j_h_smith
Ultimate Member
- Jul 28, 2007
- 28,516
Mags seem to be the #1 issue with these rifles. I also recommend a VERY heavy buffer and quality spring too.
Fun shooting 9mm AR
- Thread starter jimbobborg
- Start date
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Mags seem to be the #1 issue with these rifles. I also recommend a VERY heavy buffer and quality spring too.
- Jul 29, 2014
- 49,999
Subsonic rounds out of a 16" barrel make as little noise as a .22 LR. When I shot a Steel Challenge match last month, I was giving the guy with the .22 AR a run for his money as to who was quieter. I don't think the timer could hear the shots if I suppressed itIf I lived in a house, I'd use a 9mm AR for HD.
I do, and I do.
147 hand loads. Either coated or plated bullets with 3.2 gns Tite Group
boss281
Ultimate Member
Thanks, after asking I found this page that has some figures in 9mm out of a 16" barrel. http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/9luger.html
Blowback operation is not known for mild recoil. The MPX does a little better in this regard. It would be amazing if Sig ever released a 9mm MPX-system upper that was compatible with standard AR lowers, I'd definitely think about upgrading at least one gun (especially if the handguard was MLOK).
This is why I specifically stayed away from Colt mag guns when buying my PCCs. I don't know what it is about Colt mags, but they seem to have a weirdly high number of QC problems. I use Glock, Uzi, and MP5 mags and they generally run flawlessly. The only mag I ever put aside was a straight MP5 mag, and those are known to cause problems (albeit they look totally badass).
- Jul 29, 2014
- 49,999
I've noticed that Colt type mags (in my gun) only hiccup when the mag is leaning against something(bench, rest, etc). Otherwise, I generally have no problems. Mine is also a dedicated lower which I have attributed to some of the problems(not sure if that is the case so draw your own conclusions).
boss281
Ultimate Member
I'm curious, is the Colt 6450 a pure blowback design? Nothing gets locked in the cycle? Are we talking a heavier spring like a 9 oz?
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Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
GolfR
Ultimate Member
I have issues now and again with my 9mm ar with conversion block and colt magazines. I have learned that the issue generally stems from rounds that don't have a good solid taper crimp to lay down the edge at the top of the case. The rounds tend to "skip" off of the edge of the mag block and hit high on the barrel mouth and miss the chamber. I have partially solved this by filing the front edge of the mag block to have a rounded edge where the cases pass over and also by running ammo with a smooth crimp at the top of the case. I would say that I still have a hiccup every 5th or 6th 32 round mag. It seems to be when the mags are very full. I've thought about putting a stronger spring into the mags to see if that helps but I can't find extra strong 32 round colt mag springs.
boss281
Ultimate Member
I was advised to call the folks at 9mmar.com and G&R tactical ( http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?search=action&category=COLT ) regardingspecific parts. Not sure if this is a help for the mag springs. I'll keep a lookout at the Chantilly gun show this weekend. I have a good handful of the Colt stamped 32 and 20 rd magazines but I haven't put the round count in there and have yet to experience the problems described above...that said, I purchase the firearm 10 years after my brother last fired it, and many of the magazines were all full. I discharged them without issue.
Yes, it's pure blowback, no locking at all. The BC is weighted to assist with this, which is why 9mm AR-15s often weigh more than 5.56x45 AR-15s.
You need a heavier and longer buffer. More powerful spring may or may not be necessary depending on how your gun runs. One of my guns uses a normal carbine spring, the other has a 308 spring. You need to be careful with how you do this stuff, as slamming the bolt too hard forward on recoil has been known to break bolt catches.
boss281
Ultimate Member
You guys jinxed me. I had two different Colt issue 32 rd magazines refuse to hold more than 23-25 rds without popping out a handful before the magazine was even seated. Complete shit day at the range. It happens...
BenL
John Galt Speaking.
I run a Blitzkrieg Components 9mm hydraulic buffer and a Wolff extra power spring. I was breaking BHOs fairly regularly. After the change, not a single one.
Metalform mags seem to be the best execution of a bad design. Of the eight I've ordered so far, I've exchanged two. The Stag brand were the worst; I ordered six, and only two actually ran. Now that PCC is taking off in popularity, I'm waiting for someone to make a "premium" uzi/colt-style mag that's actually great quality and 100% reliable. Maybe something with a slight curve to it for better feeding? Magpul, are you listening? The blowback design might be too punishing for poly mags, but I wish a reputable company would give it a try.
Just my opinion, but I think the PCC market has more or less moved on from Colt mags to Glock mags. When QC10 releases their MP5 mag lower, I think those might go back into vogue, too.
jimbobborg
Oddball caliber fan
Yeah, the original Colt mags I have didn't like being fully loaded. If I downloaded to 25, they worked fine. And for whatever reason, the ASC mags worked perfect out of the box fully loaded. The modified Uzi mag was fine, too.
As to the buffer, I use a CMMG 9mm buffer and $1.25 worth of quarters to prevent BHO breakage.
As to the buffer, I use a CMMG 9mm buffer and $1.25 worth of quarters to prevent BHO breakage.
Put mine together a few years back with these parts on a RRA .223 lower:
Rock River Arms 9mm A4 Upper Receiver
Hahn Precision AR-15 9mm Bottom Loading Conversion Block
Rock River Arms Pistol Caliber Recoil Buffer
Metalform Colt Style 9mm Magazine
It's been a jam-o-matic since day one. Mostly ejection failures, but there was one extraction failure of a Wolf steel case that earned me a free lecture about micro-welding from the RO. I've had to tweak the ejector frequently and lube liberally to get it to run a few mags without jamming.
Rock River Arms 9mm A4 Upper Receiver
Hahn Precision AR-15 9mm Bottom Loading Conversion Block
Rock River Arms Pistol Caliber Recoil Buffer
Metalform Colt Style 9mm Magazine
It's been a jam-o-matic since day one. Mostly ejection failures, but there was one extraction failure of a Wolf steel case that earned me a free lecture about micro-welding from the RO. I've had to tweak the ejector frequently and lube liberally to get it to run a few mags without jamming.
I'd talk to Hahn Precision about your ejector issues. You might also consider shimming it. I run an RRA 9mm upper on my Uzi-mag 9mm AR-15, and it has been a pleasure to shoot.
The AR looks so weird with them tiny mags sticking out. Ive never wanted a AR in a pistol caliber. I think the 4595ts does the job just fine for a fraction of the cost. Absolutely love this pistol caliber carbine. When they make the 10mm one it's going to be crazy having a 10mm flying out of a 16in barrelI.
Three problems:
1. No factory mags > 10rds.
2. No threaded barrel, unless you pay approximately the gun's cost to get the barrel removed and threaded.
3. Big and ugly.
For the money, it's acceptable, but I don't think it's a shock that people are willing to spend more to buy, for example, a CZ Scorpion Evo or a K-T Sub2k. Some people just want more from their guns...
photoracer
Competition Shooter
No. I used the PSA SOCOMM profile barrel but I built it from scratch using parts I had plus other parts.
My 45 only has 10 round mags but that's why I have 6 of them. 
There's definitely a market for folks who want a tricked out pistol cartridge in a rifle but id rather spend money on rifles that shoot what rifles shoot for 6-7 hundred buck's. Unless it's plinker like a 22lr I don't really see the hype in AR9s, 40s etc warranting that kind of money for a PCC. I like the added umph of a pistol caliber in a longer barrel but not that much to spend more than a few hundred.
Pistol caliber carbines to me are good home self defense options. So spend what you will. The tiny mag sticking out of an large AR magwell is one of the ugliest thing's I've seen on a gun personally. The beretta 9mm carbine is just as ugly as a hi point, the sub2k is just as ugly.... None of them are lookers imo. But as long as they work then great.
But im not going to pay 2-4 hundred more for a PCC that's going to perform the same as its competition that cost less.
There's definitely a market for folks who want a tricked out pistol cartridge in a rifle but id rather spend money on rifles that shoot what rifles shoot for 6-7 hundred buck's. Unless it's plinker like a 22lr I don't really see the hype in AR9s, 40s etc warranting that kind of money for a PCC. I like the added umph of a pistol caliber in a longer barrel but not that much to spend more than a few hundred.
Pistol caliber carbines to me are good home self defense options. So spend what you will. The tiny mag sticking out of an large AR magwell is one of the ugliest thing's I've seen on a gun personally. The beretta 9mm carbine is just as ugly as a hi point, the sub2k is just as ugly.... None of them are lookers imo. But as long as they work then great.
But im not going to pay 2-4 hundred more for a PCC that's going to perform the same as its competition that cost less.
You've clearly made up your mind; I'm not going to argue with you. I will, however, say that I think you'll eventually come to understand how limiting that 9rd magazine is. The rest of the shooting world didn't jump on the CZ Evo and Sub-2k for no reason. I mean, FFS, I've got 45acp _handguns_ that have higher capacity than that.
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