing by acting like a secondary hammer strike after the buffer initially pushes the bolt forward. Whereas the 9mm buffer doesn't have sliding weights. I could be remembering wrong or quoting someone that was incorrect.
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