Maryland 30 Day Wait Question

trickg said:

Thanks Matt. Another question: Is it ok to have the Collector's permit AND an FFL? At some point in the next year or so I intend to get my own FFL, but getting a home based FFL takes a bit more work. I'm on my way, but I'm not there just yet.

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It is not a colector's permit, it is a designated collector status. In other words the MDSP just recognizes you as a bona fide collector in their record books.

To answer your question though, yes, it is possible to be designated as a collector and have an FFL. However! If you have just about any FFL type besides a C&R FFL, you are exempt from the majority of the regulated firearms restrictions anyway.
If you have a C&R FFL (also called a type 03 FFL or a Curio and Relic FFL), then you still have to do the seven day wait and the background check for regulated firearms bought within this state and you are not exempted from the one in 30 days purchase restriction like other types of FFLs would be, so it is a good idea to get both teh C&R FFL and the collector's designation.

As far as the difficulty of getting a C&R FFL, it is very easy and requires just a form and a $30 fee. The dealer, importer or manufacturing FFLs are a lot more involved and have certain requirements the C&R FFL does not have to deal with.

novus collectus said:

exempt from the majority of the regulated firearms restrictions anyway.
If you have a C&R FFL (also called a type 03 FFL or a Curio and Relic FFL), then you still have to do the seven day wait and the background check for regulated firearms bought within this state and you are not exempted from the one in 30 days purchase restriction like other types of FFLs would be, so it is a good idea to get both teh C&R FFL and the collector's designation.

As far as the difficulty of getting a C&R FFL, it is very easy and requires just a form and a $30 fee. The dealer, importer or manufacturing FFLs are a lot more involved and have certain requirements the C&R FFL does not have to deal with.

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I've been considering this for several weeks now and didn't realize its easy. Do you know the website for the application etc.

My one and only concern with getting my FFL is that from my understanding, I have to log all of my firearms - including guns that are my personal possessions and came down through generations of inheritance to me. I just don't want any of my guns not currently on the books to be listed anywhere the government can see them. Otherwise, a dealer FFL seems like it would give you just about every advantage with very few drawbacks.

trickg said:

My one and only concern with getting my FFL is that from my understanding, I have to log all of my firearms - including guns that are my personal possessions and came down through generations of inheritance to me. I just don't want any of my guns not currently on the books to be listed anywhere the government can see them. Otherwise, a dealer FFL seems like it would give you just about every advantage with very few drawbacks.

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The ATF used to make dealers and collectors do that as I understand it, but someone sued or something or there was a court case and they won. I have to find it again, but I remember seeing on the ATF websight where you do not have to record your collection you had before you got your FFL.

novus collectus said:

The ATF used to make dealers and collectors do that as I understand it, but someone sued or something or there was a court case and they won. I have to find it again, but I remember seeing on the ATF websight where you do not have to record your collection you had before you got your FFL.

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Found it:

There is no obligation to record the
acquisition of personal firearms that the
dealer obtained prior to receiving his or her
license, as long as he or she does not intend
to sell such firearms. For example, an
individual proprietor may deal in firearms
from his or her licensed premises; he or she
may also possess in his or her home a
personal hunting weapon that he or she
purchased long before becoming a dealer,
and which he or she has no intention to sell.
Under those circumstances, the dealer was
not required to record the acquisition of the
personal firearm when he or she
commenced his or her firearms business.

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http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/newsletter/0306fflnewsletter.pdf

This only applies if you did not intend to sell the firearms with your license you owned prior to getting your license and your personal collection must be kept seperate from your business inventory if you are an 01 (dealer) FFL.

fivepointstar said:

I've been considering this for several weeks now and didn't realize its easy. Do you know the website for the application etc.

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Been a while, but....

http://www.atf.gov/dcof/index.htm

You want to click on or add ATF F 7CR (5310.16) (in "applications") from the selection on the right side and fill in the rest.

novus collectus said:

Been a while, but....

http://www.atf.gov/dcof/index.htm

You want to click on or add ATF F 7CR (5310.16) (in "applications") from the selection on the right side and fill in the rest.

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GOT IT!!! Thanks, I also applied for the app.

novus collectus said:

Found it:
http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/newsletter/0306fflnewsletter.pdf

This only applies if you did not intend to sell the firearms with your license you owned prior to getting your license and your personal collection must be kept seperate from your business inventory if you are an 01 (dealer) FFL.

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That's interesting. On one hand, I don't intend to ever sell any of the guns that I inherited - those are what I am most concerned about. On the other hand, I have a rare Winchester that if I was ever in a big pinch financially, could do well toward bailing me out - yes I inherited it, but when you are talking a rifle that is worth $30K+....see what I mean?

In regard to keeping things separate from your business inventory, does that mean that I would have to purchase another safe specifically for the business? Ugh - I paid $2500 for this one and it would be a shame if I couldn't set aside a portion of that space for business related items.

trickg said:

That's interesting. On one hand, I don't intend to ever sell any of the guns that I inherited - those are what I am most concerned about. On the other hand, I have a rare Winchester that if I was ever in a big pinch financially, could do well toward bailing me out - yes I inherited it, but when you are talking a rifle that is worth $30K+....see what I mean?

In regard to keeping things separate from your business inventory, does that mean that I would have to purchase another safe specifically for the business? Ugh - I paid $2500 for this one and it would be a shame if I couldn't set aside a portion of that space for business related items.

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As I understand it, the safe storage requirement for a buisiness FFL is vague and may not require a safe per se. As long as they are secured I think it qualifies.

As far as your inherited rifle, if you sell it from your personal collection that you owned before the license and that you keep seperate, then I do not think you have to log it in your bound book if you are an 01 FFL (dealer). However, if you sell it through your business using your FFL to do it, then I think you have to log it into your bound book as an acquisition from your personal collection and then out as a disposition when it is sold.

In other words, you might not have to record the sale in the bound book for the ATF (but because of banking laws a sale of an item over $10,000 in value might have to be reported to the SEC?).

Now if it is a curio and relic and you only have an 03 FFL (C&R), then as I understand it even if you owned the rifle before you had the FFL, then if you sell it while you have the FFL you have to put it in the bound book as an Acquisition/Disposition (A?/D), but that is the only time you would have to and if you just owned it prior to getting the license then no recording in the bound book.
Also, the bound book is only for C&R guns, so if it was not a C&R and you sold it while you had the 03 FFL (C&R), then you would not have to bother with the book.

Quick question. I just bought a Remington 870 and want to pickup a handgun fairly quickly. The shotgun isn't regulated, so it shouldn't count against the 1 in 30 rule correct? And plus I bought the Remington out of state so WTF would MD know anyways?

Just double checking...

NittanyLion said:

Quick question. I just bought a Remington 870 and want to pickup a handgun fairly quickly. The shotgun isn't regulated, so it shouldn't count against the 1 in 30 rule correct? And plus I bought the Remington out of state so WTF would MD know anyways?

Just double checking...

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I believe you are correct. The one in thirty days only applies to regulated firearms. You are good to go.