Selling 30 round magazines

E.Shell said:

Agreed.

Everyone with good intentions, but a bad understanding of the real problem, wants to throw the Antis a bone.

They propose to give up something they perceive as painless or easy, in order to ensure the security of something else. In this situation, they propose to give up full capacity magazines in the hope that they can keep their limited capacity magazines and their scary looking firearms.

They are living the fantasy that the Antis will, at some point, be satisfied and leave the rest of us alone. This approach is insanity in it's classic form,
and does nothing to help.

Wake up. The Antis will not be satisfied, and agreeing to the lie that any certain facet of firearms and accessories is somehow inherently evil is not only counterproductive, but also just plain stupid. Yes, "stupid", and there is no other word to describe it.

Just the fact that this law exists harms us all. 20 round magazines, which are rather obsolete for many firearms, command a premium, and we have to pay more for a reduced capacity magazine than we would a standard capacity magazine. We have to burn time & gas to procure the correct magazine for the firearm, and are made to feel as if we are somehow compelled to skirt the law most of us happily obey. Our suppliers have to spend time & money to learn about and comply with these stupid laws, and pass this idiotic expense on to us.

In the end, we all pay a major premium on yet another bullsh!t feel-good law that does nothing to punish or deter violence, and only reinforces the myth that full capacity magazines are evil. In fact, it could be said that they are SO evil and scary, even many shooters are afraid of them and are willing to let them go without a struggle or cross word.

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+1

As always, E.Shell is spot on. To me it's no different than what we all learned about dealing with bullies as kids. When you give the bully his way, all you do is encourage him and make him look big in front of his friends, and he just gets worse.

Then there are the many historical examples, most of which go something like; "Mr. Chamberlain said if we just give Hitler this one more little country, he'll be oh so nice from now on............"

X-Factor said:

True, but if I said, "I'm going to kill you" that IS using freedom of speech, but is also a death threat and could put me in jail.

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As far as maryland goes... you can say what you want... It's not against the law to tell someone you are going to kill them...
BUT....... they may put a peace order on you and then you must surrender your weapons........ SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO lets not threaten eachother LOL

alucard0822 said:

Unless everything from offering them for sale, selling them, dropping them off at the post office, and the recipient reciving them happens outside of MD, you are "technically" breaking this ridiculous law.

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3 years imprisonment? For selling a magazine? That would mean if you sold a hi-cap to another MD resident you would lose your right to keep and bear? That is utterly insane.

Lets say i dont want the 30 rd mag anymore and i decide to throw it in the trash can. is this illegal? Im just wondering cause maybe some trash picker is out that night and gets is law breaking little hands on it.

Guvnor said:

3 years imprisonment? For selling a magazine? That would mean if you sold a hi-cap to another MD resident you would lose your right to keep and bear? That is utterly insane.

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If I was in MD(I'm a PA resident) while doing so, yea.

E. Shell is spot on. A lot of people, even some involved with 2a rights belive a little "compromise" or concessions can help our cause. That is not the case, it is all about gaining momentum, either to further gun rights, or to legislate them away, that is why each and every battle, no matter how small it may seem is important. Once a law like magazine capacity, trigger locks, or registration in some form or another passes, there are a created dozens new bills the anti-s feel empowered to push. If even small bills are actively stopped, then we are empowered and can further push to undo more of the the 20,000 gun control laws on the books, none having shown a corresponding reduction in crime, or furthering our rights in any way. This is also the reason many seen very minor, and the bills themselves seem to target random aspects of firearms, they are simply tying to see what passes, and what doesn't, and then push full force with any related bills they can. This is why small features like mag capacity, folding stocks, flash hiders, even appearance, "for the children" locks and storage requirements, ammo type, power, or construction, and owner registration, licensing, or even mandatory education are all pushed simotaneously, but when one makes it through, it seems every bill that could possibly be dreamed up in that area seems to sprout.

It works the other way too, in PA a year or two ago, I attended a rally of a few thousand people in Harrisburg to protest an annual registration tax on each and every weapon a person owned. At the time, I was a MD resident, and had no plans of moving up here, so it didn't seem to affect me at all, but I had the day off, nothing better to do, and I went. Turned out the huge and vocal opposition flattened the bill, and years later nothing similar has gained any ground, other schemes, other nuances of gun ownership yes, but nothing like had been previously proposed. This momentum carried on to change the interpretation of the law to allow non-residents with 3rd party states concealed carry permits to carry in PA, it also opened the door for carry in state parks that recently passed, and most recently through a few favorable law suits to change policies that harassed legal open carryers. This momentum can carry across state lines too, as MD pays attention to what goes on around it, and MSI and VCDL teaming up has allowed us to gain a good bit of traction in the fight in MD.

To understand what the Brady campaign and anti-gun politicians consider "reasonable" rstrictions, you have to look at the goals of those at the center of the debate. Crime, safety, and even guns themselves are simply semantics used by both sides as a front for a larger debate, and that is compliance with governmental authority, as the saying goes, gun control has little to do with guns, and a lot to do with control. Most of those behind the scenes know full well that criminals will always get guns, that honest people will follow whatever laws are on the books, and that the only real opposition to widespread forced social engineering is the people themselves, and their ability to counter the power of a government, the founders knew this. We are a nation of laws, and have been for some times, but history teaches us that the battle of freedom vs opression comes down to what people or a government can do, and what they can't do, law be dammed. Criminals usually hide from the law, and don't really care about breeaking it, they place self preservation, and not getting caught well above any moral purpose, and represent no real threat to a government, only to the governed.

A citizenry made up of decent and moral people have destroyed tyrannical governments time after time throughout history, sometimes through violence, sometimes not, but their ability to organize, and physically stop tyranny is at the heart of the constitution, and our own liberty, without arms we are relatively harmless, and easily contained, and therefore easy to tyranize. The big secret is that there is a relatively small number of feeble old men that set the course of the nation, and a huge number of people that are mostly along for the ride, however the only way for those at the helm to keep from sinking the ship is for them to have a constant and healthy fear of their passengers, and to keep the ship on course. Take away the weapons and the deterrent they represent, and they can sail to wherever they damn well please, as proven time and time again by the tens of millions of dead, killed by their own government in the name of one cause or another.

sorry for the long and quasi OT rant, but this is a topic that strikes near and dear, as it probably does with others who have been going at it face to face for a long time with those who seek to make us defenseless.

+1,000,000

Great post. alucard. (I may borrow it sometime)

INMY01TA said:

Great post. alucard. (I may borrow it sometime)

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+ 1

so this is the internet, which doesn't have a "state" that it falls into. how would it be illegal for me to say in the classifieds... "i'm selling 3 30/rd mags, we must meet in PA for the transaction"? would it be illegal because I, a MD resident, am planning a sale to another MD resident? because at the moment i am in Utah on vacation. so i am not physically in MD planning this. its not taking place within MD. and even if i were in MD, its happening through the internet, so how can it be illegal for me to list 30/rd mags for sale, and say we'll meet somewhere else?

Oldcarjunkie said:

Lets say i dont want the 30 rd mag anymore and i decide to throw it in the trash can. is this illegal? Im just wondering cause maybe some trash picker is out that night and gets is law breaking little hands on it.

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I've wondered the same thing. Even if ther were no trash picker, Wouldn't you have to transfer the magazine to the trashman to get rid of it?

mvee said:

I've wondered the same thing. Even if ther were no trash picker, Wouldn't you have to transfer the magazine to the trashman to get rid of it?

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Just put them in the Blue Recycle/ Re-Loading Bin ! LOL

UT to MD

I just made a trip to Salt Lake City, UT last week. Once out there, I realized they sell 30 round magazines for $25 with no questions asked!!!

I bought a few and now have them in Maryland... Did I break the law in MD...? I don't think so, but I got them now and I made sure to use my credit card just to prove I purchased them in a NRA state...! (lol)

cowboywildbill said:

Just put them in the Blue Recycle/ Re-Loading Bin ! LOL

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yeah, everyone knows they can only be used once

I bring my magazines with me when I go to Va and WV. Doesn't everyone?

dragonfire1911 said:

I bring my magazines with me when I go to Va and WV. Doesn't everyone?

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Why?

X-Factor said:

True, but if I said, "I'm going to kill you" that IS using freedom of speech, but is also a death threat and could put me in jail.

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Sorry to go off subject, but I just wanted to touch base on this subject.
You are correct that saying "I'm going to kill you" in and of itself IS protected speech, because it does not meet the standard of imminent lawless action which would make it illegal.
However it may or may not be considered a criminal threat depending on a number of circumstances. Generally for a threat to be considered criminal it must be made is writing, though depending on the situation or jurisdiction any oral statement of intent which is simply perceived as "threatening" or "distressing" by a recipient may be enough to constitute a criminal charge. Typically that's not the case though.

Learning stuff is fun!

*I'm not a lawyer, this isn't legal advice, blah blah blah*

P.S. Just take the mags out of state if you want to get rid of them.
Any reason you decided not to keep them? If you got rid of the gun that uses them that would be a pretty good reason, lol.

Tylenator said:

so this is the internet, which doesn't have a "state" that it falls into. how would it be illegal for me to say in the classifieds... "i'm selling 3 30/rd mags, we must meet in PA for the transaction"? would it be illegal because I, a MD resident, am planning a sale to another MD resident? because at the moment i am in Utah on vacation. so i am not physically in MD planning this. its not taking place within MD. and even if i were in MD, its happening through the internet, so how can it be illegal for me to list 30/rd mags for sale, and say we'll meet somewhere else?

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All well and good. But until you manage to convince MD of all those facts, you could have been arrested and have had to hire a lawyer and maybe even go to court.

Is it worth all that?

I live in WV and would be interested. PM me!
pablo

Guvnor said:

3 years imprisonment? For selling a magazine? That would mean if you sold a hi-cap to another MD resident you would lose your right to keep and bear? That is utterly insane.

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Isn't that the ultimate desire of the antis and the embedded purpose of these types of unconstitutional laws?

Pinecone said:

All well and good. But until you manage to convince MD of all those facts, you could have been arrested and have had to hire a lawyer and maybe even go to court.

Is it worth all that?

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When you know you're in the right, yes... yes it is. People are "arrested" all the time for exercising their rights lawfully. Does the fact that happens mean we should all cease to exercise those rights? HELL NO!

You need to stop fearing the police, their authority, and what they "might do". A lot of different people MIGHT do a lot of different things to you. A lot of bad things MIGHT happen to you. You might die in a car accident tomorrow. So what? It's no reason not to go out or not to drive.

Have some self respect, stand up for yourself, and actually LIVE dammit!