Is a HQL needed for a signal pistol, starter pistol, and blank pistol?

fabsroman · Jun 21, 2016

The definition of handgun in Md. Code Public Safety 5-101 includes a signal pistol, starter pistol, and blank pistol. Then, Md. Code Public Safety 5-117.1 requires an HQL to transfer a handgun. I did not see any exception where the HQL does not apply to a signal pistol, starter pistol, or blank pistol.

Am I reading this right? Do I need a HQL for a flare gun that comes as part of a boating safety kit?

fred333 · Jun 21, 2016

I posed the same question a coupla years ago and never got a definitive answer. I rang Mark Bowen, MS Asst State Attorney General, and he felt they are treated the same as standard sidearms, but was unable to find a firm, conclusive answer either.

fabsroman · Jun 21, 2016

fred333 said:
I posed the same question a coupla years ago and never got a definitive answer. I rang Mark Bowen, MS Asst State Attorney General, and he felt they are treated the same as standard sidearms, but was unable to find a firm, conclusive answer either.

I think the code is pretty conclusive. Lots of people breaking the law out there when it comes to the sale of flare guns, starter pistols, and blank pistols. I did not see an exception to them regarding the HQL. Granted, I did not read through all of the pertinent Public Safety article, but no exception jumped out at me.

Inigoes · Jun 21, 2016

USCG approved flare guns are listed as signaling devices

TylerFirearms · Jun 21, 2016

Starter pistols that use primers instead of blanks are not considered handguns. They cannot be readily converted to fire normal ammunition.

I have one in the store for sale that has a solid barrel and uses 209 shotshell primers. That is not a handgun and no paperwork needed.

fabsroman · Jun 21, 2016

TylerFirearms said:
Starter pistols that use primers instead of blanks are not considered handguns. They cannot be readily converted to fire normal ammunition.

I have one in the store for sale that has a solid barrel and uses 209 shotshell primers. That is not a handgun and no paperwork needed.

What makes it so it does not fall under the definition of handgun under Public Safety Section 5-101 and thereby covered by the HQL in Public Safety section 5-117.1?

Inigoes · Jun 21, 2016

2015 Maryland Code
CRIMINAL LAW
Title 4 - WEAPON CRIMES
Subtitle 2 - HANDGUNS
§ 4-201 - Definitions

http://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2015/article-gcr/title-4/subtitle-2/section-4-201/

TylerFirearms · Jun 21, 2016

fabsroman said:
What makes it so it does not fall under the definition of handgun under Public Safety Section 5-101 and thereby covered by the HQL in Public Safety section 5-117.1?

Starter pistols that use blanks and have a hollow barrel are, technically, capable of firing a projectile. Starter pistols that use primers and have solid barrels are not capable of firing a projectile without MAJOR modifications.

[removed incorrect information about flare guns]

This is the one I have in the store: https://www.traditionsfirearms.com/product/Competitive-starter-gun-fires-209-shotgun-primers

No paperwork, no background check, just cash and carry like any other item at any retail store.

ChannelCat · Jun 21, 2016

Inigoes said:
USCG approved flare guns are listed as signaling devices

...And you can go into West Marine or Bass pro and walk right out with one.

TylerFirearms · Jun 21, 2016

ChannelCat said:
...And you can go into West Marine or Bass pro and walk right out with one.

We don't sell flare guns, so I really can't speak about that with any authority. We do sell a large number of starter pistols, however, for dog trainers. The one we have has been verified by MSP as it not being a firearm.

Mark75H · Jun 21, 2016

MSPLD is the expert on MD law?

TylerFirearms · Jun 21, 2016

Md. PUBLIC SAFETY Code Ann. § 5-102 (2016)
SUBTITLE 1. REGULATED FIREARMS

This subtitle does not apply to:
...
(9) a signal pistol or other visual distress signal that the United States Coast Guard approves as a marine safety device.

Md. CRIMINAL LAW Code Ann. § 4-203 (Wearing, carrying, or transporting handgun) states:

(b) Exceptions. -- This section does not prohibit:
...
(8) the carrying or transporting of a signal pistol or other visual distress signal approved by the United States Coast Guard in a vessel on the waterways of the State or, if the signal pistol or other visual distress signal is unloaded and carried in an enclosed case, in a vehicle;

TylerFirearms · Jun 21, 2016

Mark75H said:
MSPLD is the expert on MD law?

They are the ones enforcing the laws. Take that for what it's worth... LOL

Boom Boom · Jun 21, 2016

Mark75H said:
MSPLD is the expert on MD law?

Must be. They seem to create new law out of thin air with every memo/advisory they write.

Mark75H · Jun 21, 2016

TylerFirearms said:
They are the ones enforcing the laws. Take that for what it's worth... LOL

And changing the interpretation on a whim

fred333 · Jun 21, 2016

You can buy 'em on ebay.

Check this thread out as well.

Mark75H · Jun 21, 2016

fred333 said:
You can buy 'em on ebay.

You can buy std cap mags on eBay too.

EL1227 · Jun 21, 2016

So what you're saying is ...

This Ruger® RedHawk S 9mm Blank-firing Pistol, Blued Finish (Product: F401F-217395) from Sportsman's Guide would have been illegal for sale in Maryland after Oct 1, 2013 ?

Could'a fooled me ... and Sportsman's Guide.

TylerFirearms · Jun 21, 2016

EL1227 said:
This Ruger RedHawk S 9mm Blank-firing Pistol, Blued Finish (Product: F401F-217395) from Sportsman's Guide would have been illegal for sale in Maryland after Oct 1, 2013 ?

Could'a fooled me ... and Sportsman's Guide.

I love the description, Semi-auto action
Ejects spent casings... yet it's a revolver. Ruger made a semi-auto revolver?.... LOL

fabsroman · Jun 22, 2016

Here is the issue.

Md. Code Public Safety section 5-101 (definitions)

(n) (1) “Handgun” means a firearm with a barrel less than 16 inches in length.
(2) “Handgun” includes signal, starter, and blank pistols.

Md. Code Public Safety section 5-117.1

§5–117.1.
(a) This section does not apply to:
(1) a licensed firearms manufacturer;
(2) a law enforcement officer or person who is retired in good standing from service with a law enforcement agency of the United States, the State, or a local law enforcement agency of the State;
(3) a member or retired member of the armed forces of the United States or the National Guard; or
(4) a person purchasing, renting, or receiving an antique, curio, or relic firearm, as defined in federal law or in determinations published by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.
(b) A dealer or any other person may not sell, rent, or transfer a handgun to a purchaser, lessee, or transferee unless the purchaser, lessee, or transferee presents to the dealer or other person a valid handgun qualification license issued to the purchaser, lessee, or transferee by the Secretary under this section.
(c) A person may purchase, rent, or receive a handgun only if the person:
(1) (i) possesses a valid handgun qualification license issued to the person by the Secretary in accordance with this section;
(ii) possesses valid credentials from a law enforcement agency or retirement credentials from a law enforcement agency;
(iii) is an active or retired member of the armed forces of the United States or the National Guard and possesses a valid military identification card; or
(iv) is purchasing, renting, or receiving an antique, curio, or relic firearm, as defined in federal law or in determinations published by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives; and

I see absolutely no exception to the HQL for a signal pistol, starter pistol, or a pistol that shoots blanks. I did not read the entire length of section 117.1, but did a search on "blank", "starter", and "signal" and nothing came up. So, unless a starter pistol, etc. is considered an antique, relic, or curio, it is subject to the HQL as I read this.

Just wondering if anybody knows of any exception in the actual law, other than MSP is not deciding to enforce the law as written.

The more laws our morons representatives pass, the more of us become criminals. I wonder how many flaming liberals broke this law to buy a safety kit for their boat.

Is a HQL needed for a signal pistol, starter pistol, and blank pistol?

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