Fire Balls!

CanDoEZ · Apr 28, 2020

No, not the cinnamon flavored stuff. Does anyone have any experience with the fire extinguisher balls that have come on the market recently?

https://elidefireus.com

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7yAyuGTHLo

I know from up close and personal experience how quickly a fire can go from zero to crazy. I like the passive protection features. And that they go boom

I'm thinking of buying a few for the higher risk areas of the homestead, barn, workshop...

With all of our heavy investments in prepping, they seem like a rather small expense to keep it all from going up in smoke. Supplements the obvious smoke detectors, portable extinguishers, proper fuel storage, Non-MacGyver home wiring practices, etc. etc.

Thought from the hive?

Inigoes · Apr 28, 2020

Wow

They start at $95...
Fire extinguishers are way cheaper

CanDoEZ · Apr 28, 2020

Inigoes said:
Wow

They start at $95...
Fire extinguishers are way cheaper

Agreed, not cheap... but we drop that much in ammo on a good range day. Plus I haven't figured out how to train the horses to operate those darn things. I was looking at from the passive protection angle. 4 or 5 (or even 10) in a unoccupied (by humans) barn are still much cheaper than a sprinkler system. Or a couple in the high value item storage areas. The technology looks interesting.

Flametamer · Apr 28, 2020

Nothing revolutionary here. "Fire balls" have been around since the early 1900s. Different agent inside with each new generation. I have not seen this particular unit, but have tested 8 or 9 different such products over the years. Niche products very very niche. Very limited useful applications. Only work as seen in the videos with full involvement and no wind. Full involvement equals total loss of contents, so what's the point? Let the fire dispose of the debris for you. If a life is involved, anyone inside a post flashover room is already dead, including fully protected firefighters. Save your money, as stated above, extinguishers are less expensive and proven technology.

Joseph · Apr 28, 2020

Inigoes said:
Wow

They start at $95...
Fire extinguishers are way cheaper

Yes, but you have to be there to use the fire extinguisher.
These things can be pre positioned and will go off automatically when heated.

There is a Dutch company called DSPA that makes them too.

CanDoEZ · Apr 28, 2020

Flametamer said:
Nothing revolutionary here. "Fire balls" have been around since the early 1900s. Different agent inside with each new generation. I have not seen this particular unit, but have tested 8 or 9 different such products over the years. Niche products very very niche. Very limited useful applications. Only work as seen in the videos with full involvement and no wind. Full involvement equals total loss of contents, so what's the point? Let the fire dispose of the debris for you. If a life is involved, anyone inside a post flashover room is already dead, including fully protected firefighters. Save your money, as stated above, extinguishers are less expensive and proven technology.

Thanks! Still looking for ideas on how to best protect a barn though.

Melnic · Apr 28, 2020

I have those powder cans that pop open with a built in fire cracker over the stove. My MIL has Dementia and is not supposed to cook but if she does and walks off, hopefully the thing has a chance to put out a fire.

That thing looks interesting but I"d say bowling kid got a lucky shot in. Don't expect the ball to stay in the fire on the average roll. Those examples look like special staged situations. Don't know but what are typical fire situations that are capable to be put out? Stove fire? BBQ? Electrical fire for a lamp?

Flametamer · Apr 29, 2020

CanDoEZ said:
Thanks! Still looking for ideas on how to best protect a barn though.

Since you cannot know where a fire might start, any sort of spot protection like these will be a crap shoot. Sure, you can place them above 'likely' ignition sources, or in a stall to protect a horse, but it's all a roll of the die.

If you have something of great value to protect in a barn, a dry-pipe sprinkler system is hands down the most reliable system you can do. Needs annual testing. And, you're likely to get a reduced fire insurance premium.

For a structure and contents not worthy of that expense, practice good fire prevention and transfer the risk via insurance. Have photos and document your contents to make filing a claim easier.... and get an adjuster if it ever happens.

babalou · Apr 29, 2020

been around that long? Never heard. Interesting though.

Pinecone · Apr 29, 2020

I did some work with a company back in the late 80s or early 90s.

They had some partnership with a Russia company. The Russians had a similar product. It was a cardboard tube, like an oversize paper towel core. You pulled the cover strip off a sticky part, stuck it to the wall, or some vertical surface. And reached in and pulled out the fuze.

Any flame, the fuse ignites, fires a bursting charge, distributing dry chemical powder. They were cheap enough to put out a LOT of them.

Chriss · Apr 29, 2020

I cant tell whats inside also there is not UL or FM listing means they havebnt been US labl tested for safety or effectiveness of actual claims.

Alea Jacta Est · Apr 29, 2020

If it will put out a fire, it can and will likely kill living things.

I ain’t no fire scientist. I have been through Damage Control school, survived a pretty bad fire at sea, been an engineering officer for afloat units and owned a boat of my own.

My view is very simplistic. Fires require oxygen. Most things designed to put out a fire do that by removing access to oxygen. Yep, that includes water. Enclosed or semi enclosed spaces don’t have lots of oxygen. Plants, animals and MDS members all need oxygen last time I checked. I know for sure I don’t want to be in a fight for oxygen with things like carbon dioxide, purple K, AFFF or halon. I know how that ends.

Sprinkler system is your best bet besides good risk management.

Just one fellas opinion.

Pinecone · Apr 29, 2020

Nnztg8r said:
If it will put out a fire, it can and will likely kill living things.

I ain’t no fire scientist. I have been through Damage Control school, survived a pretty bad fire at sea, been an engineering officer for afloat units and owned a boat of my own.

My view is very simplistic. Fires require oxygen. Most things designed to put out a fire do that by removing access to oxygen. Yep, that includes water. Enclosed or semi enclosed spaces don’t have lots of oxygen. Plants, animals and MDS members all need oxygen last time I checked. I know for sure I don’t want to be in a fight for oxygen with things like carbon dioxide, purple K, AFFF or halon. I know how that ends.

Sprinkler system is your best bet besides good risk management.

Just one fellas opinion.

One common dry chemical fire extinguisher filler is sodium bicarbonate. Baking soda.

It is treated with some additives to keep it from clumping, but basically baking soda.

Blacksmith101 · Apr 29, 2020

CanDoEZ said:
Thanks! Still looking for ideas on how to best protect a barn though.

Keep it clean.
Rigorous NO SMOKING!
Store Hay/Straw in a separate building far enough away that a fire there won't jump to the barn no matter which direction the wind is blowing.
Lighting rods.
Heat/Smoke Detectors that notify you.
Have a farm pond with a dry hydrant hookup for the fire fighters water supply.

Flametamer · Apr 29, 2020

Pinecone said:
One common dry chemical fire extinguisher filler is sodium bicarbonate. Baking soda.

It is treated with some additives to keep it from clumping, but basically baking soda.

Correct. That will usually be the extinguishers with a B:C rating on the label. If the label on the dry chemical extinguisher shows A:B:C dry chemical, then what you have is typically mono-ammonium phosphate; which can be pretty aggressive on metals in the presence of moisture (after the fire). Some of the smaller extinguishers use mono-ammonium phosphate but do not carry the A rating because there is not enough of the agent in the extinguisher to put out the test fires at UL. (The A and B ratings will have a number preceding each letter; the number indicates the size of the UL test fire that the extinguisher can be expected to extinguish when used by an 'untrained' person. For reference, a 2-1/2 gallon water extinguisher has a 2A rating.)

If an extinguisher does not have the UL mark, don't count on it. It might work when you need it, it might not.

P.S. The fire 'balls' or 'grenades' as we used to call them do not have a UL mark because UL does not have a test standard for them. They probably never will have a standard for those products.

Blacksmith101 · May 1, 2020

And what happens if the fire isn't in a box and the ball keeps on rolling past the fire or the fire starts 6 or 10 feet away from the wall mounted ball. I think they are a false security building solution and you better have a solid fire prevention and fire extinguishing plan first.

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