Man shot in MT Airy

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  • pbharvey

    Habitual Testifier
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 27, 2012
    30,209
    How many people here would go for their guns if woken from a deep sleep in the middle of the night by a loud explosion in their home?

    How many people here would be accused of an armed home invasion?
     

    07g35xnick

    Active Member
    Feb 28, 2012
    288
    Mount airy md
    This is what I want to know. It sounds like a no-knock warrant was used. Those should be a thing of the past in 99% of all cases because they escalate situations unnecessarily.

    Maybe someone with more experience can enlighten me, but aren't some of the effects of a flash bang temporary hearing loss and disorientation?

    How many people here would go for their guns if woken from a deep sleep in the middle of the night by a loud explosion in their home?

    How many people are going to be able to hear someone shouting "police", or anything else, immediately after a flash bang is detonated near them?

    True. I'm not saying I know the guy or what happened to him was wrong but I know I would be going for my gun if it happened to me. I also avoid problems with the law so this shouldn't be an issue.
     

    CnC

    Ultimate Member
    Nov 3, 2012
    5,095
    Zang (one of the officers involved) shot and killed a man under very similar circumstances in 05, according to the blurb next to main article:

    JUNE 2005: Frederick County Sheriff's Office Deputy Charles Zang shot and killed Charles Nobel Sines at Sines' Araby Church Road home after Sines refused orders to drop his shotgun.

    From the main article:

    Vail was in one of the bedrooms and pointed a shotgun toward deputies after they entered his room, according to the sheriff's office.

    Deputies made several commands directing Vail to put down the gun, but he did not comply. Two of the sheriff's team members fired numerous rounds, striking Vail. He was pronounced dead at the scene.

    Deputies Charles Zang, a 15-year veteran of the office, and Kevin Riffle, a 7-year veteran of the office, were identified as the involved officers and have been placed on paid administrative leave.

    Kind of interesting...

    And the other officers name is "Riffle"? Really? Rifle? Riffle? huh..
     

    ericoak

    don't drop Aboma on me
    Feb 20, 2010
    6,806
    Howard County
    Sounds like a very scary situation for officers and the suspect, but how are you supposed to be expected to comply after being hit with a flash bang grenade in the middle of the night? Isn't the whole point to disorient the shit out of you?
     

    rbird7282

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 6, 2012
    18,725
    Columbia
    Sounds like a very scary situation for officers and the suspect, but how are you supposed to be expected to comply after being hit with a flash bang grenade in the middle of the night? Isn't the whole point to disorient the shit out of you?

    When you have at least two officers with weapons pointed at you and yelling at you to drop the weapon and get on the floor, you would comply. (flashbang or not)
    This guy didn't and now we are free of one less scumbag.:thumbsup:
     

    rbird7282

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 6, 2012
    18,725
    Columbia
    This is what I want to know. It sounds like a no-knock warrant was used. Those should be a thing of the past in 99% of all cases because they escalate situations unnecessarily.

    Maybe someone with more experience can enlighten me, but aren't some of the effects of a flash bang temporary hearing loss and disorientation?

    How many people here would go for their guns if woken from a deep sleep in the middle of the night by a loud explosion in their home?

    How many people are going to be able to hear someone shouting "police", or anything else, immediately after a flash bang is detonated near them?

    No they shouldn't be a thing of the past. It is much better to do this in the middle of the night when the suspect will be disoriented and will have less of a chance to arm himself, take a hostage, or get into a possible shootout in public.
    Chances are the flashbang was inside the door, not in the same room where he was sleeping. If it were in the same room, he would not have any time whatsoever to get his gun. While I feel for the officers involved, they did their job.
     

    2AHokie

    Active Member
    Dec 27, 2012
    663
    District - 9A
    No they shouldn't be a thing of the past. It is much better to do this in the middle of the night when the suspect will be disoriented and will have less of a chance to arm himself, take a hostage, or get into a possible shootout in public.
    Chances are the flashbang was inside the door, not in the same room where he was sleeping. If it were in the same room, he would not have any time whatsoever to get his gun. While I feel for the officers involved, they did their job.

    Obviously it did nothing to prevent him from arming himself.

    This also ignores the entire point I was making; police do occasionally break down the wrong door. Nothing went wrong this time, but that shouldn't be taken to mean that these types of raids never have disastrous consequences.
     

    Melnic

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 27, 2012
    15,370
    HoCo
    On a somewhat related note, if the victims of the Home invasion shoots at or hits the masked and armed suspects on thier property (not inside the home) with a gun performing armed robbery and they were threatening them with a shotgun from outside their home, pointed at them, would they be found guilty of a crime? (assuming they are able to prove all this happened as said).

    Anyone read how they identified Vail as a suspect?
     

    rbird7282

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 6, 2012
    18,725
    Columbia
    How did they ID him as a suspect? They had a warrant for him, they knew what he looked like. Actually the outstanding warrant was from Howard Co.
     

    Name Taken

    Ultimate Member
    Feb 23, 2010
    11,891
    Central
    Why the SWAT-like assault on the house in the wee hours of darkness? If they knew who the perp was, why couldn't they just get him peacefully when he walked out of the house in daylight hours? Not like he was some escaped convicted murderer holed up with hostages and an arsenal.

    Life doesnt work that way.

    When he starts to run away through yards and is armed do you want the cops chasing him through the yards and shooting him in your back yard where your kids might be? God forbid he jumps into a yard with a dog and the police kill the dog to safe their hides...we know how that plays out.

    What if he see's them coming and jumps in a car. Now you have a high speed pursuit putting lifes at risk.

    No offense....I want them confined to their houses when they want to shoot it out with the police.

    You cant walk up to violent and armed folks in the general public, tap them on the shoulder, and expect them to give up.

    Police try that every so often...and it turns into shoot outs in the middle of the streets putting public at risk.

    Just food for thought.
     

    amoebicmagician

    Samopal Goblin
    Dec 26, 2012
    4,174
    Columbia, MD
    assholes are breaking into houses more in MD due to the fact that there is no concealed carry here, and so they think NO ONE has a gun and they can work with impunity to get their fix because by the time the police get there, they're gone.

    And f**king omalley wants to disarm us down to five rounds and take our rifles? He even said in a private interview that if he could do it he would CONFISCATE OUTRIGHT every AR-15 and ak-47 in private hands in the state. No buy-back, no nothing- just

    "sorry, but you were a criminal when you bought this, since I don't agree with you having this, you should have not bought this if you didn't want to lose the money you invested in it- you know very well that the state can take whatever it wants from you and it was only a matter of time before I got my faggoty way"
     

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