Traffic Stop with Firearms in Car

boundlessdyad said:

Here we go with you wrecking a thread on transport once again. I specifically stated "bona fide" nothing about designated collector and linked back to a prior thread where this was addressed by a legal expert. Unless you are a legal expert (clearly you are not) I would suggest you refer back to that thread.

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And you were replying to a reply about the DC and transport.

Yes, a bona fide collector can transport to display. A DC does not make one a bona fide collector.

Heck, in the past, you could get a DC without owning a firearm. That makes a sure fire collector.

rmbstyle said:

So in my experience, when a leo pulls someone over they often ask where you are headed to/from. If you are going to/from the range and have firearms in the car, what should you say?

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Give a geographic location, not an activity. 'From Gaithersburg' or 'going home'.

If the follow-up question is what did you do in Gaithersburg? Sports.

The only wrong answer is 'from a bar'.

or you can remain silent and say nothing.

swinokur said:

or you can remain silent and say nothing.

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I welcome these wars of semantics. I hate that I have to read about this issue, because it shouldn't be one for anyone.

traveller said:

Give a geographic location, not an activity. 'From Gaithersburg' or 'going home'.

If the follow-up question is what did you do in Gaithersburg? Sports.

The only wrong answer is 'from a bar'.

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See my post #52 above. I used that statement with no problems.

The wrong answer is "Hold My Beer, let me find my ID"

A while back, Blaster actual gave to definative, profound answer.

In Maryland, either aproach will have more or less equal of having positive or negitive outcomes.

( For the purposes of that statement, negitive outcomes will include being detained by the side of the road for an hour or two, while s/n are run, fellow ofc and supervisors are consulted, and huddles are held.)

GrimReaper said:

YES! Always exercise your constitutional rights

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

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I wholeheartedly agree - I will never tell an LEO that I have a weapon in the car unless the law in the state requires me to do so (not MD). Also would never allow a search of my home, auto or person unless they could prove probable cause. Constitutional rights need to be exercised to keep them healthy.

bissettbd said:

http://articles.philly.com/2015-04-04/news/60790722_1_gun-laws-shaneen-allen-bersa-thunder


This woman admitted to having a firearm when asked by the NJSP (which is a common traffic stop question in NJ), at which point she was promptly arrested.

NY, NJ, and MD are not PA, TX, and FL.

Esqappellate nailed it when he said it is complicated. If you were stopped in NJ (at least in the late 80's) and you did not answer this question they would search your vehicle illegally anyway out of suspicion. So if you did not want to end up in jail, Option 1 and 2, telling the truth or remaining silent would not keep you out of jail. If you wanted to sleep at home in your own bed that night you only have one other option.

It would be wonderful if honest people could tell the truth and not end up in jail, but that is not a reality in about six states (NY,NJ,MD,MA,CA,HI). The reality is a firearms arrest in any of these hostile states is probably going to be a felony. Not telling the truth might be a misdemeanor in any of these states, and most probably is no crime at all. Which charge would you rather face? The math is not complicated. In addition, without an admission, any search may be thrown out in court for lack of probable cause. The search will never be thrown out if you make an admission however.

This is not legal advice or advice at all.

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Thanks for the article with the update of that case, and very glad that Christie did the right thing in pardoning her - this was one of those cases that made my blood boil.

rmbstyle said:

So in my experience, when a leo pulls someone over they often ask where you are headed to/from. If you are going to/from the range and have firearms in the car, what should you say?

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I wouldn't say anything.

Back in '07 I was pulled over by two MSP troopers for doing 45 in a 35. Trooper 1 asked me questions while Trooper 2 snooped in my windows on the other side of my Jeep. Trooper 1 asked me where I was going and I truthfully told him I was on my way to a dentist appointment - btw, I wasn't late for that appointment, I was actually 2 minutes away and 20 minutes early. Even after receiving the ticket I was a little early. Anyway, I took the ticket to court and Trooper 1 didn't show up, but Trooper 2 (who never spoke to me) did, then proceeded to blatantly lie to the judge on three occasions:

1. He claimed he spoke to me, yet he never said a word to me, nor was he ever within earshot of my responses to Trooper 1.

2. He told the judge that he asked me where I was going and he said my response was that I was late for a dentist appointment. He made up the "late" part (I assume) to bolster his case with the judge.

3. Then he told the judge that he noticed I had a radar detector in my car and he asked me if it had detected their laser, but then said he couldn't remember what I said in response. But this never happened - the trooper never asked about my detector (which wasn't on at the time) - again, he just made up the conversation to make his case airtight with the judge.

If a trooper is willing to outrageously lie in court like that just to win a speeding ticket case, do you really expect me to trust them in other situations? Hardly.

Cops ask you questions for only one reason - to attempt to build some kind of case against you, whether to bolster a ticket or get permission or probable cause to perform a search of you and your property in hopes of finding a reason for an arrest. So I no longer answer cops when they ask me questions - don't have to and don't want to - won't lie, but the questions they ask are really none of their business. And remember, it is always the cop's word in court, even when they lie. And while the vast majority of LEOs are honest, I'm just not willing to take the chance of getting stopped by that one bad apple that can never be fired due to the police unions.

well stated ma'am.

Time for this again?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE

And do a little research on US vs Johnson, to see how far the police will/can go:

"In United States v. Johnson, decided in May, the 7th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals voted 2–1 to uphold a police search of a group of black people who were just sitting in a parked car. "

"The 7th Circuit agreed with the government that the police did not violate the defendant’s Fourth Amendment rights. The majority reasoned that since the police had probable cause to believe that the car was parked near a crosswalk in violation of the parking ordinance, they were allowed to forcibly detain the car and search the occupants."

Also, IMO, stating 'I have nothing illegal in the car' can be used against you in court. Do you have a radar detector and live in VA? Then you just lied to the cops. Etc...all the cop has to do is find ONE thing 'illegal' in the car, and you've lied.

MD has restrictive laws on many constitutional rights. Police are agents of the state. Nothing personal at all with any particular police person.

I have nothing unconstitutional in the car. How about that then.

LOL, I'd love to see the officer's reaction to that.

Nothing of danger to you.

BigSteve57 said:

Conflating what the law says and what you think is a good idea is always fun.


The Maryland motor vehicle code says you have to come to a complete stop at an octagon stop sign.

But it doesn't say for how long you must be stopped.
Hmmm.
Maybe I should stay stopped for 1 second.
That doesn't seem long enough.
Maybe 5 seconds.
What if a police officer is around...maybe I should stay stopped for 10 seconds...
What to do...what to do...

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don't stop at all, and in the doing avoid the conundrum

MikeTF said:

I've lived in MD for over 40 years. I was never asked if I had firearms in my car. I was rarely pulled over. When I was it was because I was speeding, or the lights on my trailer had gone out. There you go two examples. Don't speed. Make sure your vehicle does not attract attention. Keep your firearms out of sight when you're going two and from the range. We are not at war with the police. They are not out to get us.

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I don't ever transport my firearms illegally, but still I agree with this statement so much. I always check my lights when I am going to the range. The easiest way to get pulled over is by not being aware you have a taillight or brake light that is out. I was stopped once because I have two white bulbs illuminating my rear tag (didn't have any firearms with me) and one was out. The officer was really cool, didn't make a big deal of it, made the stop quick and only gave me a warning to get it fixed. But I remember thinking, what a stupid reason to stop someone. With the one light that was still working you could clearly and easily read the entire tag.

Drive like you have warrants.

Alutacon said:

don't stop at all, and in the doing avoid the conundrum

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You're recommending that I do something illegal.

BigSteve57 said:

You're recommending that I do something illegal.

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I'm fairly certain that was sarcasm.