Public lands and Hunting. Declining numbers of hunters

j_h_smith · Dec 15, 2018

Elk Neck never really had a lot of hunters. But there is a vetting process (kind of) for the number of hunters they allow on any given day. Way back on the main trail going in is a lone apple tree among the oaks and pines. There are always deer around that tree. May not be any large bucks in those woods but if you hunt for food, then it's a pretty good spot to hunt. Most of the deer come from the little cut below the tree. They will pop up from behind the tree and it's kinda like Whack-A-Mole. Makes for a unique hunt. You don't get to spot the deer walking into your kill zone, they kinda just appear. You wait until their shoulders come into view and pull the trigger.

The biggest problem with hunting that spot is the distance you have to haul the carcass back to your truck.

Artillarylover · Dec 15, 2018

j_h_smith said:
Elk Neck never really had a lot of hunters. But there is a vetting process (kind of) for the number of hunters they allow on any given day. Way back on the main trail going in is a lone apple tree among the oaks and pines. There are always deer around that tree. May not be any large bucks in those woods but if you hunt for food, then it's a pretty good spot to hunt. Most of the deer come from the little cut below the tree. They will pop up from behind the tree and it's kinda like Whack-A-Mole. Makes for a unique hunt. You don't get to spot the deer walking into your kill zone, they kinda just appear. You wait until their shoulders come into view and pull the trigger.

The biggest problem with hunting that spot is the distance you have to haul the carcass back to your truck.

Elk neck has a limit on hunters? Are you talking about the state forest or park?

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Doco Overboard · Dec 15, 2018

Most of the state land around my way is loaded with deer and nobody hunts it. Theirs a small piece right down the road that's had a few in there this morning.
I think people mostly get discouraged because they do not see a lot of deer in a big piece of woods. On a large tract, unlike a small 200 acre farm that's tillable and with some woodlot you have to use a little different strategy or at the very least have reasonable expectations.

Not having enough people in the woods on a large piece can equate to a longer sit to sighting or shot ratio vs small tracts where the game is more easy to predict due to limitations on travel and available cover.

lazarus · Dec 15, 2018

Doco Overboard said:
It was probably some of the Greeks. They own a lot of property down that way. Next time you see some of those Amish boys, get up with them to find out where they're going in and get on the other side. They know how to get them moving and kill a lot of deer.

New good spot is on the other side of the road from Lecompte. Walk out back of the V shaped field and get up next to the marsh. I remember it's real short phrag and some needle grass last time I seen it. Some of it you should be able to walk without going overboard.

Ah, no. They were Hispanic. In chatting with another hunter later he mentioned that there is usually a big group who likes to do a drive once or twice a year. Usually about 6-8 will head back in to the woods and when they come out two or three guys will be carrying all of the guns. As he speculated, those are probably the 2 or 3 guys who have a hunting license. He’s only seen it in the early season. Didn’t see it often, sometimes once or twice in a season, sometimes not at all in a given year.

I’ll try checking out the area you mentioned. I’ve heard fishing bay can be good, but I’ve got no boat for access. Still looking for a Sika.

lazarus · Dec 15, 2018

Doco Overboard said:
Most of the state land around my way is loaded with deer and nobody hunts it. Theirs a small piece right down the road that's had a few in there this morning.
I think people mostly get discouraged because they do not see a lot of deer in a big piece of woods. On a large tract, unlike a small 200 acre farm that's tillable and with some woodlot you have to use a little different strategy or at the very least have reasonable expectations.

Not having enough people in the woods on a large piece can equate to a longer sit to sighting or shot ratio vs small tracts where the game is more easy to predict due to limitations on travel and available cover.

Yeah that’s something I am still working to figure with the Eastern Shore. Central MD and western MD I am much better at figuring out travel corridors, bedding areas, food sources, etc. certainly no pro, but I am getting decent at it.

Nanticoke and General Eastern Shore a lot of the woods are so big and so uniform sometimes it is harder for me to figure out. Should I go way back in? Should I setup nearer the wood line? Near river shore in open woods? By a swampy area? Near the edge of thick under growth hoping something is needed back there and will come out later?

j_h_smith · Dec 15, 2018

Artillarylover said:
Elk neck has a limit on hunters? Are you talking about the state forest or park?

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State Park. The one all the way down 272. Who have to go to the ranger station and get a permit for the days you want to hunt. Then on the days you hunt, you have to sign in and out using a small hut at the parking spot.

The rangers only give out a certain amount of permits for any given date. Thus, they limit the number of hunters at any given time. The most I've ever seen there were about 6-8 hunters. Very few actually walk all the way back to where the apple tree is located. If you miss the apple tree, you will walk on to an old stone building (or what's left of it).

j_h_smith · Dec 15, 2018

Funny story about hunting Elk Neck. I had my son their for the youth hunt and we hadn't seen anything all day long. We're getting to within the last amount of hunting light. My son wanted to go out a bit and sit at another tree about 20 yards away from me. So I let him. Not more than 10 minutes go by and I look over my right shoulder and there's a doe walking towards us. Without spooking the deer, I try to get my son's attention. He didn't see me. I try a whistle, still no acknowledgement from my son. Now the deer is literally 10 feet from me. I try everything I can think of to get my son to turn around. Doe puts her head up and start snorting. She stays there maybe another 30 seconds and then bounds off, away from us. No shot taken to what would have been one of the easiest shots.

This coming from the same son who I placed near a clover field while his younger brother and I hunt a pole line known for deer crossing. Long story short. By 8am we have dogs running and barking along the pole line. So I get upset and after my initial thought of shooting the dogs (j/k), we get up and walk to my son's location. A really nice clover field about 1/4 acre. There we walk up on a sleeping teen. Yep, I put him in one of the best spots the hunting club owns and he falls asleep.

Doco Overboard · Dec 15, 2018

lazarus said:
Ah, no. They were Hispanic. In chatting with another hunter later he mentioned that there is usually a big group who likes to do a drive once or twice a year. Usually about 6-8 will head back in to the woods and when they come out two or three guys will be carrying all of the guns. As he speculated, those are probably the 2 or 3 guys who have a hunting license. He’s only seen it in the early season. Didn’t see it often, sometimes once or twice in a season, sometimes not at all in a given year.

I’ll try checking out the area you mentioned. I’ve heard fishing bay can be good, but I’ve got no boat for access. Still looking for a Sika.

Every so often you’ll see some Russians down that way too. I can send you a map of a good place to go if you want on state land where you won’t have to kill yourself getting one out.

lazarus · Dec 15, 2018

Doco Overboard said:
Every so often you’ll see some Russians down that way too. I can send you a map of a good place to go if you want on state land where you won’t have to kill yourself getting one out.

If you don’t mind, that would be amazing!

A hunter last year was telling me that that is one of the nice things and bad things about MD. There are a ton of state land you can hunt, but because it isn’t a WMA or CWMA, state park or state forest it isn’t on DNR’s website. You basically have to know where it is.

Biggfoot44 · Dec 15, 2018

Snoring attracts deer .

Artillarylover · Dec 15, 2018

lazarus said:
If you don’t mind, that would be amazing!

A hunter last year was telling me that that is one of the nice things and bad things about MD. There are a ton of state land you can hunt, but because it isn’t a WMA or CWMA, state park or state forest it isn’t on DNR’s website. You basically have to know where it is.

Wait really? I thought that only the lands on the list where allowed?

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lazarus · Dec 15, 2018

Artillarylover said:
Wait really? I thought that only the lands on the list where allowed?

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There are others that are marked for hunting, but aren’t listed on DNR. Both county and state. Some of course are by lottery or sign-up. Some are just marked and not on any map.

Derwood · Dec 17, 2018

My great-grandfather hunted but died at age 35. My then-six-year-old grandfather then moved with his mother far away from the rest of the family and never learned to hunt. But he was drafted into the Army and learned outdoor skills. That led to interest in never going to the Philippines again but going outdoors with the Boy Scouts and my Dad. My Dad got me into the Scouts and fishing...but still no hunting. I was always interested in shooting and got the merit badges, so when I got my first shotgun after a burglary, I looked into hunting. This is my 9th season! Last year, I got my 65-year-old Dad into it! I've also gotten my brother and about ten friends into it. If my sons are interested when they're old enough in a few years, I'll make every effort to help them get out there. I even get my wife to sit in the blind with me a few hours each year. Maybe one day she'll want to hunt...but probably not. But she sure appreciates me going out and bringing home true organic food.

I would say I'm self-taught but it's more like self-motivated. I was taught by people on this forum, YouTube, about 30 books, my dog club, friendly hunters willing to give me pointers in countless parking lots, friends of friends...you know how it goes. The barriers to entry are huge: confusing regulations, the initial gear investment, not to mention living in a place with state lines everywhere you look. It's hard to describe how confused I was the first few times I hit the field in a bad camo sweatshirt, jeans, an old shotgun and a bag of wood duck decoys. I've come a long way with the help of others and now have a freezer/fridge full of delicious food I've harvested this year already.

I'm very willing to help out someone who is interested but doesn't know where to begin. I'm also 90% on public land. If you are interested in hunting but don't know where to begin, PM me and we can talk some time.

P.S. if you really want to help with this challenge, bring a friend hunting who is basically "anti-hunting." People learn best from people they trust and most people have an open mind if circumstances warrant a change of heart. Most people think hunting is "get out of truck, sit down, kill deer 5 min later, saw off antlers and leave meat to rot." How often have you had someone ask you if you take what you shoot? I'm always blown away and slightly offended when someone asks that. Show them what it's really about.

lazarus · Dec 17, 2018

Derwood said:
My great-grandfather hunted but died at age 35. My then-six-year-old grandfather then moved with his mother far away from the rest of the family and never learned to hunt. But he was drafted into the Army and learned outdoor skills. That led to interest in never going to the Philippines again but going outdoors with the Boy Scouts and my Dad. My Dad got me into the Scouts and fishing...but still no hunting. I was always interested in shooting and got the merit badges, so when I got my first shotgun after a burglary, I looked into hunting. This is my 9th season! Last year, I got my 65-year-old Dad into it! I've also gotten my brother and about ten friends into it. If my sons are interested when they're old enough in a few years, I'll make every effort to help them get out there. I even get my wife to sit in the blind with me a few hours each year. Maybe one day she'll want to hunt...but probably not. But she sure appreciates me going out and bringing home true organic food.

I would say I'm self-taught but it's more like self-motivated. I was taught by people on this forum, YouTube, about 30 books, my dog club, friendly hunters willing to give me pointers in countless parking lots, friends of friends...you know how it goes. The barriers to entry are huge: confusing regulations, the initial gear investment, not to mention living in a place with state lines everywhere you look. It's hard to describe how confused I was the first few times I hit the field in a bad camo sweatshirt, jeans, an old shotgun and a bag of wood duck decoys. I've come a long way with the help of others and now have a freezer/fridge full of delicious food I've harvested this year already.

I'm very willing to help out someone who is interested but doesn't know where to begin. I'm also 90% on public land. If you are interested in hunting but don't know where to begin, PM me and we can talk some time.

P.S. if you really want to help with this challenge, bring a friend hunting who is basically "anti-hunting." People learn best from people they trust and most people have an open mind if circumstances warrant a change of heart. Most people think hunting is "get out of truck, sit down, kill deer 5 min later, saw off antlers and leave meat to rot." How often have you had someone ask you if you take what you shoot? I'm always blown away and slightly offended when someone asks that. Show them what it's really about.

The only anti-hunters I’ve run in to in real life (who were admitted anti-hunters at least) are horse people.

I think you can draw conclusions as to why they are anti-hunters (self absorbed, pearl clutching bone heads). Which isn’t to say people who own horses are anti-hunters, self absorbed or bone heads. But horse people are.

KIBarrister · Dec 18, 2018

lazarus said:
The only anti-hunters I’ve run in to in real life (who were admitted anti-hunters at least) are horse people.

I think you can draw conclusions as to why they are anti-hunters (self absorbed, pearl clutching bone heads). Which isn’t to say people who own horses are anti-hunters, self absorbed or bone heads. But horse people are.

In terms of mental disorders, horse people rank just below socialists... and most are socialists too.

Artillarylover · Dec 18, 2018

Derwood said:
My great-grandfather hunted but died at age 35. My then-six-year-old grandfather then moved with his mother far away from the rest of the family and never learned to hunt. But he was drafted into the Army and learned outdoor skills. That led to interest in never going to the Philippines again but going outdoors with the Boy Scouts and my Dad. My Dad got me into the Scouts and fishing...but still no hunting. I was always interested in shooting and got the merit badges, so when I got my first shotgun after a burglary, I looked into hunting. This is my 9th season! Last year, I got my 65-year-old Dad into it! I've also gotten my brother and about ten friends into it. If my sons are interested when they're old enough in a few years, I'll make every effort to help them get out there. I even get my wife to sit in the blind with me a few hours each year. Maybe one day she'll want to hunt...but probably not. But she sure appreciates me going out and bringing home true organic food.

I would say I'm self-taught but it's more like self-motivated. I was taught by people on this forum, YouTube, about 30 books, my dog club, friendly hunters willing to give me pointers in countless parking lots, friends of friends...you know how it goes. The barriers to entry are huge: confusing regulations, the initial gear investment, not to mention living in a place with state lines everywhere you look. It's hard to describe how confused I was the first few times I hit the field in a bad camo sweatshirt, jeans, an old shotgun and a bag of wood duck decoys. I've come a long way with the help of others and now have a freezer/fridge full of delicious food I've harvested this year already.

I'm very willing to help out someone who is interested but doesn't know where to begin. I'm also 90% on public land. If you are interested in hunting but don't know where to begin, PM me and we can talk some time.

P.S. if you really want to help with this challenge, bring a friend hunting who is basically "anti-hunting." People learn best from people they trust and most people have an open mind if circumstances warrant a change of heart. Most people think hunting is "get out of truck, sit down, kill deer 5 min later, saw off antlers and leave meat to rot." How often have you had someone ask you if you take what you shoot? I'm always blown away and slightly offended when someone asks that. Show them what it's really about.

Great ideas. Thanks for sharing this

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Biggfoot44 · Dec 18, 2018

My previous horses feel insulted .

The portion of horse owners who are also self absorbed bone heads , happen to have too much political influence in Maryland .

lazarus · Dec 18, 2018

Biggfoot44 said:
My previous horses feel insulted .

The portion of horse owners who are also self absorbed bone heads , happen to have too much political influence in Maryland .

People who own horses aren’t necessarily “horse people” just like people who own cars aren’t necessarily “gearheads”. It takes a certain sort to be put in either stereotyped category. One of those categories is good above, one bad

Slackdaddy · Jan 5, 2019

I guess it is all in what circle you run in.
I have been involved with "horses" most of my life and found the opposite.
I have been involved in Rodeo, penning (cattle work), and worked with the mounted shooting events. Everyone of them is a gun owner, and most if not all hunt. Most work construction by day and farm/put up hay in the evening, working 16+ hour days

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BooReZrU-Hc&feature=youtu.be

I guess it comes down to who "you" are and who you rub elbows with.
If your "gender questionable" and some what limp wristed, you are going to run in the circles of like minded people (Socialist, anti 2nd Amend, etc).

KIBarrister said:
In terms of mental disorders, horse people rank just below socialists... and most are socialists too.

Deersniper · Jan 13, 2019

madmantrapper said:
Pittman - Robertson Act

So I'm paying for a bunch of land acquisition. And I never hunt on public land. So I get to pay for land for hunters and Prius drivers

Everyone should be pissed about the land they pay for that isn't open for hunting. What a bunch of horse shit

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