ND passes bad reciprocity bill

press1280 · Jul 24, 2021

https://www.legis.nd.gov/assembly/67-2021/documents/21-0774-04000.pdf

ND just passed a bill that will go into effect Aug 1st. This makes it so reciprocal permits are only good if the license holder is also a resident of that state. Basically this makes it like PA. No idea why they passed this law.

Since they do not have reciprocity with MD for example a MD resident would have to get a ND permit to carry there, and according to Handgunlaw you have to do training in ND and apply there. Major hassle.

ND is constitutional carry but for residents only.

traveller · Jul 24, 2021

Sixty bucks is sixty bucks.

Allen65 · Jul 24, 2021

I still don't understand how these "residents only" laws pass a 14th Amendment test, even using Rational Basis:
"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. "

traveller · Jul 24, 2021

There are some quirks in ND carry law and there has been a history of inexperienced out of staters bumbling into prohibited situations.

Sangel611 · Jul 24, 2021

rambling_one · Jul 24, 2021

Allen65 said:
I still don't understand how these "residents only" laws pass a 14th Amendment test, even using Rational Basis:
"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. "

Puzzling for sure.

Boats · Jul 24, 2021

traveller said:
There are some quirks in ND carry law and there has been a history of inexperienced out of staters bumbling into prohibited situations.

So what? freedom is messy and imperfect.

Unfortunately, in the current climate, it is less liability to NOT carry and be a victim than run the risk of carrying(legally, of course) and trying to be a good guy and making an honest mistake.

Which, of course, is exactly what the antis want. A right unused is a right denied

press1280 · Jul 25, 2021

Allen65 said:
I still don't understand how these "residents only" laws pass a 14th Amendment test, even using Rational Basis:
"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. "

Well you can literally pass any law and it stands until someone challenges it.

WY and ID had similar laws but repealed the residency requirement.

press1280 · Jul 25, 2021

traveller said:
There are some quirks in ND carry law and there has been a history of inexperienced out of staters bumbling into prohibited situations.

Care to elaborate?

traveller · Jul 25, 2021

press1280 said:
Care to elaborate?

They have loosened up a lot of stuff in recent years, but it used to be illegal to carry
- at a 'public assembly' yet there was no definition on what constitutes such.
- at a 'school event'
- in a bar (but you can carry in the restaurant part of something like an applebees)
.
.
.

For a long time there was no reciprocity between ND and MN. So outstate Minnesotans would drive to the mall in Fargo or Grand Forks with their FL permit. Carrying in the mall in those days was ok, but the moment there was some school group singing christmas carols, you now had both an 'assembly' and a 'school activity' turning it into a grey-zone. Add to that that some cities used ot have local prohibitions on open-carry (and some cops never got the memo that those were repealed) and hilarity ensued.

Kharn · Jul 25, 2021

I bet they think they are sticking it to NYC elites, not thinking about the average Joe's who can get one through various means.

press1280 · Jul 26, 2021

Will have to do some more digging on why this was passed. I’m wondering if it was some other change they wanted and through poor language ended up with what we have now.
I’m not aware of non resident permit holders causing any issues so why the change?

lemmdus · Jul 28, 2021

They will probably fix the language is my guess. ND is so sparesly populated though you could carry anyway and not have a problem. Hopefully the SCOTUS will rule once and for all on this.

press1280 · Jul 28, 2021

The Scotus decision in NYSRPA probably won’t solve this issue.
Out of staters should probably call up ND reps and senators and ask to get the law put back the way it was or no visit to ND.

ND passes bad reciprocity bill

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