AR-15 build info.

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  • CATCC75

    Member
    Sep 24, 2015
    4
    Hollywood MD
    AR 15 Build List?

    HI everyone,

    I am putting together a build list that I wanted to run by the group to see if I am missing anything:

    PSA 18" RIFLE LENGTH .223 WYLDE 1/7 STAINLESS STEEL 15" LIGHTWEIGHT M-LOK UPPER WITH BCG, CH, & MBUS SIGHT SET – 516446673. $360

    BCMGUNFIGHTER AR-15 Enhanced Lower Parts Kit, FDE. 100-018-637WB $120

    AERO PRECISION - AR-15 GEN 2 STRIPPED LOWER RECEIVER, BLACK. $45

    AR-15 STR Stock Collapsible Mil-Spec FDE, 100-009-322WB $76

    BRAVO COMPANY - AR-15/M16 MIL-SPEC BUFFER TUBE ASSEMBLY. $58

    MAGPUL - AR-15 30RD PMAG GEN M3 MAGAZINE 223/5.56 $15

    Any input is appreciated.
     

    Hawkeye

    The Leatherstocking
    Jan 29, 2009
    3,971
    Ok, so here's the big one:

    That rifle will be illegal if you live in Maryland.

    The short version is that unless you owned the lower receiver before 10/1/13 (and I am making the possibly bad assumption that you didn't, since you listed it in your prices above) then if you build a rifle on it, it has to be HBAR / Heavy Barrel. The barrel on the Palmetto upper you're listing is lightweight, so a rifle built from it on a post 10/1/13 lower would be banned here. If you want to build an AR on a new lower, you've got two options:
    1. Use an HBAR / Heavy barrel
    2. Put an ATF approved brace on it and make it a pistol.

    In order to be "legally" a heavy barrel (no matter what it actually looks like) the barrel must be marked or advertised by the manufacturer as heavy or HBAR. The upper you have is listed as lightweight, but this one:
    https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa...htweight-m-lok-upper-no-bcg-ch-516444448.html
    For a few bucks more is listed as heavy and would be legal to build with.

    You also can't buy that magazine here, though you could drive to PA and pick as many up as you want and bring them back.

    The LPK you've got listed is expensive. BCM makes nice stuff and I run their grips on my rifles, but unless you really want that trigger or something, I'd do a Palmetto EPT (enhanced polished trigger) kit and then add the BCM grip. You'll save about $50 that way. This kit https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-defender-classic-lower-parts-kit.html and then add the grip for $25.
     

    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,678
    Ok, so here's the big one:

    That rifle will be illegal if you live in Maryland.

    The short version is that unless you owned the lower receiver before 10/1/13 (and I am making the possibly bad assumption that you didn't, since you listed it in your prices above) then if you build a rifle on it, it has to be HBAR / Heavy Barrel. The barrel on the Palmetto upper you're listing is lightweight, so a rifle built from it on a post 10/1/13 lower would be banned here. If you want to build an AR on a new lower, you've got two options:
    1. Use an HBAR / Heavy barrel
    2. Put an ATF approved brace on it and make it a pistol.

    In order to be "legally" a heavy barrel (no matter what it actually looks like) the barrel must be marked or advertised by the manufacturer as heavy or HBAR. The upper you have is listed as lightweight, but this one:
    https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa...htweight-m-lok-upper-no-bcg-ch-516444448.html
    For a few bucks more is listed as heavy and would be legal to build with.

    You also can't buy that magazine here, though you could drive to PA and pick as many up as you want and bring them back.

    The LPK you've got listed is expensive. BCM makes nice stuff and I run their grips on my rifles, but unless you really want that trigger or something, I'd do a Palmetto EPT (enhanced polished trigger) kit and then add the BCM grip. You'll save about $50 that way. This kit https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-defender-classic-lower-parts-kit.html and then add the grip for $25.

    IMHO the best cheap setup I've found is the Midway Stoner enhanced polished triggers and the JP reduced power springs, get the JPS4.5 Service Rifle kit. Or at least that is what I have in 2 rifles. One with the PSA enhanced trigger and one with the Stoner EPT. Both have gone bang 100% on everything I've fed the rifles out of at least 500+ rounds since I had those setups (one is a 6.5 Grendel rifle and one is a 5.56). I also have a stoner in another lower that isn't currently in use with some other reduced power spring kit (I think it might be the JPS4.0) No failures in that either, but I don't notice any real difference in pull weight, so the lower power makes more concerned on consistent bangs (I've had no issues, but only put about 200rnds through that lower before I sold the upper).

    Anyway, the Stoner tiggers both have less creep, no noticeable difference in smoothness, but the pull weight is noticeably lower. I'd guess actual pull weights are probably ~5-5.5lbs on the Stoner setups and I'd guess about 6lbs on the PSA trigger setup.

    I also have two milspec triggers (what used to be in 2 of the guns). Noticeably more creep and grittier on them and with regular milspec springs I'd guess the pull weights were around 9-10lbs on them.

    Also to chime in, agreed with the last poster, that upper isn't going to be legal on a Maryland AR-15 unless you owned the lower prior to 10/2013.

    PS One note on the Stoner triggers, if you watch and wait, Midway has them on sale for $19.99 a few weeks out of the year.
     

    Hawkeye

    The Leatherstocking
    Jan 29, 2009
    3,971
    Sure man. The laws here are confusing, and nobody wants anybody else to make an unknowing mistake that could land you in jail!
     

    Atrox88

    Gold Member
    Jan 7, 2016
    1,245
    Carroll County
    Guess I'll pipe in here. I bought a Glock-style AR-9 upper from PSA, a PSA Gen4 8" 9mm 1/10 Nitride 7" Lightweight M-Lok Upper (5165449737) The lowers went on sale and I found out they won't ship a complete lower to Maryland BUT they will ship a stripped receiver. Their customer service was very helpful and said I could ship the upper back for a full refund or build a lower. So it looks like I'm going to build my first lower. I also found out that I do not have to use a PSA lower/receiver with their uppers. Any suggestions on a Glock-style lower and build would be greatly appreciated.
     

    IX-3

    Active Member
    Aug 21, 2018
    424
    Eastern Shore, MD
    Guess I'll pipe in here. I bought a Glock-style AR-9 upper from PSA, a PSA Gen4 8" 9mm 1/10 Nitride 7" Lightweight M-Lok Upper (5165449737) The lowers went on sale and I found out they won't ship a complete lower to Maryland BUT they will ship a stripped receiver. Their customer service was very helpful and said I could ship the upper back for a full refund or build a lower. So it looks like I'm going to build my first lower. I also found out that I do not have to use a PSA lower/receiver with their uppers. Any suggestions on a Glock-style lower and build would be greatly appreciated.

    You can always see if your local FFL will order it for you. Mine had a complete PSA 9MM lower on his shelf a month ago as well as a matching 8” upper.

    I have a KE Arms Glock lower that so far is working pretty well. I did have a slight problem getting it because my FFL’s distributor took it upon themselves to decide it was “illegal in Maryland” (it’s not) and cancelled my order so he ordered it straight from KE Arms with no issue.

    I built it with an Aero Precision lower parts kit, pistol buffer tube kit, upper receiver, Atlas S-One handguard, Foxtrot Mike Heavy 9MM buffer, Raptor LT charging handle, Brownells branded Faxon 9MM bolt, Faxon 10.5” barrel, VG6 Precision Gamma 9MM muzzle brake, SB Tactical Mini brace, and Vortex SPARC II red dot.
     

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    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,678
    Anyone have a Rise Super Sport trigger? I’ve been back and forth between that and the Larue MBT. I am hoping to drop it in to a GWACS lower for my 6.5 grendel build. If it doesn’t fit well for some crazy reason I’d run it in my Spike’s lower for my 20” .223 Precision build.

    Price is not far off on them.
     

    DaemonAssassin

    Why should we Free BSD?
    Jun 14, 2012
    23,970
    Political refugee in WV
    Anyone have a Rise Super Sport trigger? I’ve been back and forth between that and the Larue MBT. I am hoping to drop it in to a GWACS lower for my 6.5 grendel build. If it doesn’t fit well for some crazy reason I’d run it in my Spike’s lower for my 20” .223 Precision build.

    Price is not far off on them.

    Go for the LaRue.
     

    clandestine

    AR-15 Savant
    Oct 13, 2008
    37,031
    Elkton, MD
    You want to use the heavier trigger spring in the LaRue for the best reliability if proper fit is not certain.

    You can use the lighter one but you have to be sure your hammer and trigger pins float properly and you cant use KNS Pins.
     

    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,678
    You want to use the heavier trigger spring in the LaRue for the best reliability if proper fit is not certain.

    You can use the lighter one but you have to be sure your hammer and trigger pins float properly and you cant use KNS Pins.

    Thanks! Two LaRue triggers coming up.

    After realizing the hammer spring was in backwards my
    Grendel build went bang all 6 times I pulled the trigger in my hunt. Unfortunately the 4 shots on two bucks went wide or were grazing shots at best. Never found blood or hair. Spike buck ran off with the doe it was trailing and I am pretty sure I bumped them an hour or so later and they took off half a mile from where they ran initially.

    Next was a 6-point that I am still scratching my head how I missed it at 60yds. I think both deer I was aiming a bit too low. The follow up on the spike it was running and I think it went over it’s back, but I think I did graze it the way it took off on the shot. The 6 point just looked at me on the first shot and I didn’t see blood. My follow up was rushed, but I still scoped it for about 2 seconds after my first shot. Either missed or grazed it. I waited half an hour on the 6 point and then went over the ridge line and looked around for about 30-40 minutes and as I crossed the creek at the bottom of the valley I saw it take off on the ridge I was about to climb maybe 100yds up creek from me. No sign where it was standing when I shot at it nor where it bolted from the opposite ridge and it wasn’t going slow either time or looking injured.

    I setup on a big pine tree and tacked a piece of TP on it from my bag. At 50yds, about where the spike and 6-pt where my rifle shot about 2-2.5” low...I adjusted the scope up 6 clicks and the second shot was about 1.5” low.

    It should be a hair high at 50yds...

    So I need to get back to the range. I had it adjusted about 1.5” high at 100yds and reading my ballistic calcs that should end up at roughly a 25/200yd zero (well, really if it was sighted 2” high) with Federal Fusion. So I am not sure what is going on. It seems to be shooting significant low. I know I was aimed a little low also and I’ll admited I possibly jerked the trigger, especially my follow-up shots. I didn’t shoot a ton of shots because I didn’t have much Fusion, but I shot 2 rounds and it was 1.5” low, I adjusted it up and 2 shits it was 1.”5 high. Each 2 shot group were holes almost touching. I backed the scope off to 3x from 9x to make sure that didn’t effect anything and my 3rd shot on the group was same elevation and about 3/4” to the side of the group. I am willing to chalk that up to shooting at 100yds and lower magnification.

    This time I’ll try a few more cold bore shots to make sure POI doesn’t change between warm and cold (or if it does, how much. The two groups I shot before there was 20 minutes between the two groups. I fired one shot and then a follow-up 10 seconds later.) I am also going to try a few shots at 3x, 5x 7x and 9x and make sure there isn’t some big shift in POI at one of the magnifications.

    I suspect this is mostly down to me and not the rifle, but the two shots on TP still have me a bit concerned.

    In some ways it’ll make me feel better if the rifle is on. I need to make sure it and the ammo are properly cold soaked before I got. I am planning to switch to Hornady Black. Mostly because I only have 28 rounds of fusion left and almost everyone is out of it, except at high prices and I’ve got 3 boxes of Black and 3 more on the way and I’ve read and seen a lot more evidence that the ELD-M does really well on medium bodied game, roughly similar performance to SST.

    And I’ll be spending a couple of range visits working on my standing unsupported shooting. Both deer if I had better presence of mind I probably could have edged over to a tree for support or taken a kneeling position, but I was too scared I was going to alert the deer. The spike because the doe was super wary (I shot at the spike when it was trotting across my path when it came in to the clear) and the 6-pt because it was also pretty wary, but also headed right for me and only turned to the side for a couple of seconds.

    I could have at least used my sling in both cases and it never occurred to me.

    I guess we all learn and it isn’t like I’ve been doing this for years and years (4th hunting season).
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    49,815
    Thanks! Two LaRue triggers coming up.

    After realizing the hammer spring was in backwards my
    Grendel build went bang all 6 times I pulled the trigger in my hunt. Unfortunately the 4 shots on two bucks went wide or were grazing shots at best. Never found blood or hair. Spike buck ran off with the doe it was trailing and I am pretty sure I bumped them an hour or so later and they took off half a mile from where they ran initially.

    Next was a 6-point that I am still scratching my head how I missed it at 60yds. I think both deer I was aiming a bit too low. The follow up on the spike it was running and I think it went over it’s back, but I think I did graze it the way it took off on the shot. The 6 point just looked at me on the first shot and I didn’t see blood. My follow up was rushed, but I still scoped it for about 2 seconds after my first shot. Either missed or grazed it. I waited half an hour on the 6 point and then went over the ridge line and looked around for about 30-40 minutes and as I crossed the creek at the bottom of the valley I saw it take off on the ridge I was about to climb maybe 100yds up creek from me. No sign where it was standing when I shot at it nor where it bolted from the opposite ridge and it wasn’t going slow either time or looking injured.

    I setup on a big pine tree and tacked a piece of TP on it from my bag. At 50yds, about where the spike and 6-pt where my rifle shot about 2-2.5” low...I adjusted the scope up 6 clicks and the second shot was about 1.5” low.

    It should be a hair high at 50yds...

    So I need to get back to the range. I had it adjusted about 1.5” high at 100yds and reading my ballistic calcs that should end up at roughly a 25/200yd zero (well, really if it was sighted 2” high) with Federal Fusion. So I am not sure what is going on. It seems to be shooting significant low. I know I was aimed a little low also and I’ll admited I possibly jerked the trigger, especially my follow-up shots. I didn’t shoot a ton of shots because I didn’t have much Fusion, but I shot 2 rounds and it was 1.5” low, I adjusted it up and 2 shits it was 1.”5 high. Each 2 shot group were holes almost touching. I backed the scope off to 3x from 9x to make sure that didn’t effect anything and my 3rd shot on the group was same elevation and about 3/4” to the side of the group. I am willing to chalk that up to shooting at 100yds and lower magnification.

    This time I’ll try a few more cold bore shots to make sure POI doesn’t change between warm and cold (or if it does, how much. The two groups I shot before there was 20 minutes between the two groups. I fired one shot and then a follow-up 10 seconds later.) I am also going to try a few shots at 3x, 5x 7x and 9x and make sure there isn’t some big shift in POI at one of the magnifications.

    I suspect this is mostly down to me and not the rifle, but the two shots on TP still have me a bit concerned.

    In some ways it’ll make me feel better if the rifle is on. I need to make sure it and the ammo are properly cold soaked before I got. I am planning to switch to Hornady Black. Mostly because I only have 28 rounds of fusion left and almost everyone is out of it, except at high prices and I’ve got 3 boxes of Black and 3 more on the way and I’ve read and seen a lot more evidence that the ELD-M does really well on medium bodied game, roughly similar performance to SST.

    And I’ll be spending a couple of range visits working on my standing unsupported shooting. Both deer if I had better presence of mind I probably could have edged over to a tree for support or taken a kneeling position, but I was too scared I was going to alert the deer. The spike because the doe was super wary (I shot at the spike when it was trotting across my path when it came in to the clear) and the 6-pt because it was also pretty wary, but also headed right for me and only turned to the side for a couple of seconds.

    I could have at least used my sling in both cases and it never occurred to me.

    I guess we all learn and it isn’t like I’ve been doing this for years and years (4th hunting season).

    Two things come to mind. First(and Ed Shell will probably give me hell for this), don't worry about 'cold bore' shots, especially inside 100 yds. Worry about CLEAN bore shots. Always make sure you go to the field with a dirty bore.

    Secondly, take this from an oldass deer hunter. Out east here, we are usually deer hunting in the woods. Trees abound. When still hunting, make it a point to never stop(walking) until you are next to a tree. Always use that tree as a stabilizer. If you jump up a deer and no tree is close, run up to the nearest tree and do same. If the deer gets away before you can shoot, no harm done. Let things settle down and pick up where you left off. Best you can hope for otherwise, is a "Texas heart shot", right up the exaust pipe. You don't want that.
     

    lazarus

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 23, 2015
    13,678
    Two things come to mind. First(and Ed Shell will probably give me hell for this), don't worry about 'cold bore' shots, especially inside 100 yds. Worry about CLEAN bore shots. Always make sure you go to the field with a dirty bore.

    Secondly, take this from an oldass deer hunter. Out east here, we are usually deer hunting in the woods. Trees abound. When still hunting, make it a point to never stop(walking) until you are next to a tree. Always use that tree as a stabilizer. If you jump up a deer and no tree is close, run up to the nearest tree and do same. If the deer gets away before you can shoot, no harm done. Let things settle down and pick up where you left off. Best you can hope for otherwise, is a "Texas heart shot", right up the exaust pipe. You don't want that.

    Thanks for the advice!

    Yeah, I’ve been taking my rifles to the range dirty. I clean them at the end of the hunting season. Clean vs dirty seems to have an impact on POI, cold vs warm not so much. Hot vs cold or warm does too...but usually I am not taking a shot on a deer after my 27th shot in 3 minutes :-)

    My Sako seems to be the only exception where the POI seems to be a couple of inches off cold vs warm bore. That could be more the ammo I am using behaving a lot differently. Or maybe I did clean it out the last time I was at the range. Dunno, I’ll probably take it to the range again on Thrusday. Wife had a funeral this afternoon, so I got stuck being home when the kids got off the bus today.

    Sako, SKS and Grendel will make the cut (and maybe my P1...been awhile since I’ve shot it). I was thinking I’d haul the Grendel and SKS to the Eastern Shore and if I luck out Day 1 I’d take the SKS out on Day 2. Sako is because I love shooting it and curious if the big POI shift was that the bore may have been cleaned between range sessions last time.

    Will certainly be looking for trees while still hunting in the future. It would also help for those times I am standing around a few minutes waiting for the deer to present a shot and trying to hold my rifle steady.
     

    Algot

    Member
    Feb 13, 2017
    87
    Frederick
    I am considering purchasing an SLR Adjustable Gas Block. My goal is lightweight, so I may spring for the titanium version. My barrel has a single dimple. Looking for recommendations/opinions on Set Screw vs Clamp On. Thanks all.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    clandestine

    AR-15 Savant
    Oct 13, 2008
    37,031
    Elkton, MD
    I am considering purchasing an SLR Adjustable Gas Block. My goal is lightweight, so I may spring for the titanium version. My barrel has a single dimple. Looking for recommendations/opinions on Set Screw vs Clamp On. Thanks all.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    Clamp on is for a precision rig that does not get exposed to harsh use. It causes the least amount of barrel stress. If you use a rail that covers a clamp on then it makes it a little more durable.

    Set screw models and models that can be pinned are for guns that are used hard, but it can allow stress to be applied which can effect accuracy.
     

    Algot

    Member
    Feb 13, 2017
    87
    Frederick
    Clamp on is for a precision rig that does not get exposed to harsh use. It causes the least amount of barrel stress. If you use a rail that covers a clamp on then it makes it a little more durable.



    Set screw models and models that can be pinned are for guns that are used hard, but it can allow stress to be applied which can effect accuracy.



    Thanks for your reply. The hand guard will cover the gas block. But I think I’m leaning towards using the Set Screw model and dimpling the second screw.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    babalou

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Aug 12, 2013
    16,019
    Glenelg
    Damn

    Two things come to mind. First(and Ed Shell will probably give me hell for this), don't worry about 'cold bore' shots, especially inside 100 yds. Worry about CLEAN bore shots. Always make sure you go to the field with a dirty bore.

    Secondly, take this from an oldass deer hunter. Out east here, we are usually deer hunting in the woods. Trees abound. When still hunting, make it a point to never stop(walking) until you are next to a tree. Always use that tree as a stabilizer. If you jump up a deer and no tree is close, run up to the nearest tree and do same. If the deer gets away before you can shoot, no harm done. Let things settle down and pick up where you left off. Best you can hope for otherwise, is a "Texas heart shot", right up the exaust pipe. You don't want that.

    Thought you said dirty whore.
     

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