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Old July 3rd, 2017, 09:13 PM #1
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Are manufacturers missing out on a home defense revolver market?

Went shooting with my gal for the first time this weekend. She never shot before and has a never fired '95 Walther P22 someone gave her a long time ago. It's Md., she'll never CCW but has some interest in home defense.

She was ok with the P22 (although everything except CCI mini-mag jammed about 1x per 10). She was very accurate with my Ruger Mark III, loved it and ran many rounds through that. She tried my Taurus M66. It was a bit snappy for her but she grouped well for a beginner with the American Eagle 38 plinkers. She could not operate the slide at all on my Ruger SR9c. She's in good shape, exercises daily but at 115 lbs, just isn't strong. I know some people might be a similar weight and can operate a slide, but she's not one of them. She wants to go back again but I can tell she doesn't like dealing with the slide, even on the P22, and probably will never practice enough that a semi-auto would be a good home defense option for her.

It got me thinking there are a lot of people like her, not comfortable with a slide, won't learn "tap rack and roll" well enough for distress situations, don't want to load magazines. They may practice, but not regularly. They want simplicity - no safeties, no mags, no slides, and little recoil. To me the product for that market is a revolver in 22 or possibly 38 with low recoil loads. And manufacturers deliver a lot of 22 and 38 CCW models to that and other market segments. But I'm surprised manufacturers have not attempted a home defense revolver in something light like 38 spl.

For "home defense" I mean has rails for light and optics, has just enough heft and size to be easy to shoot, is optimized for short distance (whatever size and cost trade-offs that might buy), and has the highest capacity possible. One possibility is a med-large but very light 38 spl built on an alloy or poly frame and a large cylinder that maybe pushes the envelop to 9 rounds. This market would not want 357, so maybe another round (or two?) could fit.

I know about S&W TRR8 and R8 (in fact I love them and want to get one) but I'm thinking something that doesn't start at $1200 and having more manufacturers to choose from. And those two models are both built for 357, I'm talking 38+P tops.

Doesn't it seem like an untapped market?
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 09:27 PM #2
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I think the biggest problem with the suggested idea is a revolver with 9+/- capacity. .22 yes there are quite a few options in that range but 38/9mm 6 is probably as reasonable as it can get from a cylinder to size ratio compared to a semi auto.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 09:29 PM #3
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I have thought the same thing. My wife can work the slide on my p95 however shes not always quick doing it. I would love to find a good 9mm revolver with a rail for a light.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 09:39 PM #4
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Consider the S&W 351PD, 7 rounds of .22 mag.

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Old July 3rd, 2017, 09:39 PM #5
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I'm with you on the wish for a railed revolver. I've been tempted to try something on my own, but fortunately other things have kept me too busy to screw up one of my revolvers.

For a home defense revolver that a lady (or anyone) could also enjoy at the range, I'm pretty hung up on this:

http://ruger.com/products/sp101/specSheets/5771.html

It's got a four inch barrel and nice big adjustable sights, so targets (paper or threat) can be easily hit. You have the option of .38sp for range time, and maybe your first defensive round or so with full house .357 potential for when things get really serious. It's not as cumbersome as a GP100, but still heavy enough to soak up a lot of recoil. My wife can handle it just fine and it even works in my fat hands. It's a Ruger, so you know it isn't going to break. The only drawback (except for the lack of rail) is the 5 round capacity. get two of them. Or, she can use it to fight her way to her HD longgun.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 09:44 PM #6
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S&w trr8 has a rail. Scandium frame 8 shot 357 but you could always just throw 38spl in it. It's an N frame so the grip may be to big.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 10:03 PM #7
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I think that if the person wants to be able to defend their lives with a handgun, there should continue to practice. This isn't a game, this could be life and death. SD is not going out to the range and throwing lead at a target. Whoever is going to be counting on their firearm to save their lives should have enough thought to practice, practice and practice more. Do it seriously, do it with meaning and conviction.

Far too many people buy a handgun for SD in the home. They go out 1-5 times when they first get the firearm and really don't have a clue as to how to practice. Then they put the firearm in the nightstand. Never to ever properly prepare for the one in a lifetime instance where their life may depend on their actions.

I know I've gone off the thread topic, but this is one of my biggest pet peeves.

Sorry!
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 10:49 PM #8
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I think an old SW hand ejector would fit the bill.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 11:00 PM #9
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Revolvers suck. They've been outclassed since the 1911 hit the market.
Now are there people that may want a revolver for HD? Sure but they're for the vast majority uneducated and undertrained.

Take my mother for example. She can't work the slide effectively on a Glock but can shoot it effectively. Solution? She has my 9mm Glock with a 33 round mag (she purchased in PA) filled with Federal HST's. Why? Because the Glock is more reliable and recoils less than her 4" Model 13-2 and has a Streamlight TLR-1 HL with a remote contour switch. She's confident and that's all that matters.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 11:08 PM #10
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So, you want to reinvent the wheel, I mean reinvent the medium frame 4in .38spl revolver ? The one that was the predominate service revolver for 80 plus years, and has millions of them in circulation ?
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 11:25 PM #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doitsouthstyle View Post
I think the biggest problem with the suggested idea is a revolver with 9+/- capacity. .22 yes there are quite a few options in that range but 38/9mm 6 is probably as reasonable as it can get from a cylinder to size ratio compared to a semi auto.
Not trying to compare to a semi-auto, just maximize capacity. The assumption is a market of people who will not buy a semi-auto, period. This is a home defense application so it can be larger, ie. there is no need to be able to conceal or carry it except perhaps in a big holster. It's a nightstand gun. I think if the S&W TRR8 and Taurus can get 8 rounds of 357 in a cylinder, I wonder if limiting it to 38 spl 1 or 2 more could be put in.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 11:27 PM #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j_h_smith View Post
I think that if the person wants to be able to defend their lives with a handgun, there should continue to practice. This isn't a game, this could be life and death. SD is not going out to the range and throwing lead at a target. Whoever is going to be counting on their firearm to save their lives should have enough thought to practice, practice and practice more. Do it seriously, do it with meaning and conviction.

Far too many people buy a handgun for SD in the home. They go out 1-5 times when they first get the firearm and really don't have a clue as to how to practice. Then they put the firearm in the nightstand. Never to ever properly prepare for the one in a lifetime instance where their life may depend on their actions.

I know I've gone off the thread topic, but this is one of my biggest pet peeves.

Sorry!

Yes people should practice but I would not assert that unless they are willing to buy and drill with a semi-auto, they should not get a gun.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 11:29 PM #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerWillrett View Post
I have thought the same thing. My wife can work the slide on my p95 however shes not always quick doing it. I would love to find a good 9mm revolver with a rail for a light.
Yes! And one with more than 6 rounds.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 11:51 PM #14
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One of my daughter's quick access home defenders (before she gets to the Mossberg) is a Taurus 85 revolver. Hers is the white plastic one, with pink grips. It has a bit more bulk than the blue steel or ultra light 85s. Its in .38 special and can handle plus P or, step down to target, full wadcutters, if you want to absolutely minimize recoil & blast. They run about $300, or less. The only problem that I can see with it is, in a tactical situation, she might have to shoot one or two times to show that its a real gun. I have the ultra light and I put an aftermarket (ATI, I think) grip on it, to better fit my big hand. Although they're made by Taurus (Jessie Duff wouldn't steer us wrong), we've never had any failures or problems.
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Old July 3rd, 2017, 11:55 PM #15
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That 85 is a flame thrower due to it's short barrel. Not good for follow up shots in a dark house.
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Old July 4th, 2017, 12:17 AM #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LibertyGun View Post
Not trying to compare to a semi-auto, just maximize capacity. The assumption is a market of people who will not buy a semi-auto, period. This is a home defense application so it can be larger, ie. there is no need to be able to conceal or carry it except perhaps in a big holster. It's a nightstand gun. I think if the S&W TRR8 and Taurus can get 8 rounds of 357 in a cylinder, I wonder if limiting it to 38 spl 1 or 2 more could be put in.
Uh, .38 special is the same diameter as .357, so they don't take up any less space.
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Old July 4th, 2017, 12:20 AM #17
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biggoot post #10 hit the nail on the head. Great gun, easily the hands down favorite of all newer shooters. Light guns bite so those shouldn't be considered for the recoil shy or new/infrequent shooters.
But what do I know, I must be uneducated and undertrained to support the wheel gun as an option. Better get some training and throw my LCR away. My GP100, too...
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Old July 4th, 2017, 01:24 AM #18
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The Chiappa Rhino in 4", 5", and 6" have bottom rails. The 6" also has a top rail.


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Old July 4th, 2017, 01:36 AM #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mopar92 View Post
Revolvers suck. They've been outclassed since the 1911 hit the market.
Now are there people that may want a revolver for HD? Sure but they're for the vast majority uneducated and undertrained.

Take my mother for example. She can't work the slide effectively on a Glock but can shoot it effectively. Solution? She has my 9mm Glock with a 33 round mag (she purchased in PA) filled with Federal HST's. Why? Because the Glock is more reliable and recoils less than her 4" Model 13-2 and has a Streamlight TLR-1 HL with a remote contour switch. She's confident and that's all that matters.


The challenge with giving someone that can't rack a slide a pre-loaded semi with a big magazine is what does she do if she limp wrists the Glock (yes, it is possible to limp wrist a Glock, I've seen it) and gets a stovepipe? She is in big trouble.

I'm a 1911 guy, so I appreciate your respect of it, but remember that the 1911 with a stock mag only holds 7 rounds, one more than most 4" revolvers. Even today's 8 round 1911 magazines are matched by many 8 shot revolvers. Here is a great article on the viability of the 8 shot revolver as a home defense firearm: https://www.shootingillustrated.com/...to-semi-autos/


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Old July 4th, 2017, 03:49 AM #20
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Consider the S&W 351PD, 7 rounds of .22 mag.
http://www.chuckhawks.com/sw_351PD.html

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