Immediate answer needed: C&R and select fire

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  • K31

    "Part of that Ultra MAGA Crowd"
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 15, 2006
    35,632
    AA county
    Here it is, attached below. There was a shorter one too, but I think this is the one that was submitted...

    She also asked me for help with "talking points". I wasn't sure what that meant exactly, but I figured it was a sales job, so I sent this:

    Hi Nancy,

    I'm not sure what exactly passes as "talking points" on the Senate floor, but I came up with this-

    First, a definition, then, why it's an important pursuit, and finally, why further regulation of C&R firearms and collectors is redundant and un-necessary.


    Curio and Relic (C&R) collecting is the pastime of collecting vintage and unusual firearms, and is regulated by the BATF. An applicant for a C&R license must submit to an intensive federal background check, and pay a fee, after which the BATF issues the collector a C&R Federal Firearms License. Collectors must maintain a "bound book", in which they record all purchases, and thoroughly document all transfers. This book must be presented to the BATF upon request.

    C&R license holders are historians of a kind. Curio & Relic collecting provides the study of the development of firearms (as well as the history of industrialization) with tangible examples of advances in mechanical engineering, as well as a range of sciences including chemistry (propellants & finishes), ergonomics (stock shape, sight picture, slings, etc.), optics (scopes), and design.

    The collection of C&R firearms is a conservation of our military heritage, the histories of our military allies (and opponents), and the history of armed conflicts through-out the world. C&R firearms also represent many forms of the advancement of the world's technology.

    Collecting vintage firearms connects one to the rich heritage of the United States, from before the inception of the Republic to the present, encompassing matchlocks of the first Pilgrims through flintlocks of the Minutemen, percussion cap Springfields of the Civil War, and up to the rifle that saved Democracy- the U.S. Rifle, cal. .30, M1 (Garand), which was referred to by General Patton as "the greatest battle implement ever devised".

    Collecting vintage firearms helps preserve artifacts of U.S. and world history that might otherwise be lost to the smelter. These instruments of freedom deserve to be cherished as much as any documents penned by our Patriot forefathers.

    I think you could emphasize the stringent background check that C&R FFL license holders must undergo at the hands of the BATF, the fact all C&R gun purchasers and transfers are recorded in the "bound book", and subject to BATF inspection, and the redundancy apparent if collectors are obligated to undergo background check and licensing with the MSP. C&R collectors are obviously highly law abiding citizens.

    I hope this is helpful. I'll continue to think on it.....

    I would add that part of the application process is to inform the CLEO of your collection activities.
     

    Nixon

    Active Member
    Jun 28, 2010
    229
    Great add. I also told her to mention that the bound book made straw sales impossible.

    I am not really sure I want these people to know I am keeping a book.

    I also think the first mention of C&R should state that they are "Curio and Relic". IMHO it makes them sound far less "scary".
     

    K31

    "Part of that Ultra MAGA Crowd"
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 15, 2006
    35,632
    AA county
    I am not really sure I want these people to know I am keeping a book.

    Personally, I think the people who pull all of this "making scary looking guns illegal makes us safer" crap out of their hind-ers will be more swayed by making it seem more draconian than by stating it's an intellectual pursuit.
     

    MotoJ

    Active Member
    Sep 4, 2012
    267
    Mobtown
    Personally, I think the people who pull all of this "making scary looking guns illegal makes us safer" crap out of their hind-ers will be more swayed by making it seem more draconian than by stating it's an intellectual pursuit.

    Those type of people seem disposed to look at gun collecting as something that only a violent militia member nut-job would do anyhow. It can't be too draconian for them.

    Sorry, I'm just disgusted- I just read the 3rd reading of SB281 that passed. What a compilation of suck.

    http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/2013RS/bills/sb/sb0281T.pdf


    I have a headache trying to decipher what it means for us. I can't figure out whether handguns already in one's possession need the license. I don't think they do, but if you want new, you'll need a license. It says purchase, transfer and receive, but I don't see possess. Anyone else see that?
     

    Nixon

    Active Member
    Jun 28, 2010
    229
    Those type of people seem disposed to look at gun collecting as something that only a violent militia member nut-job would do anyhow. It can't be too draconian for them.

    Sorry, I'm just disgusted- I just read the 3rd reading of SB281 that passed. What a compilation of suck.

    http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/2013RS/bills/sb/sb0281T.pdf


    I have a headache trying to decipher what it means for us. I can't figure out whether handguns already in one's possession need the license. I don't think they do, but if you want new, you'll need a license. It says purchase, transfer and receive, but I don't see possess. Anyone else see that?


    That is how I read it as well.

    Unless we have the votes to get a C&R amendment added. It probably would be best to leave it alone.
     

    rsideout

    Senior Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 11, 2009
    6,707
    MD - Capital Region
    Maryland law requires a 7 day wait for a handgun and C&R does away with that now, why would things change?

    As best as I can tell, in talking with others, you would just have to get the HQL.

    In essence, you still have "a waiting period". In MD, a C&R handgun has to be purchased out of state if using your 03/FFL. That means time for the payment to process and the firearm to ship. Depending upon the location and method of shipping, it could take a week just for the shipping.
     

    MotoJ

    Active Member
    Sep 4, 2012
    267
    Mobtown
    In essence, you still have "a waiting period". In MD, a C&R handgun has to be purchased out of state if using your 03/FFL. That means time for the payment to process and the firearm to ship. Depending upon the location and method of shipping, it could take a week just for the shipping.

    Well, yeah. But, you're talking logistics, not legalities. I'd prefer to wait months for shipping than wait 7 days for the redundant MSP procto-scope, plus the new illegal licensing requirements.
     

    kalister1

    R.I.P.
    May 16, 2008
    4,814
    Pasadena Maryland
    In essence, you still have "a waiting period". In MD, a C&R handgun has to be purchased out of state if using your 03/FFL. That means time for the payment to process and the firearm to ship. Depending upon the location and method of shipping, it could take a week just for the shipping.

    Or you could just drive to PA and drive back home.
     

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