Hollow point worth it in .380?

cb51 · Jul 21, 2018

My main two guns that I carry are both small semi autos. The Ruger LCP@ and the Beretta Tomcat in .32acp.

With full metal jacket ammo, both have been flawless in reliability. But no matter what brand hollow point I try, there's the once in a while bobble. Usually a fail to feed. It doesn't seem to matter fit's Federal, Winchester, Magtech, whatever. Just once in a while but I don't trust the hollow points.

I'm, wondering that with the lower power caliber's like the .38o and .32acp, is it even worth having the hollow point ammo? Is there even going to be enough velocity with the short barrels to open up the hollow points?

I'm thinking for the reliability, of just using the FMJ ammo from now on, and just going for the penetration with the smaller bullet. I love the reliability of the FMJ ammo in both the guns. The Ruger had a few malfunctions in the first 100 rounds then nothing. The Beretta had one fail to eject in the first 50, then nothing. Both guns have a bit over 500 rounds at this point with no further malfunctions of any kind with FMJ. The Tomcat is proving to be unusually accurate for it's size.

John from MD · Jul 21, 2018

I would not recommend a hollow point in a .380. Since they are shot mostly from short barreled pistols, you don't get much muzzle energy. You need penetration to strike vital parts.

I carry a mix of Underwood Extreme 65gn +P all copper and Buffalo Bore 100gn tempered cast lead. Midway carries both.

teratos · Jul 21, 2018

Hornady Critical Defense seem to do OK. It’s what I carry in my LCP.

TheRealJimDavis · Jul 21, 2018

For .380, run Hornady XTP's, the reliably expand, but still penetrate deep enough.

TheRealJimDavis · Jul 21, 2018

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNtPHYwcDts

John from MD · Jul 21, 2018

Great video but the Lehigh Defense bullets weren't around then. As for Precision Ammunition, I have never found it through a distributor. Their pointer for sales doesn't work for me.

Biggfoot44 · Jul 21, 2018

I am fairly well known as a .380 hater , but once upon a time did use a .380 Backup ( gun) as a backup (role) .

My solution was Silvertip or Super Vel ( would expand ) in chamber , and R-P or PMC jhp in magazine ( would feed, probably not expand .

If I were to get a knock on the head , and wish to use a .380 again , would probably go with Power Ball .

OLM-Medic · Jul 21, 2018

I don't know.

The gel tests never look that great, which is even worse in humans.

For now I stick with FMJ.

Zorros · Jul 21, 2018

We have 2 380s. A G42 that stays in the safe formthe most part and a bodyguard my wife runs with. For both i like the 102 gr. Remington Golden Saber. Its heavy, and its a hollow point. Easy to find by mail, and decently priced. Feeds reliably in the glock. Not everything does.

scribe556 · Jul 21, 2018

TheRealJimDavis said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNtPHYwcDts

This!!!!!

I have the old school Federal Hydra Shocks in .380 based on this and another test showing they expand decently. I’d also get the Precision One based on this test.

TheRealJimDavis · Jul 22, 2018

My takeaway was just that the xtp bullet works well, so I ran Hornady custom xtp's. I think the idea of lehigh is to look good on the tests, i'd be leery to be the first .380 field tester... imho

Baccusboy · Jul 22, 2018

The Underwood Xtreme rounds tumble. That's why they create the larger wound channel.

Brassfetcher ran some slo-mo's, and testing by various people (Mac, etc) have shown that the bullets often end up backwards after travelling 13 to 18 inches in gel. They do not have some super ability to create hidden pressures, etc., as some people have opined. They tumble from 3" into the get... simple as that. Is that a good thing? Bad thing? I'm curious to hear opinions.

I am not sure I'd replace a 9mm or .45 round with these new bullets, but I do think it would be my carry round in .380.

scribe556 · Jul 22, 2018

TheRealJimDavis said:
My takeaway was just that the xtp bullet works well, so I ran Hornady custom xtp's. I think the idea of lehigh is to look good on the tests, i'd be leery to be the first .380 field tester... imho

Yeah I agree, I’d put the Hornady XTPs in as well.

lazarus · Jul 22, 2018

No .380 experience, but for .32acp I’ve only found a few tests out there.

XTP seems to expand decently even out of a Super short barrel and penetrates to 12-14”. Corbon expands amazingly, but only seems to penetrate 10-12”. Most others don’t necessarily expand through heavy clothing.

My Cz-50 running a full box of Fiocchi Extrema (XTP bullets) 90% of the time Th first round in the mag doesn’t want to feed. It jams up and I had a couple really bad bullet setbacks. If I load only 6 or less in the mag it feeds fine and then I can top off the mag and it’ll run flawlessly. Not sure what to do about it. Bullets are obviously diving a hair. Ball doesn’t have this problem with the round nose. I’ve got a replacement Wolff spring I can out in one of the mags. I am going to try that and see how it runs. I might need to polish the feed ramps and maybe skim a fraction of a mm off the front of the mag. I can see where the slide shoves the bullet forward and before the nose can touch the feed ramp it starts to nose dive and the case hits the front of the mag and either hangs up or makes it dip further and slam in to the ramp.

It might take a bit of each, a hair off the mag as well as a new/stronger spring.

Sorry, a little off topic.

lazarus · Jul 22, 2018

Baccusboy said:
The Underwood Xtreme rounds tumble. That's why they create the larger wound channel.

Brassfetcher ran some slo-mo's, and testing by various people (Mac, etc) have shown that the bullets often end up backwards after travelling 13 to 18 inches in gel. They do not have some super ability to create hidden pressures, etc., as some people have opined. They tumble from 3" into the get... simple as that. Is that a good thing? Bad thing? I'm curious to hear opinions.

I am not sure I'd replace a 9mm or .45 round with these new bullets, but I do think it would be my carry round in .380.

The one issue with tumbling when you don’t have the velocity to cause hydrostatic shock damage is that if it happens to be base first or nose first in the part of the path where it passes by an organ or blood vessel then it is only making a bullet diameter path. Most well expanded pistol bullets have similar or sometimes larger frontal areas as a bullet side on does. Especially lighter/shorter rounds.

So a lot better than FMJ and maybe better than a JHP that is fouled up by barriers or heavy clothing (against those), but I’d take a JHP that was either semi-barrier blind or completely barrier blind.

Shazam · Jul 22, 2018

My LCP's reliability improved, significantly, with a Wolff 12 pound recoil spring.

Reading the same internet knowledge base as you I concluded that a hollow point with limited expansion was best for 380. The XTP bullet and Speer Gold Dot both share this characteristic. It seems the XTP may be better. However, I bought some Gold Dot based only on availability when I placed an online order. So far I've had zero malfunctions with it in my gun. All my malfunctions were with FMJ practice ammo before a trip back to Ruger for service and the stronger aftermarket recoil spring. The XTP and Gold Dot bullet have rather different shapes so one of them may feed better if your particular gun is fussy about ammo.

BradMacc82 · Jul 22, 2018

Poke enough holes in the chest cavity, and the desired result will be achieved.

Occam · Jul 22, 2018

BradMacc82 said:
Poke enough holes in the chest cavity, and the desired result will be achieved.

Though in most cases with these small pocket .380s, you've got something like 5+1. Given the short sight picture, the skew towards utility at close range and the rest, you'll be lucky to get more than a couple off (and connect usefully with them) under many circumstances. So it's worth examining which recipe will do the most work when you might only get one or two where they really need to go.

I will say that reading this thread (and following it down the various rabbit holes it presents) has me re-thinking what rides around in my LCP2. Has been Gold Dots. Might switch to Ye Olde Hydroshocks. Need to put a wider variety through that particular gun and see what's what.

BradMacc82 · Jul 22, 2018

Occam said:
Though in most cases with these small pocket .380s, you've got something like 5+1. Given the short sight picture, the skew towards utility at close range and the rest, you'll be lucky to get more than a couple off (and connect usefully with them) under many circumstances. So it's worth examining which recipe will do the most work when you might only get one or two where they really need to go.

Proficiency, it helps.

Most people don't put the work in to become proficient with a pocket pistol, they can be great shots with a larger pistol, but go to shit with a pocket piece.

At the distances these guns were meant for, even firing from a 90-degree bent elbow at your waist, your shots should start low/mid thoracic and the string should end in the chest cavity/low neck area, even if you push/pull the shots, should still be doing enough damage to achieve the desired result.

That's just my take on it. Everyone is free to do what they think is best for them.

TheRealJimDavis · Jul 22, 2018

I sold my LCP and regret it. I did lots of reliability tests, lametably, I found the following: It was 100% reliable when not "topped off." Load from the mag, g2g. If I added that +1, it wasn't always as true. That first round (technically 1st shot, 2nd round) would often ftf. I disagree about poke lots of holes and use ball. 6 rds of 380 is only enough to get away. Multiple attackers, drugs, or a determined attacker (read: terrorist or active shooter), and I want my rounds to be the best I can send, sent to the best place I can deliver them.

Hollow point worth it in .380?

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