Night sights:

Blaster229 · Apr 22, 2017

dist1646 said:
I must be the exception to the rule because, I do practice in the dark and I do use the sights. My home and family are worth something to me and training to be able to protect them is a responsibility I do not take lightly. I have seen too many encounters where someone will empty an entire magazine and never even touch the bad guy with a single round when they are only feet apart. Remember, a wounded bad guy can still shoot back.

Do you and your wife use SIMS? What real life pistol with night sights that shoots a projectile are you using? Or do you have an airsoft pistol with night sights installed?
Having someone come at you and you "pretending" to "shoot" them with a safe/inop pistol with night sights going through the movements is not what I am talking about. There is no way to gauge your skill.

You didn't mention how you practice. You just say you take it seriously. Which is fine. We all take shooting seriously.

Many probably would like to know all of these bad shooting, mag dump encounters you have witnessed.

I'll just say that I have probably shot more SIMS rounds in "attack" scenarios than many people have shot real ammo. So this is why I think there are not many who have trained this. I had been blessed with an exceptional career. I know if it weren't for my job that I would have never had the SIMS scenario training exposure that I've had. I would be like "most people" as well.

Blaster229 · Apr 22, 2017

Neot said:
I'd rather have and not need than need and not have. Every duty gun I've carried had some sort of light or night sights. Granted in 99% of any scenario I have been in or ran, people don't use their sights. However that being said, even if I'm just using night sights for finding my gun in the dark, it's worth it.

I know an agency that has never replaced night sights on duty weapons.

Neot · Apr 22, 2017

Blaster229 said:
I know an agency that has never replaced night sights on duty weapons.

Mine were replaced at year 9 and it took me a year and a half to get the gun back. You know how government bidding is.

You guys going to the 320 like everyone else?

Blaster229 · Apr 22, 2017

Neot said:
Mine were replaced at year 9 and it took me a year and a half to get the gun back. You know how government bidding is.

You guys going to the 320 like everyone else?

Just rumor mill now. Last year it was the G19.

kraftyone · Apr 22, 2017

Blaster even after our disagreement yesterday you still want to shoot with me?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Blaster229 · Apr 22, 2017

kraftyone said:
Blaster even after our disagreement yesterday you still want to shoot with me?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Of course! I've been out of town the past couple Fridays. Let's see what this Friday or Saturday brings if that's cool. It'll be a great time.

Pinecone · Apr 23, 2017

Even with a point shoot, you see the gun and sights. You just to not focus on them like a traditional bullseye shot.

Try shooting from the hip, or with the gun not in your sight and see how that goes. Versus concentrating on target, but where you can see the pistol.

ironpony · Apr 23, 2017

I'm guessing it would be best to be prepared for any situation so :
If the poll were taken among those in the business of protection, LEO's, Operators and such, what would the results be? I would lean that way.

But Warren Tacticals on my 34's, NS on my 19's/26's and Glock plastic on 43.

Blaster229 · Apr 23, 2017

ironpony said:
I'm guessing it would be best to be prepared for any situation so :
If the poll were taken among those in the business of protection, LEO's, Operators and such, what would the results be? I would lean that way.

But Warren Tacticals on my 34's, NS on my 19's/26's and Glock plastic on 43.

My HKs have night sights because they came with the gun.
I have yet to put night sights on any of my Glocks.
All these pistols live throughout the house for HD. The VP9 lives under my bed.
I carry my Glocks. I might get around to putting some sort of metal sights on them, they may or may not be NS. Rarely am I out at night. Dim light SD shooting is the least of my SD worry.
Like mentioned earlier, NS don't hurt anything.

Here is why I like NS. They are typically metal and help you locate the pistol when laying on a table somewhere. These are the 2 biggest uses for me with NS.
If I get any NS for any gun, it will be the front dot that goes over a rear line. I find this type to be the fastest acquisition.
I have been fortunate enough to have done a shit ton of dim light SIMS scenarios and live fire shooting. Force on force with SIMS in buildings and other special environments, there was all the stress and zero time to align up 3 tiny dots and then pull a trigger, many times.
Static dim light fire on a range against the clock on non moving targets, there's plenty of time to align those little buddies.
Live fire shoot houses were done at such a "familiarization pace", that any sights could have been useless.
Everyone's mileage may (and will)vary. I base my training and experience.
I know for me NS are useless for self defense shoot "aiming".

Sundazes · Apr 23, 2017

I have a couple with NS for for the same reason I have most of my firearms (before the tragic baiting accident).
I wanted them.

ironpony · Apr 23, 2017

Blaster229 said:
My HKs have night sights because they came with the gun.

I have yet to put night sights on any of my Glocks.

All these pistols live throughout the house for HD. The VP9 lives under my bed.

I carry my Glocks. I might get around to putting some sort of metal sights on them, they may or may not be NS. Rarely am I out at night. Dim light SD shooting is the least of my SD worry.

Like mentioned earlier, NS don't hurt anything.

Here is why I like NS. They are typically metal and help you locate the pistol when laying on a table somewhere. These are the 2 biggest uses for me with NS.

If I get any NS for any gun, it will be the front dot that goes over a rear line. I find this type to be the fastest acquisition.

I have been fortunate enough to have done a shit ton of dim light SIMS scenarios and live fire shooting. Force on force with SIMS in buildings and other special environments, there was all the stress and zero time to align up 3 tiny dots and then pull a trigger, many times.

Static dim light fire on a range against the clock on non moving targets, there's plenty of time to align those little buddies.

Live fire shoot houses were done at such a "familiarization pace", that any sights could have been useless.

Everyone's mileage may (and will)vary. I base my training and experience.

I know for me NS are useless for self defense shoot "aiming".

Thanks.
Something you said may be related to something I have realized over the last couple years: shooting steel, fast draw, first shot - I can no longer recall the sight picture(good hits) Second shot has more attention to the sights probably because most of the draw techniques are out of the way and I am taking time to hit the target. If the plates are close together my second shot sight pic is less memorable as well. I'm thinking now that if I reach your million rnd count I might not need sights at all? LOL.

I'm happy with my shooting, know where all my rounds go! and never leave the range not satisfied. Thanks again for your input Blaster, you have me theorizing now.

Three pistols, 450 rnds and headed to the field

Blaster229 · Apr 23, 2017

ironpony said:
Thanks.
Something you said may be related to something I have realized over the last couple years: shooting steel, fast draw, first shot - I can no longer recall the sight picture(good hits) Second shot has more attention to the sights probably because most of the draw techniques are out of the way and I am taking time to hit the target. If the plates are close together my second shot sight pic is less memorable as well. I'm thinking now that if I reach your million rnd count I might not need sights at all? LOL.

I'm happy with my shooting, know where all my rounds go! and never leave the range not satisfied. Thanks again for your input Blaster, you have me theorizing now.

Three pistols, 450 rnds and headed to the field

Shoot slowly. press that trigger the second you get the pistol extended out on the target. Pull back to the high ready, press out slowly and do it again, and again, and again. Load 1 round at a time if you have to, to keep yourself from going too fast.
I believe this is the best drill anyone could do for their SD shooting ability.

callidus · Apr 23, 2017

md123 said:
Curious about opinions based on a self defense scenario as opposed to range time...unless you are saying that experience at the range translates.

In my humble opinion....shooting with no light (and I'm thinking pitch black here) is stupid, but shooting low light is probable, if that makes sense. Personally, my house is dimly lit at night, and if my eyes are adjusted I can see fairly well (still keep a spare flashlight by the bed, plus the one on my AR & AK; whatever I'm using at the time). That said, batteries die, things break, and so forth.

Also have night sights on my Glock 19; if that were still my defense weapon, it would be a must have. In a low light scenario, the big dot is super visible, and if it's on the bad guy it's a guaranteed hit within 10 yards or so. As a matter of fact, in any self defense scenario, they're very quick to acquire. When I carry (out of state) it's my go-to for winter carry (have the same sights on a Shield for summer).

With regard to "not paying attention to your sights during high stress situations" - I'd say that depends. Have you been in them before, have you taken training, etc. IF you just got back from Afghanistan as an infantryman, you may be well accustomed to high stress situations (and the effects of adrenaline), and handle things differently than a brand new gun owner who has barely fired 100 rounds. Force-on-force, fighting, and other training helps too - but like all "skills", if you don't use it, you lose it.

Blaster229 · Apr 23, 2017

That's why point shooting is also called instinct shooting. Requires zero to barely any skill. There are plenty of murders and good sd shootings where many untrained shooters take care of business.

highli99 · Apr 23, 2017

I have night sights on my G19 and standard Glock sights on my Glock 36. Not sure why but I shoot the standard sights A LOT better than 3 dot true glows.

Seems like there might be better setups that 3 dot.

Blaster229 · Apr 23, 2017

highli99 said:
I have night sights on my G19 and standard Glock sights on my Glock 36. Not sure why but I shoot the standard sights A LOT better than 3 dot true glows.

Seems like there might be better setups that 3 dot.

There are. Dot over bar. Three dots are so distinct that some may dwell on "equal space, both sides" or whatever that saying is.
Dot on top of line then boom.
Single dot is even less complicated, especially under stress.

Minuteman · Apr 23, 2017

Blaster229 said:
Shoot slowly. press that trigger the second you get the pistol extended out on the target. Pull back to the high ready, press out slowly and do it again, and again, and again. Load 1 round at a time if you have to, to keep yourself from going too fast.
I believe this is the best drill anyone could do for their SD shooting ability.

Been saying this for many years. -Best advice.

Again. :rolleyes:

Blaster229 said:
That's why point shooting is also called instinct shooting. Requires zero to barely any skill. There are plenty of murders and good sd shootings where many untrained shooters take care of business.

Absolutely.

:thumbsup:

AliasNeo07 · Apr 23, 2017

I used to think they were necessary and that anyone who thinks they are worthless didn't know what they were talking about. I have since changed my perspective. I don't find them useful.

I would much rather have a blacked out rear sight and a bright orange front sight. I can pick that up much more quickly than the traditional 3-dot white night sights.

However, I suppose that a sight picture like my Ameriglo Operators or a Trijicon HD setup (blacked out rear sight and orange front sight, with tritium in it) are okay. I just have a hard time envisioning a scenario where the tritium would have any added benefit. I don't do a LOT of night shooting, but the few times that I have, I found that when it was dark enough to actually be able to see the glowing tritium, it was too dark to see my target.

So, from here on out I'll get a blacked out rear sight with a bright orange front and not worry about tritium. YMMV.

dist1646 · Apr 24, 2017

clandestine said:
When you critique him I compare you to him. In a real life shoot, I'm would bet lots of money on him.

Blaster229 said:
Do you and your wife use SIMS? What real life pistol with night sights that shoots a projectile are you using? Or do you have an airsoft pistol with night sights installed?
Having someone come at you and you "pretending" to "shoot" them with a safe/inop pistol with night sights going through the movements is not what I am talking about. There is no way to gauge your skill.

You didn't mention how you practice. You just say you take it seriously. Which is fine. We all take shooting seriously.

Many probably would like to know all of these bad shooting, mag dump encounters you have witnessed.

I'll just say that I have probably shot more SIMS rounds in "attack" scenarios than many people have shot real ammo. So this is why I think there are not many who have trained this. I had been blessed with an exceptional career. I know if it weren't for my job that I would have never had the SIMS scenario training exposure that I've had. I would be like "most people" as well.

I have a private range to practice at and I use live ammo. Ever been in a real gunfight?

Blaster229 · Apr 24, 2017

dist1646 said:
I have a private range to practice at and I use live ammo. Ever been in a real gunfight?

So, you and a buddy wear bullet proof vests, run at each other and shoot each other? You drag moving targets on a trolly and practice shooting threats that way? You have yet to say how you train.

I have 12 acres to shoot on so nanny nanny boo boo. Read again my initial comment and see if your responses even correspond to what was said. Reading comprehension. Maybe get some of that practice in. :rolleyes:

Nope, never have been in one. How many have you survived force on force with someone within 10 yards or so shooting at you inside a dwelling? So let's hear how you were a Vet in combat and have killed hundreds of the enemy.

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