Looking for a karambit... of sorts...

Minuteman · May 15, 2013

Maybe you can help me find a knife that fits this description:

Folding knife with very strong locking blade when opened.

Has a hole in the handle to facilitate drawing the knife and operate generally like a karambit.

Has a wave like feature so blade opens as knife is pulled; wave feature doubles as a finger guard once open.

Blade itself curves 'upswept' or 'Turkish' clip point.

All components excellent quality.

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None of these knives are quite it but these are generally represent the shape or function.

Armadillofz1 · May 16, 2013

The snag seems popular

alucard0822 · May 16, 2013

The 2 most popular are the Emerson and Fox, both are well made, strong, and good materials, most bud K karambits under $100 are junk. The original design and Modern combat karambits usually have a curved point to the blade in order to turn a slash into a stab, and drive the relatively short blade deeper, a curved "Turkish" blade does the opposite, presenting less point and more belly for slashing. I was into them for a while, and they are cool, but if you are looking into the techniques to use with them, there are many reverse slashes, and backhand stabs aggaint the back of the blade. This is hard on ANY folder, it's also the reason many Karambits traditionally have a double edged blade. For defense a fixed blade would be FAR stronger than most any folder, and the design makes a lock failure with a spine strike almost guarantee a trip to the hospital. You may also consider a trainer blade if you are looking to learn the techniques. Now if you just want a cool looking pocket knife, then you give up a lot of utility with a karambit, but it can still work, and considerations like high end materials and lock strength aren't as critical if it won't see any use harder than opening mail and breaking down boxes.

they sell both, although better prices can be found
http://www.theultimateknife.com/
Fox, good steel, Italian made, G10 handles, has a licensed wave, flipper and hole to open, thinner steel liner lock does have a few reports of failure with hard use and spine strikes on bladeforums, although for 1/2 the cost of the Emerson many are happy with it

fox-karambit-g10-trainer-%26-g10__91131_zoom.jpg

Emerson, Ernest Emerson literally wrote the book on modern karambit techniques and invented the wave feature, his karambit designs are the gold standard. He has 2 sizes, fixed and folding, and has a couple alternative blade designs, but the original is probably the best. They are pricey, but it seems everyone who has one loves it, and few report any issues or lock failures

NickZac · May 16, 2013

For a karambit, the Emerson Folding, Super, and Fixed Karambits are all top-of-the-game. The smaller folding Emerson Karambit is one of the knives I carry when not carrying my Waved Civilian or Waved Matriatch. I wouldn't even consider a cheap karambit because if that liner lock fails, the tactics employed for traditional usage of a karambit could literally take most of your hand. Also, it's the only good waved karambit I know of. With that said, it sounds like you are looking for an upswept tip, but with the handle of a traditional karambit...which I am not personally familiar with. Are you looking for a blade like Spyderco Chinook or more like the Spyderco Civilian/Matriarch if you were able to invert the entire blade?

Minuteman · May 16, 2013

alucard0822 said:
The 2 most popular are the Emerson and Fox,...

... a curved "Turkish" blade does the opposite, presenting less point and more belly for slashing. ... looking into the techniques to use with them, there are many reverse slashes, and backhand stabs aggaint the back of the blade. This is hard on ANY folder, it's also the reason many Karambits traditionally have a double edged blade. For defense a fixed blade would be FAR stronger than most any folder, and the design makes a lock failure with a spine strike almost guarantee a trip to the hospital. ...

I added the bold for emphasis, as I see this as my key take-away. Thanks for the opinions and I see what you mean.

You make an excellent point. The more swept the blade the greater difficulty of effecting a strong stab and greater risk of injuring oneself if the lock were to fail and blade to come back at you.

My thinking for the blade shape was (as you mentioned) that it would make a better slasher. I also thought it would be more compact when folded as the shape of the blade would be very similar or identical to the curvature of the handle.

I was unable to find any other knives (kramabit style) with upswept blade as I described (other than the couple cheap ones I already posted). Now that you've got me thinking more about it, I think I'd prefer a more traditional blade configuration, but maybe a blade with a lot of 'belly'. I really like the ring feature for quick acquisition, and a 'wave like' feature to quickly deploy the knife. I have a couple Cold Steel knives with their thumb plate that doubles as a wave like feature. I like it, even though it's a bit thick and very rough on your pocket, works.

Totally agree/understood that a fixed blade is vastly superior to a folder for any rough work; but folders are more portable/safer/legal in Maryland for EDC in more places.

At this point I'm thinking something like this (but in a folding version) is probably better:

http://www.osograndeknives.com/stor...es-black-kydex-sheath-19228.html#.UZWRDRx7Hvw
$198

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I think this straight blade Emerson is probably the closest to what I'm looking for.

Here's another knife that is very close:

Click to expand...

NickZac · May 17, 2013

A traditional hawk bill or reverse S curve is going to be a good slasher, but at the expense of standard forward motions. James Keating's Spyderco Civilian video goes into these types of blades in detail and I absolutely love his video, which Spyderco themselves advise. I can attest to the reverse S curve's ability first-hand. For the type of cuts you have mentioned, a lock like that on the Chinook 2/3, with the David Boye Dent may be of interest because there is a significant amount of information showing the brute strength of this lock type and, at least at the time of being made, Sal Glesser noted that it was their strongest lock (IIRC at the time the Manix 1 shared this lock). Many Spyderco nuts have tested it in detail and one person in particular has conducted a tremendous amount of test data on slashes of meat on it and virtually all blade types (the Wharncliffe blade is notable here). There is also a significant amount of testing done on defensive moves showing the probability of accidental disengagement of the lock (a more common problem than many think). Any sort of lock failure during any type of back cut is at best going to be a wound preventing that hand from being useful, and, at worse, could physically remove multiple fingers (see my hand). Of course other than the tearing cut of a 'back cut' using the underside of an upswept tip to tear, a folder used as a utility blade and a defensive blade will have to make sacrifices at one for the other (slightly differently than fixed blades). A paper thin tip is great for cutting people, but useless for utility, for example. The folders with the lock, handle, and strength plus blade shape and thickness that can serve as fixed blade replacements usually are not ideal for self defense (partially due to them being a bulky utility blade but without the blade length of a larger fixed blade). Any folding knife used for defense is best used as a 'last-ditch, hit-and-run', IMO.

Remmy09 · Jul 8, 2013

Minuteman,

Can you please tell me the brand and/or model of the knife in the 3rd picture on you first post?

besides that its a Karambit...

I am looking for a descent thin Karambit, don't want the bulk and this I believe would go great with my Kershaw Leek.

Yoshi · Jan 19, 2016

Are Emerson and Fox still the only ones that y'all would buy? I see that Cold Steel is making one now.

Dave Greenberg · Jan 19, 2016

If you want a fixed blade that you can conceal the D max by max venom is quite popular in the knife fighting circles.http://www.maxvenom.com/product/dmax

Minuteman · Jan 22, 2016

Dave Greenberg said:
If you want a fixed blade that you can conceal the D max by max venom is quite popular in the knife fighting circles.http://www.maxvenom.com/product/dmax

I like it except the price. Already gave Doug a chunk of change when I attended his training, they are over charging for this.

During his class his partner, featured in the video you posted; was selling tshirts and taking preorders for a different (folding) knife. I don't blame them for trying to make a living, and using his now 'celebrity' like reputation to do it, but it seems way over priced to me.

alucard0822 · Jan 22, 2016

Yoshi said:
Are Emerson and Fox still the only ones that y'all would buy? I see that Cold Steel is making one now.

Their Tiger claw folder sucks, horrible handle shape too long for human hands, and priced well beyond where it should be, their fixed blade is OK. It really was a disappointment, between the Triad lock, their waveable thumb plate, and their solid construction, thought they could produce an affordable gamechanger, but a crappy handle and high price for premium steel ruined it. The new Spyderco Karahawk is pretty awesome, but not all that heavily built. Same as Before, for a folding Karambit, Emerson is the best, Fox is good(and Spyderco), cheap models are dangerous.

ohen cepel · Jan 22, 2016

There are customs out there if you want to spend the $$.
I had one, Spyderco I think, EVIL looking knife and great for a defense tool.
Didn't keep it long since that version had a very curved blade and wasn't good for much else.
Also, the design sits high in your pocket due to the finger ring, not always good if you want to be PC.

All that said, I would give the new Cold Steel a look. Supposed to have the Demko lock which is very solid. Emerson and Spyderco would be my other production go to's.

Minuteman · Jan 22, 2016

ohen cepel said:
There are customs out there if you want to spend the $$.
I had one, Spyderco I think, EVIL looking knife and great for a defense tool.
Didn't keep it long since that version had a very curved blade and wasn't good for much else.
Also, the design sits high in your pocket due to the finger ring, not always good if you want to be PC.

All that said, I would give the new Cold Steel a look. Supposed to have the Demko lock which is very solid. Emerson and Spyderco would be my other production go to's.

Isn't that the one where the YouTube guy did a 'safety' review of it, and basically said it was difficult to open with the normal karmbit draw, and could close on your hand?

Dave Greenberg · Jan 22, 2016

Minuteman said:
I like it except the price. Already gave Doug a chunk of change when I attended his training, they are over charging for this.

During his class his partner, featured in the video you posted; was selling tshirts and taking preorders for a different (folding) knife. I don't blame them for trying to make a living, and using his now 'celebrity' like reputation to do it, but it seems way over priced to me.

Haha yeah it is overpriced for what it is. Yeah pretty much any product associated with celebrity in any field is going to have a name recognition tax associated with it (See Larry Vickers glocks). Mr Marcaida is a monster with a blade. I like the way the dmax can be quickly deployed and since it is fixed there are no worries about spine rigidity.

trickg · Jan 22, 2016

A friend of mine gave me a knock off Emerson. The quality is solid enough for why I'd want it - use as a one-time self-defense knife.

While I don't condone the act of counterfeiting (and this is flat out a counterfeit - it says Emerson all over it) I think my friend paid maybe $20 for it, which is a far cry from what a real Emerson would cost. He gave it to me - I didn't buy it. Had I really wanted one badly enough, I'd have gotten a real Emerson before buying a fake.

Looking for a karambit... of sorts...

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