Ah, I see. It was using sarcasm.
Then, riddle me this: Why exactly is it our government has been reluctant to legalize? Is it due to constituents saying they do NOT want it legal for use by adults?
Unregister from MMCC (Medical Cannabis Commission)
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Then, riddle me this: Why exactly is it our government has been reluctant to legalize? Is it due to constituents saying they do NOT want it legal for use by adults?
It's not sarcasm that makes the straw man. It's erecting a false claim, one never made by your opponent, then debunking it.
You implied that the argument against legalization was that it would lead to something like the collapse of a country. You implied that people are arguing that legalization would quickly produce obvious, unmistakable, undeniable effects, and that nothing of the sort was evident in the Great White North.
Arguments against cannibis are a bit more nuanced. The claimed harms are not so obvious. Among them are medical problems, including newly recognized psychoses and other serious ills.
Marijuana has long been recognized as being destructive of ambition, of producing complacency, encouraging laziness. Stoners have joked about these effects since the 60s. Memory loss and mental confusion are two more widely acknowleged effects which are bedrocks of stoner humor.
How do you measure the decline of a society? If Canada were falling apart, what would that look like? I can say confidently that Western Civilization has been dissolving more and more rapidly over the past couple of generations, and I fear it's past the point of no return. Is marijuana to blame? Not alone, but extreme hedonism replacing Stoicism is a big feature of our decline. Hedonism and drug use are not only tolerated, they are encouraged and celebrated as some of humanity's loftiest goals. These values really need to be repudiated by any society that expects to survive and pass on its values.
If Canada falls apart, what would that look like? If Europe, Australia, and the United States fell apart, what would that look like? Would birthrates fall far below replacement levels? Would the rule of law be held in contempt? Would young people be taught that their own society is not worth preserving, but actually should be destroyed? Would they be taught that there is no hope for any future, so they might as well surrender to indiscriminate sex and drugs?
You implied that the argument against legalization was that it would lead to something like the collapse of a country. You implied that people are arguing that legalization would quickly produce obvious, unmistakable, undeniable effects, and that nothing of the sort was evident in the Great White North.
Arguments against cannibis are a bit more nuanced. The claimed harms are not so obvious. Among them are medical problems, including newly recognized psychoses and other serious ills.
Marijuana has long been recognized as being destructive of ambition, of producing complacency, encouraging laziness. Stoners have joked about these effects since the 60s. Memory loss and mental confusion are two more widely acknowleged effects which are bedrocks of stoner humor.
How do you measure the decline of a society? If Canada were falling apart, what would that look like? I can say confidently that Western Civilization has been dissolving more and more rapidly over the past couple of generations, and I fear it's past the point of no return. Is marijuana to blame? Not alone, but extreme hedonism replacing Stoicism is a big feature of our decline. Hedonism and drug use are not only tolerated, they are encouraged and celebrated as some of humanity's loftiest goals. These values really need to be repudiated by any society that expects to survive and pass on its values.
If Canada falls apart, what would that look like? If Europe, Australia, and the United States fell apart, what would that look like? Would birthrates fall far below replacement levels? Would the rule of law be held in contempt? Would young people be taught that their own society is not worth preserving, but actually should be destroyed? Would they be taught that there is no hope for any future, so they might as well surrender to indiscriminate sex and drugs?
I'm not saying it would.
I do note that extreme hedonism has gotten much, much worse since tge 60s. Alcohol abuse is not new, but it was always condemned by a society that encouraged Stoicism. Now Stoicism is derided, and binge drinking has apparently reached unprecedented heights.
The Prohibitionists had strong arguments against the social costs of alcohol, and the anti-cannabis school nay have equally valid arguments against marihuana. I honestly don't know. I can't really defend prohibition, but I'm not enthusiastic about either alcohol or marijuana . I don't use either one.
Drug use is not the cause of civilizational collapse, but does accompany it, and probably speeds it along.
I do note that extreme hedonism has gotten much, much worse since tge 60s. Alcohol abuse is not new, but it was always condemned by a society that encouraged Stoicism. Now Stoicism is derided, and binge drinking has apparently reached unprecedented heights.
The Prohibitionists had strong arguments against the social costs of alcohol, and the anti-cannabis school nay have equally valid arguments against marihuana. I honestly don't know. I can't really defend prohibition, but I'm not enthusiastic about either alcohol or marijuana . I don't use either one.
Drug use is not the cause of civilizational collapse, but does accompany it, and probably speeds it along.
Abulg1972
Ultimate Member
Would a NICS check show that a person has a Medical Cannabis Card?
The point, my friend, is that MSP’s procedures and Form 77R are independent of federal law in certain respects, including any state requirement that a card holder be “clean” for 22 months.
Abulg1972
Ultimate Member
Then why did the General Assembly pass the law? Isn’t the MSP bound to follow Maryland law when addressing Maryland law issues?
So, how does MSP rectify 5-118(b)(3)(vi) of the Criminal Law Article with what you posted from 13-3312 of the Health General Article?
whistlersmother
Peace through strength
I really don't know what your argument is supposed to be.
You said above that MSP isn't bound by federal laws and I pointed out MSP runs NICS checks - I know cause every handgun I've purchased in MD has a NICS number.
Does MSP do that as a "warm-n-fuzzy" or does it do that cause that's federal law it is following?
If MSP runs NICS checks because that's federal law, then you are wrong to say MSP is not bound by federal law.
Simple logic, my friend.
Handguns still have to go through the NICS check, and they require the same Federal Form 4473. Those wacky Nullifiers in Annapolis can't do anything about that. But Maryland adds the Form 77r and a lot of additional background checks for handgun purchases.
I haven't filled out a Form 77r since September of 2013, and I understand it has changed. Apparently it now has disqualifying questions regarding MMCC Patient cards. This was posted a few months ago in another thread:
https://www.mdshooters.com/showpost.php?p=5571815&postcount=39
So the new Form 77r asks
I assume a "yes" answer will lead to Disapproval. Is Abulg saying it won't? That seems pretty open and shut. Here is solid information, with a cited source.
I haven't filled out a Form 77r since September of 2013, and I understand it has changed. Apparently it now has disqualifying questions regarding MMCC Patient cards. This was posted a few months ago in another thread:
https://www.mdshooters.com/showpost.php?p=5571815&postcount=39
So the new Form 77r asks
I assume a "yes" answer will lead to Disapproval. Is Abulg saying it won't? That seems pretty open and shut. Here is solid information, with a cited source.
Last edited:
Biggfoot44
Ultimate Member
- Aug 2, 2009
- 33,137
I know we love our deadhorses here at MDS , but this is pretty much been beaten .
It's illegal .
Discussion is taking place speculating the probability of getting cought . ( Biggfoot categorically advises not to do illegal things , particularly when I would make you a Prohibited Person separately in itself .)
Further discussion on whether it * Should * be illegal . By all means contact your elected Federal representatives on the subject, and support those advocacy groups that advance your position . But those don't change the current legal realities .
It's illegal .
Discussion is taking place speculating the probability of getting cought . ( Biggfoot categorically advises not to do illegal things , particularly when I would make you a Prohibited Person separately in itself .)
Further discussion on whether it * Should * be illegal . By all means contact your elected Federal representatives on the subject, and support those advocacy groups that advance your position . But those don't change the current legal realities .
Abulg1972
Ultimate Member
Show me where I said that “MSP isn’t bound by federal law”. Read. Think. Understand.
CypherPunk
Opinions Are My Own
- Apr 6, 2012
- 3,907
There were around 13 people that could legally use medical marijuana (grandfathered) under Federal law.
I wonder how they are impacted?
I wonder how they are impacted?
whistlersmother
Peace through strength
Uh, right here is where you said MSP doesn't have to follow Maryland law.
But perhaps I'm not all studied up, with schooling and all...
For the win! Lol
smokey
2A TEACHER
- Jan 31, 2008
- 31,500
Basically if you want to use marijuana for medical or recreational use AND exercise your 2a you've got 2 choices...both breaking the law...
1) Get MJ off "the streets"(which is cheaper and easier now than it's ever been since so many people have access to the dispensaries), and buy guns as normal
2) Get your green card and hit up the dispensaries at your leisure, but just build 80%s on the down-low.
These are the choices our legislators have dropped on people. It's not much different from the need to bear arms in our state. If you want to bear arms, you've got to do it in violation of state law. When you leave your house you need to decide if getting arrested for a gun possession charge is worse than potentially being a victim of violent crime, and which one is more likely to happen. Gotta love the choices our lawmakers have given the people.
1) Get MJ off "the streets"(which is cheaper and easier now than it's ever been since so many people have access to the dispensaries), and buy guns as normal
2) Get your green card and hit up the dispensaries at your leisure, but just build 80%s on the down-low.
These are the choices our legislators have dropped on people. It's not much different from the need to bear arms in our state. If you want to bear arms, you've got to do it in violation of state law. When you leave your house you need to decide if getting arrested for a gun possession charge is worse than potentially being a victim of violent crime, and which one is more likely to happen. Gotta love the choices our lawmakers have given the people.
Boom! Mic drop!
Abulg1972
Ultimate Member
Maybe you could read what I wrote as a first step, then be smart as a second step.
That probably would be determined by your answer to this question:
"Are you a legal user of cannabis (marijuana) for medical purposes or are you issued a valid medical cannabis patient identification number or a valid medical cannabis patient identification card? "
Were you even assigned an id number whether or not you ever got your card or did anything with it? After you applied, what happened? Did they come back and say "Congrats. Here is your information." or did they ask for more stuff that you never provided to complete the process?
It states a number OR a card so if you were issued a number because you applied " out of curiosity", it likely killed the cat.....whether you got a card or not.
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