Ammo prices.

covid prices were normalizing and now the communist uprisings happen and we are even worse off

I'm not buying any of this ammo until it comes down again.

OLM-Medic said:

covid prices were normalizing and now the communist uprisings happen and we are even worse off

I'm not buying any of this ammo until it comes down again.

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What? You don't want 9mm range ammo for $.50 a round? Defensive ammo for $1.50-3 per round? I've seen some places that are normally pretty decent on ammo prices that really are trying to get away with $50 for 20 rounds of 9mm defensive ammo. That said, a couple of my normal "best" suppliers have increased prices, but not through the stratosphere.

Hell several places .45acp is CHEAPER than 9mm right now.

I did notice that reloading supplies have just about dried up. Powder still seems to be fairly available, but bullets (especially anything defensive!) and primers are almost non-existent right now. Prices haven't skyrocketed yet on reloading supplies, but I've noticed them creeping up. Probably just that the initial stuff was mostly, finally bought out. So now as suppliers get more, they'll up prices.

lazarus said:

What? You don't want 9mm range ammo for $.50 a round? Defensive ammo for $1.50-3 per round? I've seen some places that are normally pretty decent on ammo prices that really are trying to get away with $50 for 20 rounds of 9mm defensive ammo. That said, a couple of my normal "best" suppliers have increased prices, but not through the stratosphere.

Hell several places .45acp is CHEAPER than 9mm right now.

I did notice that reloading supplies have just about dried up. Powder still seems to be fairly available, but bullets (especially anything defensive!) and primers are almost non-existent right now. Prices haven't skyrocketed yet on reloading supplies, but I've noticed them creeping up. Probably just that the initial stuff was mostly, finally bought out. So now as suppliers get more, they'll up prices.

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I don’t remember where I saw it at (I think classic firearms) but they had steel cases Wolf 9mm for $33+ a box of 50.


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Here's my reloading report:
1. Primers: disaster unless you're loading magnum. I have a couple of in-stock notices set, but I'm skeptical I will get there before the rush.
2. Bullets: bulk FMJ is a wasteland. Coated pistol bullets are still available if you go a bit off the beaten path. Presumably you can also find coated 300 AAC subs.
3. Brass: no problems yet
4. Powder: no problems yet

I've said it before, I'll say it again: if you reload, the only stuff worth stockpiling is primers, followed by FMJ bullets. Considering you can buy like 30k primers for the cost of 3k-4k loaded rounds, that's kind of a deal.

Ammo prices like they are, I'm definitely going to start reloading once things settle down. Now, when will that be? I'm not holding my breath...

I also want to get into reloading, any advice for a beginner?


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echo6mike said:

Ammo prices like they are, I'm definitely going to start reloading once things settle down. Now, when will that be? I'm not holding my breath...

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The problem is that reloading when things settle down makes no financial sense unless:
1. You are shooting a LOT of pistol ammo. Like 7.5k or more per year.
2. You are shooting expensive rounds (like precision stuff).
3. You have an oddball caliber.

I got into it originally to learn how to do so. I only got serious about it when my 9mm round counts blew through the roof in 2019.

My advice for a beginner is to get a Lee Classic Turret press and a good book (ABCs of Reloading), and start reading.

erwos said:

Here's my reloading report:
1. Primers: disaster unless you're loading magnum. I have a couple of in-stock notices set, but I'm skeptical I will get there before the rush.
2. Bullets: bulk FMJ is a wasteland. Coated pistol bullets are still available if you go a bit off the beaten path. Presumably you can also find coated 300 AAC subs.
3. Brass: no problems yet
4. Powder: no problems yet

I've said it before, I'll say it again: if you reload, the only stuff worth stockpiling is primers, followed by FMJ bullets. Considering you can buy like 30k primers for the cost of 3k-4k loaded rounds, that's kind of a deal.

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I mean, depends on what you are loading. 30k bulk primers is WAY cheaper than 3-4k loaded commercial .308 for example. But yeah, I get your point and agree. Unless it is "the world has ended" or for some reason there ends up being a ban on reloading components, powder doesn't seem to disappear. Maybe it'll get more expensive. Maybe it will dry up some day. But (I didn't own guns, simply what I've heard), back in 2013 it didn't seem to all go away. Might not have been the powder you normally use, but always seems you can get a powder for the caliber you are reloading for.

At least for reloading components, bullets seem to be the thing with the most volatile pricing (and for most calibers, also what impact the final price of the loaded round the most when the price fluctuates). Primers seem to be the hardest thing to find.

I was a gun owner during the previous panics, and primers and FMJ absolutely did vanish quickly. Powder is actually faring somewhat better right now than it previously did, iMHO. Powder swaps are possible, for sure, but there are downsides enough that I try to avoid it.

Primers during normal times can be found for $150 / 5k on a no-hazmat sale, so six cases is a bit under a thousand bucks. Real money, but not really much more than 3k-4k of brass 223.

I was in a shop a few weeks back in central pa picking up one of my 700 remingtons and while I was waiting I noticed every 1pound bottle of powder was 36.00 no matter what flavor it was. He was well stocked on powder and bullets. I only use him for his smithing ability’s. 36 a pound is ridiculous thankfully I know better places and I’m good on all supply’s. As far as factory ammo the only thing I purchase is Rimfire also good there. It will settle down.

lazarus said:

But (I didn't own guns, simply what I've heard), back in 2013 it didn't seem to all go away. Might not have been the powder you normally use, but always seems you can get a powder for the caliber you are reloading for.

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Not really. Like ammo today, you might have found find X or Y powder today or next week. But then a large gap when nothing was available.

erwos said:

The problem is that reloading when things settle down makes no financial sense unless:
1. You are shooting a LOT of pistol ammo. Like 7.5k or more per year.
2. You are shooting expensive rounds (like precision stuff).
3. You have an oddball caliber.

I got into it originally to learn how to do so. I only got serious about it when my 9mm round counts blew through the roof in 2019.

My advice for a beginner is to get a Lee Classic Turret press and a good book (ABCs of Reloading), and start reading.

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I am partial to my Lyman turret press, but yes. What he said otherwise.

I'll never reload enough to probably save what I've invest. Or, well, it'll be a long time. Though with today's ammo prices, maybe I will quickly.

When I've got things running smoothly with my turret press, powder dropper, etc. I can run up about 100 rounds of 9mm in around an hour once I've got everything setup properly. I am still working things out. Learning the mistakes, etc. But you've gotta figure some effort and time up front too. Its more effort to catch my brass, or at least pickup the brass off the ground. Gotta tumble it. None of those take up HUGE investments in time and effort, but it is additional. Rifle rounds, well those take longer because you've gotta

Settled prices were like 16 cents a round for brass case (maybe a little better sometimes of course, maybe a little more sometimes).

3c for a primer. 1.6c for powder. 8.5c for a plated/jacketed bullet if you bought in LARGE bulk. Assuming you avoided shipping costs and didn't pay sales taxes in there, you are talking 13.1c a round. Maybe round it up to 14c assuming you paid sales tax. 15c if you paid shipping/hazmat in there (but bought in large bulk).

Even with a Dillon I can't reload enough to save my time invested. What, 600 rounds an hour on a progressive? Something like that? That's $6 an hour. My setup that's like 60 cents an hour.

Even if it is doubled on savings (maybe you are loading lead), that's perhaps $12 an hour. Now maybe you enjoy it. Maybe you buy in massive bulk quantities so you eeking out another penny or two per loaded round. You might get up to $20-30 an hour running a progressive if it runs flawlessly.

Not every activity I do has to save me money or be more cost effective than if I put more hours in at work. But if it is ostensibly to save money, like reloading is, it should be roughly break even (eventually at least). Add in the cost of the reloading gear to, and it might be hundreds of hours and tens of thousands of rounds of 9mm to break even.

Of course many, many other calibers the savings is higher. But 9mm and .223/5.56 really only makes sense on a progressive, with all the automated bits added in (like a case trimmer attachment for rifle rounds). Which is still going to set you back a LOT of commercially loaded ammo before you'd be breaking even. So you'd better be one of those extremely high volume shooters before you are saving a penny.

Now as it stands right this second, hell yeah. At 50 cents a round roughly for 9mm or .223 (if not more). It doesn't take reloading that quickly or that much to save some serious dough.

I think I probably over paid on most of my components because I was mostly buying like 2-3lbs of powder her and there for what I have on hand. Same with primers getting 1k here and there (mostly mixed in with powder orders, and/or bullets). So I am likely reloading 9mm at closer to 20 cents a round. But if I reload 100 an hour, that's still saving $30 an hour with my turret press. A progressive and you'd be saving like $180 an hour for your time (with my cost of components). Doesn't take long to save the cost of your tools at that price point.

IMHO I got in to reloading 1) So I wasn't dependent upon availability of commercially loaded ammo for a situation like we are seeing today. 2) less common and expensive rounds commercially 3) accuracy.

1 I think is obvious. 2 probably is, but for example 32acp typically seems run around 32 cents a round (I've managed to score it at more like 21 cents a round for most of the 32acp I have). Component cost is like 9.5c a round. Even slower loading, that's some savings. Same thing with 38spc. 6.5 Grendel also is a whole lot cheaper to load for than to buy commercially (.308 and .30-06 is a bit cheaper).

But precision reloading, something like GMM .308 is $1+ a round (a lot more now). But you can load the same for like $.50 a round.

My 16" AR just isn't very accurate with most commercial non-match ammo. But just the first range trip with my rolled my own inexpensive 62gr armscor bullet .223 ammo and I am getting 2.5MOA (which isn't great, but most other stuff seems to run 4MOA). Loaded it for like 25 cents a round. Not particularly cheaper than what commercial plinking .223 was, but it is sure a lot more accurate. Haven't loaded match ammo yet and haven't fine tuned the load at all. Rifle calibers are a lot slower. Probably 40-50 rounds an hour once you factor in the other work (checking case length. Trim to length, deburr and chamfer the cases). I'd hope I can get that down under 2MOA (best match ammo is Hornady Black 75gr that runs somewhere around 1.8MOA, not its not a terribly accurate rifle).

Haven't tried out my 20", that is much more accurate. But if I can roll ~1MOA ammo (about what it does with decent match ammo. Hornady Black 75gr is again the most accurate, at about .8MOA in it), my reloading costs are around 30c for a complete .223 round loaded with a Hornady 75gr .224 BTHP round. Hornady Black when it was on sale right before this crap went to pot I found a few boxes for 58 cents a round. Was mostly available at around 70 cents a round. Cheaper PPU match was typically about 45-50 cents a round.

So a fair amount of savings there, even against cheap match ammo (PPU match works fine in my 20", about 1.2-1.5MOA, my 16" its a bit better than plinking ammo but still only like 2.5-3MOA. The 16" just seems super picky).

Mike3888 said:

I was in a shop a few weeks back in central pa picking up one of my 700 remingtons and while I was waiting I noticed every 1pound bottle of powder was 36.00 no matter what flavor it was. He was well stocked on powder and bullets. I only use him for his smithing ability’s. 36 a pound is ridiculous thankfully I know better places and I’m good on all supply’s. As far as factory ammo the only thing I purchase is Rimfire also good there. It will settle down.

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Yep. I stopped in a little gun shop about an hour from home when I was down that way. They usually have a small but comprehensive selection of components. On this trip they did as well. 1st thing I saw was a pound of unobtainable 2400. The price? $42.95!! The cheapest I saw was $36 for a lb. of titegroup. Plenty of primers too, but only because they were priced in a similar crazy way. No thanks.

Bisleyfan44 said:

Yep. I stopped in a little gun shop about an hour from home when I was down that way. They usually have a small but comprehensive selection of components. On this trip they did as well. 1st thing I saw was a pound of unobtainable 2400. The price? $42.95!! The cheapest I saw was $36 for a lb. of titegroup. Plenty of primers too, but only because they were priced in a similar crazy way. No thanks.

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It’s ridiculous what things are going for. There is one shop up there that I usually get a bunch of stuff at one time. This guy is pretty cool person. When I know I’m heading up I call him knowing when he gets his powder delivery’s and tell him what I want and he gives me a good rate because of the amount. I’m headed back up tomorrow for a week to pick up another order. Hope to get some testing and tuning in.

https://www.deguns.net/federal-american-eagle-62gr-fmj-556-420rds/p

Not great prices... but not that hateful.

64 CPR + shipping isn't hateful? I have been out of touch.

Bisleyfan44 said:

64 CPR + shipping isn't hateful? I have been out of touch.

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I was at Vienna Arsenal yesterday and they had 120 round packs for $85 and 20 round PMC 556 for $15 a box and some 12 ga buck 25 shells/box for $29


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bigmancrisler said:

I don’t remember where I saw it at (I think classic firearms) but they had steel cases Wolf 9mm for $33+ a box of 50.


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So, steel cased Wolf at $132.00 for 200rds, plus shipping.

You can get 200rds of Federal 115gr FMJ brass cased FTF in the classifieds here for $80.00.

Sgt. Psycho said:

You can get 200rds of Federal 115gr FMJ brass cased FTF in the classifieds here for $80.00.

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Which was probably purchased at WalMart for a maximum of $35.

Pinecone said:

Which was probably purchased at WalMart for a maximum of $35.

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If it was bought in December, try like $14-20.