Ruger Rimfire Shoot - Rifle Recommendations

bn_bullet · Feb 24, 2013

So, I want to participate in a rimfire shoot and would like suggestions for a rifle. I have a Browning Buckmark for the pistol shoot but do not have a suitable semi-auto rifle. Should I just look for a 10/22 or would an AR in 22LR be a good choice? TIA for any recommendations.

ItsGarand · Feb 24, 2013

bn_bullet said:
So, I want to participate in a rimfire shoot and would like suggestions for a rifle. I have a Browning Buckmark for the pistol shoot but do not have a suitable semi-auto rifle. Should I just look for a 10/22 or would an AR in 22LR be a good choice? TIA for any recommendations.

If you can find one...

Ruger 10/22-LVT

http://www.gunblast.com/Acusport1022s.htm

Change the swivels to mil-spec size and put a sling and scope on it.

http://www.gunsamerica.com/992239618/RUGER_10_22_LVT_22LR.htm

DoubleTap007 · Feb 24, 2013

Can't go wrong with a S&W MP15-22.

photoracer · Feb 25, 2013

Having shot the last 2 Ruger Rimfire World Championships I can give you my $.02 worth.
Mainly 2 types:
1. Normal .22 semi with the Ruger 10/22 and Remington 597 covering at least 95% of those shooting that type of rifle.
2. AR .22s A mix but the S&W AR15-22 is at least 50% of those now.
From the perspective of the top 4 shooters in 2010 and 2011 (BJ Norris, Mark Izstein, John Allchin, and John Begaskis). The first 2 shot ARs with Tac Sol .22 conversions while the last 2 shot ultra exotic 10/22s that were almost all Volquartsen parts.
I used a Rem 597 from 2010 until just before the 2011 RRWC. I had something like $1000 in the gun by then. For the 2011 RRWC I shot an AR15-22 Performance Center model and an exotic Browning Buckmark of my own design (23th out of 120 shooters) In 2012 I shot the AR15-22 the first day and an AR conversion the second day (22nd out of 166 shooters). John Allchin won the 2012 title (2010 winner also). I outshot him for 2nd place in the Wounded Warrior side match using a cheap AR (DMPS Sportical upper, NFA lower, CMMG .22 conversion) converted to .22.
So what I am really saying it it does not matter that much. However to optimize the rifle for RR, the AR platforms, including the AR15-22, have several advantages. Biggest one is the availability of 3-gun specific triggers, which have an advantage over most 10/22 or 597 setups because they are designed for rapid shooting and target engagement. Most of the triggers for the others are designed more for precision shooting but can be adapted. All of them have 25-30 round mags available. The new 2013 RR rules allow the use of big mags but if you shoot more than 11 rounds in a single run you will get penalized. Not a real problem.
If I was starting from scratch I would buy a basic S&W AR15-22 and install a $10 set of JP low power springs in the stock trigger group. That is enough to get you competitive against any local competition except top shooters in your area. Put a decent $60-100 red dot on it and you will be good to go. Or shoot Limited with the iron sights, but then your pistol will also have to use iron or FO sights. Scopes and red dots are Open class only.
Sanners Lake is looking to sponsor a Ruger event. Or the monthly Monocacy Pistol Club Speed Steel match allows both .22 rifles and pistols and it similar to Ruger Rimfire. Also the Pennsylvania Steel league allows rimfires and is similar also. There will likely be Ruger Regional events this year again in Southern New Jersey and in PA, and one is on the schedule in NY state. The 2013 RRWC is in Byers, Colorado near Denver, which just happens to be the home club of Michael Bane (Outdoor TV's "Shooting Gallery") one of the founders of Ruger Rimfire.

photoracer · Feb 25, 2013

ItsGarand said:
If you can find one...

Ruger 10/22-LVT

http://www.gunblast.com/Acusport1022s.htm

Change the swivels to mil-spec size and put a sling and scope on it.

http://www.gunsamerica.com/992239618/RUGER_10_22_LVT_22LR.htm

Waste of money for Ruger Rimfire. You need a lightweight rifle with a fast trigger, unless you want to just shoot mid-pack and have fun. Otherwise an AR15-22 is the best setup out of the box although the trigger is around 5#, which you can fix with a set of $10 JP Yellow springs.

BenL · Feb 25, 2013

photoracer said:
Having shot the last 2 Ruger Rimfire World Championships I can give you my $.02 worth.
Mainly 2 types:
1. Normal .22 semi with the Ruger 10/22 and Remington 597 covering at least 95% of those shooting that type of rifle.
2. AR .22s A mix but the S&W AR15-22 is at least 50% of those now.
From the perspective of the top 4 shooters in 2010 and 2011 (BJ Norris, Mark Izstein, John Allchin, and John Begaskis). The first 2 shot ARs with Tac Sol .22 conversions while the last 2 shot ultra exotic 10/22s that were almost all Volquartsen parts.
I used a Rem 597 from 2010 until just before the 2011 RRWC. I had something like $1000 in the gun by then. For the 2011 RRWC I shot an AR15-22 Performance Center model and an exotic Browning Buckmark of my own design (23th out of 120 shooters) In 2012 I shot the AR15-22 the first day and an AR conversion the second day (22nd out of 166 shooters). John Allchin won the 2012 title (2010 winner also). I outshot him for 2nd place in the Wounded Warrior side match using a cheap AR (DMPS Sportical upper, NFA lower, CMMG .22 conversion) converted to .22.
So what I am really saying it it does not matter that much. However to optimize the rifle for RR, the AR platforms, including the AR15-22, have several advantages. Biggest one is the availability of 3-gun specific triggers, which have an advantage over most 10/22 or 597 setups because they are designed for rapid shooting and target engagement. Most of the triggers for the others are designed more for precision shooting but can be adapted. All of them have 25-30 round mags available. The new 2013 RR rules allow the use of big mags but if you shoot more than 11 rounds in a single run you will get penalized. Not a real problem.
If I was starting from scratch I would buy a basic S&W AR15-22 and install a $10 set of JP low power springs in the stock trigger group. That is enough to get you competitive against any local competition except top shooters in your area. Put a decent $60-100 red dot on it and you will be good to go. Or shoot Limited with the iron sights, but then your pistol will also have to use iron or FO sights. Scopes and red dots are Open class only.
Sanners Lake is looking to sponsor a Ruger event. Or the monthly Monocacy Pistol Club Speed Steel match allows both .22 rifles and pistols and it similar to Ruger Rimfire. Also the Pennsylvania Steel league allows rimfires and is similar also. There will likely be Ruger Regional events this year again in Southern New Jersey and in PA, and one is on the schedule in NY state. The 2013 RRWC is in Byers, Colorado near Denver, which just happens to be the home club of Michael Bane (Outdoor TV's "Shooting Gallery") one of the founders of Ruger Rimfire.

PM inbound.

bn_bullet · Feb 25, 2013

Thanks to everyone and especially photoracer for sharing your knowledge. I like the idea of using an AR based rifle and it sounds like the 15-22 is a good first choice. I shot a friends before and thought it was decent enough. I am comfortable building an AR but was not sure if the CMMG 22 upper would be very reliable or accurate. I've built a 9mm AR using CMMG parts and have been very pleased with its performance so I would suppose the CMMG 22 parts to be of good quality.

To get started though, I think you give good advice to just get a 15-22. Now, I just need to find one and top it with a red dot of some sort. I'm thinking a Millett 30mm red dot would work okay and they are on sale at Midway this month!

Thanks again.

photoracer · Mar 1, 2013

Just about any good red dot will do. Cheap ones can be a little dim. Most of the big shooters use C-Mores ($210). BJ puts Aimpoint Micros on all of his competition guns. For RR I usually use a TruGlo Dual Color reflex sight ($60) or a Pentax HS20 ($55) on my 15-22s. I have C-Mores on my Buckmark and my USPSA STI Open gun but these others work fine on a .22 rifle.

jimbobborg · Mar 1, 2013

The only thing I don't like about the S&Ws is their magazines are proprietary.

Tactics · Mar 1, 2013

jimbobborg said:
The only thing I don't like about the S&Ws is their magazines are proprietary.

+1

Trumpet · Mar 3, 2013

photoracer said:
Just about any good red dot will do. Cheap ones can be a little dim. Most of the big shooters use C-Mores ($210). BJ puts Aimpoint Micros on all of his competition guns. For RR I usually use a TruGlo Dual Color reflex sight ($60) or a Pentax HS20 ($55) on my 15-22s. I have C-Mores on my Buckmark and my USPSA STI Open gun but these others work fine on a .22 rifle.

Great info! I'm looking at getting a dot(s) for my pistols. Any thoughts on the Burris fast fires? I know they're a little more spendy though. How are the OKO? Have you had good results with the Pentax? I like the idea of the 5 MOA dot. Seems like a nice compromise.

photoracer · Mar 5, 2013

jimbobborg said:
The only thing I don't like about the S&Ws is their magazines are proprietary.

Yes but there are 2 other sources for AR15-22 mags right now, Promag makes 10 and 32 round mags, and Plinker Tactical makes 35 round mags. I have 2 of the Promag 32s and they work just as well as the factory S&W 25s. And don't forget the BDM 50 rd. drum. I have one of those also and it works well so far.

photoracer · Mar 5, 2013

Trumpet said:
Great info! I'm looking at getting a dot(s) for my pistols. Any thoughts on the Burris fast fires? I know they're a little more spendy though. How are the OKO? Have you had good results with the Pentax? I like the idea of the 5 MOA dot. Seems like a nice compromise.

I am not a big fan of mini red dots although I have 2, a $299 Pride-Fowler Spec Ops and a $99 Sightmark mini. I used to use the P-F one on top of a Sig P229 Sport open class gun. I prefer a sight with a bigger window as it makes shooting with both eyes open easier to do, plus the windows are bigger allowing you to see the next target in the window much of the time.

photoracer · Jul 4, 2013

Here are some current updates:
1. S&W decided they did not like others making versions of their 15-22 mags so they threatened to sue both Plinker Tactical and Promag if they kept making them. Supply has not dried up but they will. Thumbs down to S&W. If they made enough mags to meet demand no one would have bothered.
2. Sanners Lake now has monthly Ruger Rimfire matches. Thumbs up.
3. Due to some gun control initiatives imposed by Colorado the NSSF has moved the 2013 Ruger Rimfire Challenge World Championship out of Colorado to the United States Shooting Academy north of Tulsa, Oklahoma on July 20-21. Thumbs up to the NSSF for moving closer to the East at a great venue, one of the top shooting ranges in the US.. 12 stages of fire, 6 each pistol and rifle, all best 4 out of 5 runs, 5-7 static steel per stage. This year they went back to publishing the stages. So I can make them up and practice at MPC. Also Ruger dropped the penalty time across the board to a flat 2 seconds per miss/procedural under the new rules.

deMontjoie · Jul 4, 2013

Sanner's Next Event is Sunday, 21 July, from 0900 - ~1400

See here for details.

The Club's front-gate is open from ~0830 - 0855 on match-dates for public access.

We usually have many folks who are willing to share their firearms at these events. From lever-action "cowboy" guns through stock 10/22s up to tricked-out ARs.

This event is designed to be VERY welcoming to new shooters, while also being challenging for world-class shooters. :thumbsup:

I've attached a photo of one of the new shooters at our June match. He shot quite well. :clap:

P.S. Thanks to PhotoRacer for the plug.

Trumpet · Jul 4, 2013

photoracer said:
I am not a big fan of mini red dots although I have 2, a $299 Pride-Fowler Spec Ops and a $99 Sightmark mini. I used to use the P-F one on top of a Sig P229 Sport open class gun. I prefer a sight with a bigger window as it makes shooting with both eyes open easier to do, plus the windows are bigger allowing you to see the next target in the window much of the time.

Sorry to resurrect this thread, but like what kind of sight? I tend to agree and am finding that I want a bigger window too.

photoracer · Jul 5, 2013

deMontjoie said:
See here for details.

The Club's front-gate is open from ~0830 - 0855 on match-dates for public access.

We usually have many folks who are willing to share their firearms at these events. From lever-action "cowboy" guns through stock 10/22s up to tricked-out ARs.

This event is designed to be VERY welcoming to new shooters, while also being challenging for world-class shooters.

I've attached a photo of one of the new shooters at our June match. He shot quite well.

P.S. Thanks to PhotoRacer for the plug.

Even though it is a good bit of a drive from Hagerstown I will make it to one of your matches these days. Maybe you should consider doing a regional event next year. Having been to a few I could give you some ideas. They don't have to be a big as the worlds. A lot depends on the amount of room you have.

photoracer · Jul 5, 2013

Trumpet said:
Sorry to resurrect this thread, but like what kind of sight? I tend to agree and am finding that I want a bigger window too.

I like windows with thin edges so they don't interfere visually with shooting both eyes open. I prefer the bigger windows of the C-More, and also the Asian designed reflex sights (although I won't use anything except a TruGlo because they up the QC and reliability of whoever makes theirs). I especially like the dual red/green ones because green is much brighter at high noon than many red ones (except the C-More). I also own tube type red/green dot sights as large as 42mm. They work OK also but I tend to use them as backups these days.
There is one with a really huge window, the MG Kemper XL, from Firefield. Firefield is the cheaper (if you can believe it) house brand of Aim Sports. The MG stands for machine gun because the window is so big it can be used on full auto guns. Has a multiple dot BDC type reticle (similar to a bow red dot). I have heard both good and bad about it but have a hard time believing it would stand up to serious recoil even though they say it can. Currently close out prices on it can dip under $100. One of those things if it works it would be a serious bargain, but if it falls apart its just another thing to toss in a box. On something like a .22 it might work if its not too heavy. The piece of glass in it is as big as a night vision sniper scope.

hvymax · Jul 5, 2013

10-22

Trumpet · Jul 5, 2013

photoracer said:
I like windows with thin edges so they don't interfere visually with shooting both eyes open. I prefer the bigger windows of the C-More, and also the Asian designed reflex sights (although I won't use anything except a TruGlo because they up the QC and reliability of whoever makes theirs). I especially like the dual red/green ones because green is much brighter at high noon than many red ones (except the C-More). I also own tube type red/green dot sights as large as 42mm. They work OK also but I tend to use them as backups these days.
There is one with a really huge window, the MG Kemper XL, from Firefield. Firefield is the cheaper (if you can believe it) house brand of Aim Sports. The MG stands for machine gun because the window is so big it can be used on full auto guns. Has a multiple dot BDC type reticle (similar to a bow red dot). I have heard both good and bad about it but have a hard time believing it would stand up to serious recoil even though they say it can. Currently close out prices on it can dip under $100. One of those things if it works it would be a serious bargain, but if it falls apart its just another thing to toss in a box. On something like a .22 it might work if its not too heavy. The piece of glass in it is as big as a night vision sniper scope.

Thanks!
Holy crap that thing has a huge window! I hope it comes with a squeegee for cleaning it. I was thinking about a C-more for my 41. Any experience with the Airsoft Cmore knockoffs? I hear they actually will take Cmore parts. Also, any input on the OKO sight?

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