What to do with this Colt HBAR

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  • Occam

    Not Even ONE Indictment
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    20,230
    Montgomery County
    (I was going to title this thread "Pimp my HBAR," but thought that reference may not resonate with some readers)

    So, years ago I went shopping for an AR15, and it was slim pickings. My LGS hooked me up with the only thing they had in stock: a Colt "Match Target Competition HBAR, Cal .223"

    It's Rip Van Winkle, sleeping in the safe. It's seen very little action, but now my interest in the platform has revived. I thought perhaps I'd drop a different upper on it, since it weighs about 2,000 pounds, has no flash suppressor or threads for fun, and somewhere along the line when I had put a scope on it, I misplaced the removable (A2? A3? wut?) handle/rear sight assembly (don't worry, it's just in a bin or box I have to unearth, but it's definitely playing hard to get).

    But doing some reading, I realize that if I really do feel the need for something different, I probably should leave this as-is (replacing the wandering handle/sight), and scratch my itch for something like a 300 blackout by simply buying that in its entirety, and not molesting this Colt.

    So: in the interests of restoring the handle/sight assembly, what am I really shopping for, so that I don't end up with crap? And, should I just leave that poor nekked muzzle alone?

    Lastly, since I can't seem to wade through the ENDLESS discussions that should be making me smarter but actually seem to be making me dumber, is this upper going to be happy with food labeled both .223 and 5.56?

    Thanks in advance for any constructive ruminating on this particular case.

    Oh, and no ... it's not for sale unless you want to give me wildly, insanely more than it's worth :-)
     

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    rico903

    Ultimate Member
    May 2, 2011
    8,802
    I have a similar model, also with the large hole pins, so I'm going to follow this thread as I'd like to lighten mine up also. I'm curious to see the opinions on the adapters, the name escapes me right now. Off set or something.
     

    zoostation

    , ,
    Moderator
    Jan 28, 2007
    22,857
    Abingdon
    Colts are 5.56 chambers even if they're labeled .223. Don't ask me why. It's Colt. If it were me I'd leave it alone and just get the barrel threaded for a compensator, but more because I hate the looks of the target crown than any practical reason. :)
     

    kyserthehun

    Active Member
    Jul 24, 2016
    113
    I got bored with my Colt HBAR, threw a Daniel Defense RIS II FSP rail on it sopmod block 2 clone style. It is definitely heavy as hell.
     

    Occam

    Not Even ONE Indictment
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    20,230
    Montgomery County
    See, this is why one asks questions here. I had no idea a different upper wouldn't work here without a Different Special Magic Pin Thing.
     

    TheOriginalMexicanBob

    Ultimate Member
    Jul 2, 2017
    32,151
    Sun City West, AZ
    You've got the handle even if it is in hiding for the moment. Get the barrel threaded for a stock flash suppressor or another variety of your choice and the gun is as modern as any. You can always add a red dot or other variety of sight.

    Getting a different upper is fine if you want to change calibers. Outside of that, complete rifles are cheap enough now to simply buy another if you want something more glitzy.
     

    Occam

    Not Even ONE Indictment
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    20,230
    Montgomery County
    If this is a pre 2013 gun, you have a lot more options as you can put whatever profile barrel you want on it.

    It is, actually. I think I bought this in the late 90's. Hadn't considered that that opens up some other possibilities. Sounds like a possible snake pit, paperwork-wise, but ... hmmmm!
     

    Melnic

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 27, 2012
    15,278
    HoCo
    I thought if it was cash and carry pre 2013 then it would not matter and you can't put what ever you want?
    It says HBAR so its my assumption it was cash and carry and not done with regulated paperwork.
    Something of that age is fuzzy to me and MD laws.

    BTW, i'd not be doing anything to it that could not be undone.
     

    EODJoe

    Sic Semper Tyrannis
    Jan 15, 2013
    285
    Carroll County
    The takedown pins are the same diameter as regular ARs. It's the trigger group pins that are a larger diameter. I have an old Colt Sporter that I have several different uppers for over the years. I still kept all the original parts though.
     

    Occam

    Not Even ONE Indictment
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    20,230
    Montgomery County
    So, unless I’m unhappy with the trigger, I can do the Upper Shuffle all day long with pretty much any contemporary pattern products?
     

    clandestine

    AR-15 Savant
    Oct 13, 2008
    37,031
    Elkton, MD
    You need to measure the diameter of the front pivot pin before you make any decisions.

    You can't put any carrier or trigger in it with a sear block in the lower.
     

    clandestine

    AR-15 Savant
    Oct 13, 2008
    37,031
    Elkton, MD
    If the front pivot is large pivot then send the lower to ADCO for a permanent sleeve so it will work on standard uppers.

    It's not going to destroy it's value.

    They can also remove the sear block in the lower too so all aftermarket large pin triggers will work in it as well as all bolt carriers.
     

    Occam

    Not Even ONE Indictment
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    20,230
    Montgomery County
    And, while I appreciate the heft and solidness of the stock Colt stock, it might be tempting to remove that for long term storage, and mount something adjustable. Do I thus get into the weeds with new buffer tubes and whatnot? I am ignernt.
     

    Occam

    Not Even ONE Indictment
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 24, 2018
    20,230
    Montgomery County
    You can't out any carrier or trigger in it with a sear block in the lower.

    In my own line of work, I'm a notorious Serial Jargon Offender, so I know how that happens. But in this case, you wooshed my level of experience, and I'm having trouble parsing that.
     

    clandestine

    AR-15 Savant
    Oct 13, 2008
    37,031
    Elkton, MD
    In my own line of work, I'm a notorious Serial Jargon Offender, so I know how that happens. But in this case, you wooshed my level of experience, and I'm having trouble parsing that.

    My apologies for the typo. I corrected it.

    Here is the deal. That gun is a great AR but it needs changes to make it compatible with other AR's

    Measure the front pivot pin. If it's close to .250 then you can use any standard AR upper on it.

    If it's .315, you don't want to use pivot pin adaptors on the front unless you want to use sleeve Retainer to prevent rotation. If the rotate and they will, the upper will lift away from the lower when cycling.
    Send the lower to ADCO and have a bushing installed which will permanent convert it to .250. than any standard AR Upper will work on it.

    You can only use large pin trigger kits in that lower due to the pin diameter. Geissele makes kits that drop in. The sear block will prohibit you from using standard M16 Carriers from other uppers so the sear block should be removed. ADCO does this as well, as can I.


    You can change the stock with no problems. I suggest buying a stock kit with all of the hardware from BCM. Good quality parts with no second guesses on QC. It will include the stock, tube, spring, buffer, receiver plate and castle nut. If you need someone to install it, I will be glad to help if our schedules allow. It is possible to screw up a stock swap/install. I have seen crushed lowers, stripped lowers, damaged parts, and canted installations.
     

    iH8DemLibz

    When All Else Fails.
    Apr 1, 2013
    25,396
    Libtardistan
    OP,

    You have a nice Colt rifle there.

    Don't go all Bubba and start "Modifying" it.

    Leave the ole' girl alone and appreciate her for what she is.

    .02
     

    BossmanPJ

    Ultimate Member
    Feb 22, 2013
    7,057
    Cecil County
    OP,

    You have a nice Colt rifle there.

    Don't go all Bubba and start "Modifying" it.

    Leave the ole' girl alone and appreciate her for what she is.

    .02

    Same opinion here. Build another the way you want and let that one be what it is.

    Also, in looking for a replacement carry handle Colt used a few that I know of. The key to finding a good one is the Forge markings. Look up carry handle force markings on google and learn the symbols for the manufactures. Colt used Cerro Forge, Cardinal, the one with the square, and a few others.
     

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