Is there something wrong with my Beretta 92?

alucard0822 · Sep 5, 2016

There is a fairly significant chamfer around the firing pin channel on 92s, so the primer marks aren't unusual, same way GLOCKs leave a rectangle, Berettas leave a donut. The groups could be unfamiliarity with the pistol, could be a problem with an out of spec pistol. If the sights came noticeably off center, that would be a problem.

StickShaker · Sep 5, 2016

alucard0822 said:
There is a fairly significant chamfer around the firing pin channel on 92s, so the primer marks aren't unusual, same way GLOCKs leave a rectangle, Berettas leave a donut. The groups could be unfamiliarity with the pistol, could be a problem with an out of spec pistol. If the sights came noticeably off center, that would be a problem.

Thanks for the information. It sucks but thanks anyway. :thumbsup:

The thing with the sights are, both the front and rear are off to the left. The rear all the way and the front almost. If the front was moved to the center the rear could almost or maybe be in the center too.

Magnumite · Sep 6, 2016

If both sights are left then moving both toward center and adjusting would yield aropr result. Isn't the 92's front sight machined as part of the slide? If so...

Is the notch centered in the rear sight itself?

StickShaker · Sep 6, 2016

Magnumite said:
If both sights are left then moving both toward center and adjusting would yield aropr result. Isn't the 92's front sight machined as part of the slide? If so...

Is the notch centered in the rear sight itself?

Mine is the A1 model which may be different. The front sight looks like it's mounted in a very low profile dovetail although I couldn't see any angle cuts from the side. I need to look at it with a magnifier to be sure. What would be the base of a dovetail is slightly wider than the front sight (just like the rear) and I'm judging center by looking at the amount of machined base on each side of the sight. Just a guess, it looks like the front sight needs to be moved to the right somewhere between 1/32 and 1/16 to be centered.

I would say the notch in the rear sight is centered but I can measure that.

DutchV · Sep 6, 2016

StickShaker said:
Mine is the A1 model which may be different. The front site looks like it's mounted in a very low profile dovetail although I couldn't see any angle cuts from the side. I need to look at it with a magnifier to be sure. What would be the base of a dovetail is slightly wider than the front sight (just like the rear) and I'm judging center by looking at the amount of machined base on each side of the sight. Just a guess, it looks like the front sight needs to be moved to the right somewhere between 1/32 and 1/16 to be centered.

I would say the notch in the rear site is centered but I can measure that too.

A drop of oil will help show the dovetail slot, if it's there. The oil will wick into the tiny gap between the slide and the sight.

StickShaker · Sep 6, 2016

DutchV said:
A drop of oil will help show the dovetail slot, if it's there. The oil will wick into the tiny gap between the slide and the sight.

Excellent idea :thumbsup:

Magnumite · Sep 6, 2016

You are correct. I stopped at a gun shop and saw both the 92 and an A1. The A1 was dovetail, the 92 milled. If your front sight is set off center then that could explain it. To adjust front sights are moved opposite the way of needed change. So if you drift it (front sight) to the right bullet impact will move left.

I would center the front sight and take it from there. As an aside I did have an older Taurus 92 which is essentially a Beretta and the fired primers never looked like the OP's. However, others allude to knowledge of those being normal so I'll take that as lesson learned...school is in session!

StickShaker · Sep 7, 2016

ahphilip said:
I think I'd run a few hundred rounds through it before I even begin analyzing problems. Get a bunch of Winchester white box a sling some lead for a couple range trips, also consider having another trusted shooter shoot a couple mags to see their success rate.

Magnumite said:
You are correct. I stopped at a gun shop and saw both the 92 and an A1. The A1 was dovetail, the 92 milled. If your front sight is set off center then that could explain it. To adjust front sights are moved opposite the way of needed change. So if you drift it (front sight) to the right bullet impact will move left.

I would center the front sight and take it from there. As an aside I did have an older Taurus 92 which is essentially a Beretta and the fired primers never looked like the OP's. However, others allude to knowledge of those being normal so I'll take that as lesson learned...school is in session!

The primers were my main concern so I'm going to take ahphilip's advice and fire more rounds before worrying about anything else.

I tried to move the front sight last night but no luck. I found someone on another forum who swapped them out for different sights and he had to beat on them unmercifully. Not sure if I want to do that on my new gun. I have a feeling they were installed with locking compound and it may take some heat to break it loose like you would with red Loctite.

According to an online calculator I found, the front or rear needs to be moved .020 for a 2" correction at 50' which should put them spot on. After measuring the front dovetail there is not as much movement as I thought and .020 should actually put the sight almost to the far right.

I also found out why I was shooting so low. The Beretta sights are set up to align the white dots on your point of aim. I don't like that at all because in most cases the sights will obscure what I'm aiming for, like they did on the orange dots when I decided to or thought I was aiming high.

Orthogonal · Sep 7, 2016

For comparison, here's a sampling of some factory brass primer strikes from my 92FS. Like previous posters said, they show the imprint from the firing pin hole. Some approach the level of deformation you are seeing.

From left to right, if memory serves, Speer LE 124gr, Freedom Munitions New RN 115gr, Magtech 115gr RN.

guthook · Sep 7, 2016

Just checked my M9A1. I guess there is no chamfer on this model. Firing pin hole is cylindrical and the pin fills the hole when engaged. (Shown retracted in pic.)

Hole measures out to approx. .0835"

StickShaker · Sep 8, 2016

Orthogonal said:
For comparison, here's a sampling of some factory brass primer strikes from my 92FS. Like previous posters said, they show the imprint from the firing pin hole. Some approach the level of deformation you are seeing.

From left to right, if memory serves, Speer LE 124gr, Freedom Munitions New RN 115gr, Magtech 115gr RN.

guthook said:
Just checked my M9A1. I guess there is no chamfer on this model. Firing pin hole is cylindrical and the pin fills the hole when engaged. (Shown retracted in pic.)

Hole measures out to approx. .0835"

Thanks to both of you for the pics and confirmation! Guthook, I'm seeing a chamfer on yours and it looks to be the same size as the one on my gun. The small ring around the firing pin hole with no brass on it.

guthook · Sep 8, 2016

Well I'll be damned. upon closer inspection, there is a very slight chamfer around the hole. Learn something new every day.
Here's a better pic showing firing pin fully protruded.

Blaster229 · Sep 9, 2016

Anyone with a 96 see anything like this?

alucard0822 · Sep 9, 2016

guthook said:
Well I'll be damned. upon closer inspection, there is a very slight chamfer around the hole. Learn something new every day.
Here's a better pic showing firing pin fully protruded.

View attachment 185928

Most of the primer flow is around the space left by the long taper of the firing pin, you can see how "pointy" the pin is. Intended to reduce the chances of a burr on the breech face or fouling in the pin channel causing a stoppage.

guthook · Sep 9, 2016

It'd have to be. My chamfer is so slight, I missed it the first 2 times trying to find it.

Come to think of it, I've never used factory ammo, ever, in my 92. I most likely haven't had the cratering due to my powder puff loads.

StickShaker · Sep 10, 2016

guthook said:
It'd have to be. My chamfer is so slight, I missed it the first 2 times trying to find it.

Come to think of it, I've never used factory ammo, ever, in my 92. I most likely haven't had the cratering due to my powder puff loads.

That's interesting, I want to develop a light load also and tried first with Clays because I have so much of it. The two other groups I shot were with 2.8 and 3.0 grains, well below a starting load, and those primers cratered just as badly as the ones shown in my first post. Actually, some of those super light loads (WIN) may already be in the pic because I randomly chose them as they all looked the same. I wonder if that happened because Clays is such a fast powder?

What brand of primers do you use? I was using Remington 1 1/2's and the cup seems very soft on those.

kalister1 · Sep 10, 2016

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-160682.html

There is a school of thought that very light loads do not put enough pressure on the breach face, allowing primers to back out of the case. I don't know if this is the same type of issue?

StickShaker · Sep 10, 2016

kalister1 said:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-160682.html

There is a school of thought that very light loads do not put enough pressure on the breach face, allowing primers to back out of the case. I don't know if this is the same type of issue?

Could be....I'm new to reloading so just about everything is a learning experience. None of the reloads cycled properly either. Some stayed in the chamber, some stovepiped, some ejected but the new round jammed.

guthook · Sep 10, 2016

StickShaker said:
What brand of primers do you use? I was using Remington 1 1/2's and the cup seems very soft on those.

Usually Federal, Winchester or Fiocchi. Standard Sm Pistol primers. Whatever is available. I've never tried Remington.

Always with 147gr Plated RN over 3.3gr Titegroup.

StickShaker · Sep 10, 2016

guthook said:
Usually Federal, Winchester or Fiocchi. Standard Sm Pistol primers. Whatever is available. I've never tried Remington.

Always with 147gr Plated RN over 3.3gr Titegroup.

I was planning to go to the gun show today so I looked through all of my reloading books and made a list of the most popular 9mm powders. Damn if I didn't forget to take the list with me. :banghead:

I remembered Win231 and Power Pistol so that's what I bought to try out. Is there a reason for the heavy 147gr? Would that operate the slide better with light loads?

Is there something wrong with my Beretta 92?

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