Has there been a law suit claiming that the hql fees constitute infringement?

Amigo109 · Jun 15, 2018

I got rid of my pistols awhile back and now own none. So I'd get a new one but the hql process (classes, application, foots, FEES) is prohibitive. There's a real argument that a person who doesnt have a lot of money can't afford to legally jump through the hoops and pay the money to get a pistol. Has the HQL law and fees been challenged in court. I know our liberal legislature won't ever get rid of the hql requirement. But the courts could rule the law unconstitutional.

The same holds true for concealed carry permit. I think it's fundamentally wrong that the government can tell us that we can't carry a firearm when we're out and about. I know I'm preaching to the choir. Vent over.

ohen cepel · Jun 15, 2018

I fully agree, the law is classist/racist but don't think it has ever been challenged as such.

If you have standing and can find a lawyer think about moving forward. Depending on cost and viability I think you could get financial support for it.
Never know till you try.

nedsurf · Jun 15, 2018

This was all brought up in testimony against the law in 2013. Its very much is a disenfranchisement of poor communities which is typically also minority and underserved communities. A lawsuit on these grounds would be a good challenge but I have no idea of its likelyhood of success. Perhaps with the right plaintiff with the right fact pattern...

Blacksmith101 · Jun 15, 2018

People who can't afford the HQL costs can't afford the lawyer fees to file suit.

dogbone · Jun 15, 2018

The lawsuit by MSI against the HQL provisions of FSA 2013 is working its way through the courts.

https://www.marylandshallissue.org/...lawsuit-victory-against-the-motion-to-dismiss

DC-W · Jun 15, 2018

MSI has a lawsuit filed against the State in regard to the HQL. The case is still going forward.
https://www.marylandshallissue.org/...lawsuit-victory-against-the-motion-to-dismiss

Judge's order on refusing to dismiss the case against the state here:
https://www.marylandshallissue.org/...ents/18-hql-memorandum-and-order-re-dismissal

If you're not a member of MSI yet, you can join here:
https://www.marylandshallissue.org/jmain/join

If there's any questions you have or if there's something you think you may be able to help us with, drop a line at info@marylandshallissue.org

esqappellate · Jun 15, 2018

Amigo109 said:
I got rid of my pistols awhile back and now own none. So I'd get a new one but the hql process (classes, application, foots, FEES) is prohibitive. There's a real argument that a person who doesnt have a lot of money can't afford to legally jump through the hoops and pay the money to get a pistol. Has the HQL law and fees been challenged in court. I know our liberal legislature won't ever get rid of the hql requirement. But the courts could rule the law unconstitutional.

The same holds true for concealed carry permit. I think it's fundamentally wrong that the government can tell us that we can't carry a firearm when we're out and about. I know I'm preaching to the choir. Vent over.

We should talk. Please shoot me an email at mpennak@marylandshallissue.org with your contact info. Thx

Squaregrouper · Jun 15, 2018

Amigo109 said:
I got rid of my pistols awhile back and now own none. So I'd get a new one but the hql process (classes, application, foots, FEES) is prohibitive. There's a real argument that a person who doesnt have a lot of money can't afford to legally jump through the hoops and pay the money to get a pistol. Has the HQL law and fees been challenged in court. I know our liberal legislature won't ever get rid of the hql requirement. But the courts could rule the law unconstitutional.

The same holds true for concealed carry permit. I think it's fundamentally wrong that the government can tell us that we can't carry a firearm when we're out and about. I know I'm preaching to the choir. Vent over.

esqappellate said:
We should talk. Please shoot me an email at mpennak@marylandshallissue.org with your contact info. Thx

Amigo109- Please reach out to Esqappellate. He is the president of Maryland Shall Issue (MSI) and the man who is at the forefront of the HQL lawsuit discriminating against people with low/fixed income.
For many of us, the money, effort and travel for an HQL is a pain and costs our "fun money" for a few weeks/months. There are others who would have to miss meals or not buy needed children's clothing in order to get a HQL. These are the people MSI needs to join the lawsuit.
The HQL discriminates against poor people. Regardless of race, the single parent with three kids earning $11hr can't realistically buy a handgun to protect their family in Maryland.

EDIT- If you are a person damaged by this law and wish to pursue it with MSI, I will pay for your MSI membership for a year.

press1280 · Jun 21, 2018

Blacksmith101 said:
People who can't afford the HQL costs can't afford the lawyer fees to file suit.

The courts will tell you if you don't pay the fee then you don't have standing.

Then, if you pay the fee, they'll say you can obviously afford it and weren't harmed.

Fees are pretty difficult to fight against unless it's 1000 dollars or more. The 2nd Circuit allowed NYC's 340 dollar fee. That tells you all you need to know.

daNattyFatty · Jun 21, 2018

So what’s going on with the case now? It’s been 9 months since the last update.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Fonzy · Jun 21, 2018

DC-W said:
MSI has a lawsuit filed against the State in regard to the HQL. The case is still going forward.
https://www.marylandshallissue.org/...lawsuit-victory-against-the-motion-to-dismiss

Judge's order on refusing to dismiss the case against the state here:
https://www.marylandshallissue.org/...ents/18-hql-memorandum-and-order-re-dismissal

If you're not a member of MSI yet, you can join here:
https://www.marylandshallissue.org/jmain/join

If there's any questions you have or if there's something you think you may be able to help us with, drop a line at info@marylandshallissue.org

Checking out the MSI website now. I've seen a lot of people reference it on this site, but wasn't 100% sure what it was. In my line of work, it's an acronym that means something else.

mdrpd · Jul 2, 2018

It was a burden for me, I had to do it in steps. Coming back from disability, having sold my pre-2013 pistol, it was tough.

Amigo109 · Jul 2, 2018

squaregrouper said:
Amigo109- Please reach out to Esqappellate. He is the president of Maryland Shall Issue (MSI) and the man who is at the forefront of the HQL lawsuit discriminating against people with low/fixed income.
For many of us, the money, effort and travel for an HQL is a pain and costs our "fun money" for a few weeks/months. There are others who would have to miss meals or not buy needed children's clothing in order to get a HQL. These are the people MSI needs to join the lawsuit.
The HQL discriminates against poor people. Regardless of race, the single parent with three kids earning $11hr can't realistically buy a handgun to protect their family in Maryland.

EDIT- If you are a person damaged by this law and wish to pursue it with MSI, I will pay for your MSI membership for a year.

That's mighty kind of you to offer to pay the MSI dues. I did reach out to escapellate but I dont think I'm poor enough to help him/ help out with the lawsuit. We're tight on money but not destitute. I can afford the fees it's just a burden. When I spend a couple hundred bucks, that means I'm also giving something up, like maybe no eating out for a few months. But it's a choice. Like a lot of middle class, we dont have much extra, but we do have some luxuries like cable TV, cell phones, occasionally eat out or go to the movies, sports memberships for the kids and some music lessons. Etc.

I wish I hadn't sold my pre 2013 pistols, that would have made things easier. I didnt even realize what a hassle it would be and how the laws had changed when I let them go.

K31 · Jul 2, 2018

Fonzy said:
Checking out the MSI website now. I've seen a lot of people reference it on this site, but wasn't 100% sure what it was. In my line of work, it's an acronym that means something else.

Yes, they fight unconstitutional laws and make motherboards.

DC-W · Jul 2, 2018

Fonzy said:
Checking out the MSI website now. I've seen a lot of people reference it on this site, but wasn't 100% sure what it was. In my line of work, it's an acronym that means something else.

Thank you very much. I hope you liked what you saw.

K31 said:
Yes, they fight unconstitutional laws and make motherboards.

We like our coffee black, just like our metal.
(NSFW language)

TexDefender · Jul 2, 2018

Though I don't need one to purchase a handgun, I personally equate it to a "Poll Tax". You can't participate unless you pay.

mdrpd · Jul 2, 2018

TexDefender said:
Though I don't need one to purchase a handgun, I personally equate it to a "Poll Tax". You can't participate unless you pay.

Exactly. If they made you pay $50 to vote every five years, people would lose their minds. But "because gun owners," its no BFD.

dist1646 · Jul 2, 2018

TexDefender said:
Though I don't need one to purchase a handgun, I personally equate it to a "Poll Tax". You can't participate unless you pay.

Exactly. What other right does anyone have to pay to take a course, pay a fee to the state and pass a background check so that they have permission to fill out an application, pay a fee and pass another background check just to be able to exercise! :mad54:

Blacksmith101 · Jul 2, 2018

dist1646 said:
Exactly. What other right does anyone have to pay to take a course, pay a fee to the state and pass a background check so that they have permission to fill out an application, pay a fee and pass another background check just to be able to exercise!

To carry a hand gun in Maryland in addition you have to prove you have a reason that a bureaucrat gets to decide if it is good enough along with a number of other hoops to jump through.

Squaregrouper · Jul 2, 2018

Amigo109 said:
That's mighty kind of you to offer to pay the MSI dues. I did reach out to escapellate but I dont think I'm poor enough to help him/ help out with the lawsuit. We're tight on money but not destitute. I can afford the fees it's just a burden. When I spend a couple hundred bucks, that means I'm also giving something up, like maybe no eating out for a few months. But it's a choice. Like a lot of middle class, we dont have much extra, but we do have some luxuries like cable TV, cell phones, occasionally eat out or go to the movies, sports memberships for the kids and some music lessons. Etc.

I wish I hadn't sold my pre 2013 pistols, that would have made things easier. I didnt even realize what a hassle it would be and how the laws had changed when I let them go.

It sound like we grew up in similar situations. We both understand the highlighted info above are actual luxuries- not necessities.
Keep up the good parenting- you will be fine.

Has there been a law suit claiming that the hql fees constitute infringement?

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