New Hydra-Shok, the Hydra-Shok Deep

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  • Racer Doug14

    Thread killer
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Feb 22, 2013
    8,003
    Millers Maryland
    Lucky Gunner has among the best details and data for ballistic gel ammo testing (https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/) that I have seen.

    Original HS was often issued ammo back in my LE days but Lucky gunner tests show that it seldom expands properly and over penetrates.

    HST seems looks to be improved and competitive with the other mainstream ammo brands (Remington, Winchester) that hits the sweet spot of large expansion and reliable 12-15" penetration.

    Just watched that. They didn't test the 158gr hydrashok in .357. They had done a .38spl&357mag test.https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/
     

    gmharle

    Active Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 29, 2015
    824
    Millers, MD
    The HST actually stands for "Hydra Shok Two." They mentioned something about a new penetration protocol so maybe 15" is the new 12" but I wondered the same thing about over penetrating.

    With America's increasing waistlines, I am guessing the penetration protocols must also increase on average. That is the only thing that comes to mind.
     

    ironpony

    Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jun 8, 2013
    7,187
    Davidsonville
    What might be the most "issued" round? LEOs and Bureaus contract types. I'm guessing that Federal has the most sales of carry rounds.
     

    mopar92

    Official MDS Court Jester
    May 5, 2011
    9,513
    Taneytown
    With America's increasing waistlines, I am guessing the penetration protocols must also increase on average. That is the only thing that comes to mind.

    Nah. The standard protocol for the FBI tests has always been 12-18" of penetration is considered optimal. This is to ensure reliable penetration through an outstretched limb and angular shots that need a bit of extra oomph to get through the chest cavity. If you just shot people with their hands at their sides and directly in front or behind them you'd only need 6-8" to reach vital organs. That'd also be pretty close to murder.
     

    John from MD

    American Patriot
    MDS Supporter
    May 12, 2005
    22,721
    Socialist State of Maryland
    For the three main guns I carry here are my choices. I made these based on research, including luckygunner and other gel tests, and my own tests with phone books and water jugs. The chronographed speed from my short barrels also entered into the analysis.

    S&W M&P40c A mix of Barnes TAC-HP 140gn all copper and Hornady Critical Duty 175gn.

    Kahr P9, a mix of Underwood Xtreme Defense 90gn and Hornady Critical Duty 135+p

    Backup Kahr CW380 mix of Underwood Xtreme Defense 65gn+P and Federal HST 99gn.

    I chose the Underwood Xtreme Defense loads as they use the Lehigh Defense bullet, all copper with four flutes. They give less muzzle rise and better penetration. The first two bullets in both Kahrs are Underwood and the first two in the S&W are Barnes for faster recovery time for the first shots.

    I train with these and, while some may thing I'm over engineering this, it works well for me. At the end of the day, I want to die in my bed, not on the street.;)
     

    woodline

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2017
    1,947
    As long as Federal HST can be had for around 39 or 40 cents a round in 9mm 147 gr SP or 124gr +P, I'm pretty happy with those. I'm sure there are more optimal cartridges on the market, but I don't like spending a buck a round on 9mm.
     

    Biggfoot44

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 2, 2009
    32,876
    *Most* HydraShok is indeed SD ammo . Not terrible , kind of mid pack for premium . Back during the ( first ) Wondernine Era the 124 HydaShock was fairly popular with LE .

    But the 158gr .357 and 240gr .44mag are different from the rest of the product line .
     

    Racer Doug14

    Thread killer
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Feb 22, 2013
    8,003
    Millers Maryland
    *Most* HydraShok is indeed SD ammo . Not terrible , kind of mid pack for premium . Back during the ( first ) Wondernine Era the 124 HydaShock was fairly popular with LE .

    But the 158gr .357 and 240gr .44mag are different from the rest of the product line .

    I'll load that 158 as my bear defense round in WV.
     

    woodline

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 8, 2017
    1,947
    Cut back on a couple of lattes or beers and spend the money on the bullets. ;)
    I brew my own coffee and don't drink alcohol anymore. And I still would rather be able to train with my defensive ammo more often than have something that might or might not work slightly better.
     

    John from MD

    American Patriot
    MDS Supporter
    May 12, 2005
    22,721
    Socialist State of Maryland
    I'll load that 158 as my bear defense round in WV.

    Even though you have black bears in WV, I would still use this load.

    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/6...ead-round-nose-flat-point-gas-check-box-of-50

    I would also carry them in a double action revolver. While single actions are cheaper and are excellent for hunting, for personal defense a double action is needed.

    When you run into a bear and cubs or a bear eating, you will have only a few seconds to kill it if it charges. Try shooting a single action six times as fast as you can at a target about 20 yards away and see how long it takes. Then think about the target moving. :innocent0
     

    John from MD

    American Patriot
    MDS Supporter
    May 12, 2005
    22,721
    Socialist State of Maryland
    I brew my own coffee and don't drink alcohol anymore. And I still would rather be able to train with my defensive ammo more often than have something that might or might not work slightly better.

    If you have a Chrony, you can pick up different cheap ammo and see what runs like the ammo you. You are not interested in how it performs, just that it hits to the same POI and has the same amount of recoil.

    Winchester has come up with training ammo that replicates its defensive ammo. I make my own reloads so I can tailor my reloads to give me the same feel as those I carry.

    At my club, I used to offer my chrony services to members so they could see exactly what they are getting out of their guns. Now that I am retired, I think I may start that back up again. ;)
     

    zoostation

    , ,
    Moderator
    Jan 28, 2007
    22,857
    Abingdon
    As long as Federal HST can be had for around 39 or 40 cents a round in 9mm 147 gr SP or 124gr +P, I'm pretty happy with those. I'm sure there are more optimal cartridges on the market, but I don't like spending a buck a round on 9mm.

    There's really not much out there that does better in 9mm. You don't need +P either. It really doesn't make much of a difference in 9mm. Off the shelf HS, Gold Dots, or (my preference) Winchester SXT in in 124 or 147 grain weights would be my choice. Not all but most of these newfangled bullet designs for a hundred year old cartridge are just marketing garbage. It's unreal the shit many in the firearms industry will say to find a way to sell stuff in an overcrowded market sometimes.
     

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