Quantitative approach to picking a home defense gun

pilot25 · Feb 3, 2019

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3sLHGduI3w

What do you think of this approach?

The exact 7:00 mark kinda destroys my thoughts of a shotgun being a simple employ for someone who doesn't want to train, virtually at all.

Blaster229 · Feb 3, 2019

I think that certain topics shouldn't even be allowed as a post anymore

Beware of the man with 1 gun, because he probably knows how to use it.

long guns are great if you never plan on having to use your support hand for anything like opening the door. They are great for huddling in the corner of your room waiting to utilize that beautiful fatal funnel of a bedroom door.

fidelity · Feb 3, 2019

I realize that it's marketing by the YouTuber, but I was annoyed that he labeled his approach as quantitative. He didn't provide data that he could argue to be objective in coming up with values in the different categories that he scored (it's a subjective opinion even with numbers ascribed to them) and what's to say each category (e.g. accuracy vs overpenetration) is of equivalent value in coming up with the aggregate score. I'm sure there are categories that one could also include. Broadly, one could reach similar conclusions without the pretense of doing a quantitative study.

Personally, as Blaster noted, I'll simply stick with the firearm that I'm most familiar with and use the most (for me, it's a semi-automatic pistol - I'm not shooting anything at distance in the home). For a new shooter that won't spend much time at the range, I'll either train them with a Model 64 revolver if I want dead simple or a 10/22 rifle if they seem a bit more capable. They won't engage in house clearing, so having them understanding where are good points to fire a gun from and what to do when law enforcement arrives are things that I'd also want to cover.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

Biggfoot44 · Feb 3, 2019

Is the video worth loosing my place in YouTube ? Or could someone do a direct thingie with it ?

Slim · Feb 4, 2019

Biggfoot44 said:
Is the video worth loosing my place in YouTube ? Or could someone do a direct thingie with it ?

I watched the whole thing. Worth a few minutes. I'd never heard of the guy until a week or so ago. He's had a few interesting videos.

fidelity said:
... but I was annoyed that he labeled his approach as quantitative.

True, it was opinion not objective fact, and he did try to explain how he assigned numbers to things, but it only really worked on magazine capacity.

But at least it wasn't a fanboy video of the sort that usually fills up YouTube. Typically, there and in forums, someone purchases something, and because they don't want to return it, sell it, relegate it to the safe, admit it was a silly purchase, etc., they come up with some far-fetched justification as to why it's the best ever for X.

I like that he explained pluses and minuses for the three platforms. But like Blaster229 said, not all home defense situations are the same. Urban apartment, vs. suburban house, vs. rural...

CrazySanMan · Feb 4, 2019

I like about 30% of this guy's content, but he's a little too "Rex Kwando" for my tastes.

Name Taken · Feb 4, 2019

Nothing ground breaking here. Why bother watching?

Biggfoot44 · Feb 4, 2019

What's Rex Kwando ?

Biggfoot44 · Feb 4, 2019

The good news about his video - He introduces the concept that there are multiple factors in choosing a defensive tool , be it in the home or otherwise . And the factors should be carefully considered for each person before selecting/ aquiring .

The bad news( plural ) about his video - Qualitative only in the sense of applying math to underlying wild supposition . No sense of weighting or prioritizing of any of the factors .

I won't belabor point by point , but will point to a main theme of Blaster's post . ie Due to enherent nature of being inside a home , and the high likelihood of needing to do somthing important with one hand ( among other reasons ) , there is a blatently obvious choice for a singular default choice .

A conventional sized handgun .

There are techniques to mitigate the downsides of long guns , but there should be good specific reasons to not use a handgun , before giving serious consideration to anything else .

pilot25 · Feb 5, 2019

Name Taken said:
Nothing ground breaking here. Why bother watching?

Because it's a new concept to some people. Not everyone has been shooting since they were 5 years old.

pilot25 · Feb 5, 2019

fidelity said:
I realize that it's marketing by the YouTuber, but I was annoyed that he labeled his approach as quantitative. He didn't provide data that he could argue to be objective in coming up with values in the different categories that he scored (it's a subjective opinion even with numbers ascribed to them) and what's to say each category (e.g. accuracy vs overpenetration) is of equivalent value in coming up with the aggregate score. I'm sure there are categories that one could also include. Broadly, one could reach similar conclusions without the pretense of doing a quantitative study.

Personally, as Blaster noted, I'll simply stick with the firearm that I'm most familiar with and use the most (for me, it's a semi-automatic pistol - I'm not shooting anything at distance in the home). For a new shooter that won't spend much time at the range, I'll either train them with a Model 64 revolver if I want dead simple or a 10/22 rifle if they seem a bit more capable. They won't engage in house clearing, so having them understanding where are good points to fire a gun from and what to do when law enforcement arrives are things that I'd also want to cover.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

He explains its not exactly quantitative but to start a conversation.

CrazySanMan · Feb 5, 2019

Biggfoot44 said:
What's Rex Kwando ?

Biggfoot44 · Feb 5, 2019

Damnnnnn ! That was him .

PJS · Feb 5, 2019

I get a kick out of John Lovell. Everyone comes with their particular paradigm. His background sure seems like it would have been rifle centric, and I'm going to guess that for him and his skill set, in his house, a rifle is best. I get the feeling the man has a pretty detailed plan.

That said, it's obvious that every situation is different. A former US Army Ranger who teaches tactical firearms skills who lives in suburban Atlanta is likely not going to pick the same home defense weapon as a person who has never fired a rifle, fired a shotgun maybe twice, who owns handguns, has a CCW, and lives in a condo in Baltimore City.

While I (the latter) might be considering a Mini-14 at some point, my go to home defense firearm is far more likely to be a handgun with a red dot and light on it than a semi-automatic rifle or shotgun.

Best is always going to be an individual decision.

fidelity · Feb 5, 2019

pilot25 said:
He explains its not exactly quantitative but to start a conversation.

As I said, it was a misrepresentation. He entitled the video as a quantitative approach. I almost stopped at the very beginning when I realized that it was a ploy (a common one on the internet to get page views, watches, ad dollars, etc). Only continued watching because you posted so I thought there might be something to learn.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

pilot25 · Feb 5, 2019

fidelity said:
Only continued watching because you posted so I thought there might be something to learn.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

. Sorry. I thought it was interesting. Have been mulling over what to do about my wife who doesn't want to train but wants a firearm in the house. He addressed that exact thing at minute 7:00.

TexDefender · Feb 5, 2019

All firearms can be used in the defense of you and your loved ones at home. Each situation is different. A pistol maybe more pragmatic, in the fact it is easy to conceal and carry in your home every minute of the day. But before the creation of the M4, and the utilization of collectable/folding stocks many US Military personnel cut their teeth on the M-16 in an urban environment, CQB, or MOUT. So those practices could be used in a home. I would say it is a lot easier to swing the tip around a wall if you are using it for concealment. A shotgun in a confined space, hallway, or stair case is lethal (assuming your a using the right ammo). The best weapon is the weapon you are, dare I say it, the most intimate with. I have no doubt this is one of the reasons why the AR platform gained such popularity. A weapon you have not train with, that you are not competent and confident with, is last one you want to resort too.

For effective house defense, you and your family must have a plan. And should walk through that plan, just like any other emergency plan. What room should everyone fall back to? Who will call 911? What do you tell the police?
Should you keep a lock cabinet upstairs with a rifle or shotgun in it? So my son can get to it. Should I have a small handgun safe on my nightstand by my bed at night? Should I buy that concealment shelf or table downstairs just in case? Should I carry indoors every day in my house? Where should I put my gun safe? In the living room, so it is hard to get out of the house or how about in the laundry room where it more out of sight?

Biggfoot44 · Feb 5, 2019

I agree, in the video he started with a preference for rifle, and set up the rest to plausibly justify it .

Home Defense always inherently includes inside the homr, with short distances , hallways, doors, and furniture .

Unless you have a compound with defense in depth , and full communications , and remote access control , you will have to contend with interactiond at your threshold with unknown persons or situations ,and it is both advantageous and polite to be able to be prepared discreetly .

Of course single people who live alone also have rights to self defense , but discussion of Home Defense usually implies a context of a family, or at least spouse or SO . If potentially dealing with kids, spouses, roommates, etc either for rendering aid, shepparding them to relative safety, etc you will need the use of at least one free hand .

Even if you do have 500yd free fire zone around your dwelling, you still have a baseline of Inside the home requirements . So if you are having only one, a Handgun still remains the heavily favored default choice .( Your Second HD firearm could be a rifle or shotgun as appropriate .)

And again with the sexist cliches . My has been shooting since 8yo , and my daughter even younger, and they both have non-res CCW . It's Biggfootette who has to deal with non gun savvy boyfriends .

Quantitative approach to picking a home defense gun

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

Ultimate Member

God loves you, I don't.

piled higher and deeper

Ultimate Member

Active Member

2013'er

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

2013'er

Ultimate Member

Heavy

piled higher and deeper

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Ultimate Member

Users who are viewing this thread

Log in

Forum statistics