Project Fast and Furious Thread

Inigoes said:

Iran-Contra redux?

Something good has come from Assange (wikileaks owner) possibly. Providing more proof .gov is trying to take away rights the little guy while exacerbating the problem.

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Thats why our Government wanted him so bad this time.Not to mention exposing some of this administration.

Wiley-X said:

As so many are always quick to point out, just because a few cops are bad doesn't mean that all cops are bad.

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that logic is never applied to the civilians, however. One bad apple does something bad and we ALL pay the consequences.

John at Only Guns and Money has been following this closely as well...

CCRKBA Urges Investigation Into "Project Gunwalker", this from Alan Gottlieb.
and,
The NRA is speaking up: NRA On Project "Gunwalker", saying

the BATFE's desire to mandate reporting of multiple long gun sales by border area firearms dealers is questionable since BATFE seems incapable of managing the criminal leads it already has and unwilling to submit to constitutionally mandated Congressional oversight.

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ezliving said:

To err is human. In order to really screw things up, government participation is required.

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I see an audit of ICE revealed that in 2010 over 900 convicted felons walked out of jail and were not deported as they were supposed to be because ICE used the typical govt. efficiency and attention to detail.

These folks want to give us health care?

This appears to be rumor or heresay, for now, but up to 3,000 guns may have been allowed into the pipeline south, by ATF? 3,000?

If anywhere near the truth, this should be all over the news.
http://thetruthaboutguns.com/2011/02/robert-farago/atf-project-gunrunner-may-have-lost-3000-firearms/

The Washington Times picked up the story

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/feb/14/sen-grassley-probes-border-agent-slaying/

aquaman said:

subscribed. This is going to get interesting. Thanks for posting this

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+1

This is horrible. I wonder whose best interests the govt. has in mind?

-Z

Diesel Kinevel said:

This is horrible. I wonder whose best interests the govt. has in mind?

-Z

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Their Own Political Interests.

Good to see the Washington Times ran it, maybe it will get some traction.
The silence at BATF, Justice and the WH Administration is deafening.

The silence from the Washington Post, NY Times and AP is more deafening.

All I can hope for is that the press is trying to independently confirm the details before running the story. But at the same time, the AP has been running stories against Lone Wolf and others who apparently made straw sales a the behest of the government - except the press leaves out the fact (or even the claim as unproven). Add to this the fact that the new White House press sec'y is from Time Magazine. Ugh. As bad as hiring Tony Snow, but I digress.

This story just does not fit the desired narrative.

Maybe the House can pick the issue up and run with it; they can subpoena and cause a stink. At least until the issue is horse-traded with something else.

"Heavies" from the ATF met with Grassley 2/10...blowing smoke.

Yesterday, Grassley responded with: http://judiciary.senate.gov/resources/documents/upload/021611GrassleyToHolder.pdf

Zing...he wants ATF to provide a number of documents, he wants them by next Wednesday 2/23.

Thanks to John for following this so closely:
http://onlygunsandmoney.blogspot.com/2011/02/memo-to-atf-grassley-not-impressed-with.html

If the current regime can ignore a Federal Judge's order that Obama care is unconstitutional, why would they comply with a US Senator's request for information on what is looking like a clear violation of Federal law?

If they hold a hearing, Holder will assert his 5th amendment right against self incrimination. Our govt. is being run by the same criminals they took an oath to stop from breaking Federal law.

Pretty said. This regime thinks there is only one branch of govt. (Executive) and has no interest in the constitutional checks and balances put in place by the Founding Fathers

Sorry for being late to the party... I've been tracking/involved with trying to get Senators [and media] to do something with this since the first rumors surfaced about Agent Terry.

I've read this whole thread, and - unless I missed something - I don't see the two men responsible for breaking this mentioned anywhere.

(1) Mike Vanderboegh -- http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com
(2) David Codrea -- waronguns.blogspot.com or http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-in-national/

Here's the whole scoop: http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2011/02/updated-summary-narrative-condensed.html

It really doesn't get any more UTTERLY FILTHY than this.

(1) Recruit dealers to "help track gunrunners"
(2) When dealers call to say "Got a repeat straw buyer here RIGHT NOW - I'll stall, y'all come get him!!" - Tell dealers to proceed with sales instead of coming to arrest the straw-buyers while IN THE ACT.
(3) Use the "straw sales" as an excuse to run the DEALERS WHO WERE HELPING YOU out of business!
(4) Let the illegally-purchased guns be smuggled into Mexico **WITHOUT EVEN TELLING THE MEX.GOV!**!
(5) Use the whole thing to artificially inflate the numbers of "american guns in Mexico!"
(6) Use the inflated "US guns in mexico!" as an excuse to crack down on / further restrict the rights of law-abiding American citizens.
(7) When the US ATF Attache to the Mexi.Gov finds out, tell him to shut up. When he pushes it, and goes all the way to DOJ in DC, force him into retirement and continue the cover-up.
(8) When a US CBP agent is killed in a shootout where (2) of the "gunwalker" guns were seized, possibly even the weapons which killed him -- continue the cover-up.
(9) When the rumors start to fly, hurry up and arrest a few of the straw-buyers, then have a big press-conference where you pretend they're some sort of "kingpins" and pretend your whole Charlie-Foxtrot was instead a huge success!
(10) When a US Senator finally calls you on your lies, crack down on those you SUSPECT might be the whistleblowers - in direct violation of several MORE Federal laws.
(11) When called out on your abuse of SUSPECTED whistleblowers, LIE about it.
(12) When you finally respond to the Senator, have a DOJ lawyer do it FOR YOU. Make sure he lies too, and have him order the Senator to stop talking to your agents and act as if it's the SENATOR who did something wrong!
(13) Right in the middle of all of this, announce that the "SAC" WHO OVERSAW THIS WHOLE FIASCO is appointed to replace the Mexican Attache you forced to retire in Step 7. Try your best to hide the fact that this constitutes a half-million-dollar payoff to said SAC because he's so far underwater with his McMansion in Phoenix, but the Taxpayers will pay it off for him so he can fill this CRITICAL post.
(14) When the Senator responds - jamming PROOF OF THE WHOLE THING - INCLUDING YOUR LIES - RIGHT UP YOUR @$$ -- send some people with ZERO personal knowledge of the whole thing to do the briefing he demands. Ensure they can't answer any real questions, instead have them give a "rah-rah" briefing which doesn't answer any substantive questions.
(15) (current step) When the Senator demands more documents, hurry up and shred anything you don't want him to have, and ensure that anything you DO produce is so sanitized as to be useless.

Make no mistake: The DOJ lawyer who crafted the BATF***ers response works for - and answers directly TO - Eric Holder. This means the cover-up - if not the whole conspiracy - goes all the way to the top of the DOJ, if not all the way to the White-House.

I don't believe it's any stretch at all to say this could be the biggest scandal in our history. It's certainly bigger than Watergate - after all, WG didn't involve an International incident, and it didn't get anyone killed.

We've already *SEEN* documentation of nearly 1,000 weapons allowed into Mexico **without the knowledge of their .gov** -- and rumors on the "CleanUpATF.org" site -- posted by ATF Agents THEMSELVES -- indicate the true number is over 3,000!!

There's simply ZERO CHANCE that these guns haven't been used to kill others - both Mexican AND American. I'd bet a paycheck that the ICE shootout just a couple of days ago -- 1 dead, one critical -- will turn out to be related as well.

Rusty Shackleford said:

LOL I just posted not too long ago that I had an opportunity for someone to write something on biggovernment.com about this. I was talking with Andrew Breitbart just the other evening and he suggested that I write something. For myriad reasons, I cannot but I'd be happy to let someone else take the glory.

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Rusty Shackleford said:

May have a opportunity for an enterprising activist and/or journalist to write something on this for big government (dot) com. PM me for details if you're interested.

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Why not the men who broke this story, have DIRECT contact with the whistleblowers, and are responsible for everything we know about this in the first place?

David Codrea - dcodrea AT hotmail DOT com
Mike Vanderboegh - GeorgeMason1776 AT aol DOT com

Or just send me a PM with the contact info and I'll forward it to them!

SB

Southern_Boy said:

It really doesn't get any more UTTERLY FILTHY than this.

(1) Recruit dealers to "help track gunrunners"
(2) When dealers call to say "Got a repeat straw buyer here RIGHT NOW - I'll stall, y'all come get him!!" - Tell dealers to proceed with sales instead of coming to arrest the straw-buyers while IN THE ACT.
(3) Use the "straw sales" as an excuse to run the DEALERS WHO WERE HELPING YOU out of business!
(4) Let the illegally-purchased guns be smuggled into Mexico **WITHOUT EVEN TELLING THE MEX.GOV!**!
(5) Use the whole thing to artificially inflate the numbers of "american guns in Mexico!"
(6) Use the inflated "US guns in mexico!" as an excuse to crack down on / further restrict the rights of law-abiding American citizens.
(7) When the US ATF Attache to the Mexi.Gov finds out, tell him to shut up. When he pushes it, and goes all the way to DOJ in DC, force him into retirement and continue the cover-up.
(8) When a US CBP agent is killed in a shootout where (2) of the "gunwalker" guns were seized, possibly even the weapons which killed him -- continue the cover-up.
(9) When the rumors start to fly, hurry up and arrest a few of the straw-buyers, then have a big press-conference where you pretend they're some sort of "kingpins" and pretend your whole Charlie-Foxtrot was instead a huge success!
(10) When a US Senator finally calls you on your lies, crack down on those you SUSPECT might be the whistleblowers - in direct violation of several MORE Federal laws.
(11) When called out on your abuse of SUSPECTED whistleblowers, LIE about it.
(12) When you finally respond to the Senator, have a DOJ lawyer do it FOR YOU. Make sure he lies too, and have him order the Senator to stop talking to your agents and act as if it's the SENATOR who did something wrong!
(13) Right in the middle of all of this, announce that the "SAC" WHO OVERSAW THIS WHOLE FIASCO is appointed to replace the Mexican Attache you forced to retire in Step 7. Try your best to hide the fact that this constitutes a half-million-dollar payoff to said SAC because he's so far underwater with his McMansion in Phoenix, but the Taxpayers will pay it off for him so he can fill this CRITICAL post.
(14) When the Senator responds - jamming PROOF OF THE WHOLE THING - INCLUDING YOUR LIES - RIGHT UP YOUR @$$ -- send some people with ZERO personal knowledge of the whole thing to do the briefing he demands. Ensure they can't answer any real questions, instead have them give a "rah-rah" briefing which doesn't answer any substantive questions.
(15) (current step) When the Senator demands more documents, hurry up and shred anything you don't want him to have, and ensure that anything you DO produce is so sanitized as to be useless.

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Yeah, that about sums it up. This is some heavy duty stuff. Nice write-up, thanks for that.

Southern_Boy: Great summary. Thanks.

FWIW, Nobody here was avoiding giving Codrea and Vanderboegh credit. We linked to their sites rather than do what most forums do these days: post copies of their work ad nauseum and deny the original authors the viewership and ad revenue. Next time we can be more direct in naming the author of the blog while also linking to it. It's not intentional, it's just that the names were not familiar to the members when the story broke. They are now. Good on these guys for pushing the story.

This is one messed up affair. I don't know why I should be more frustrated: because the ATF let these crimes occur; because the fall-out of the crimes cost lives on both sides of the border; because the ATF/DoJ blamed lawful people like me for the crimes in the first place and tried to restrict my rights due to it; or because the story will never make headlines outside of obviously conservative - and therefore easily ignored - venues.

Right now I am frustrated over all of them, but tend to spend more time wondering why the press is so blatantly cooperating in the ATF backpeddle (see AP/WashPo stories for examples of this). But on another note: where the hell is Drudge?

Patrick said:

Southern_Boy: Great summary. Thanks.

FWIW, Nobody here was avoiding giving Codrea and Vanderboegh credit. We linked to their sites rather than do what most forums do these days: post copies of their work ad nauseum and deny the original authors the viewership and ad revenue. Next time we can be more direct in naming the author of the blog while also linking to it. It's not intentional, it's just that the names were not familiar to the members when the story broke. They are now. Good on these guys for pushing the story.

This is one messed up affair. I don't know why I should be more frustrated: because the ATF let these crimes occur; because the fall-out of the crimes cost lives on both sides of the border; because the ATF/DoJ blamed lawful people like me for the crimes in the first place and tried to restrict my rights due to it; or because the story will never make headlines outside of obviously conservative - and therefore easily ignored - venues.

Right now I am frustrated over all of them, but tend to spend more time wondering why the press is so blatantly cooperating in the ATF backpeddle (see AP/WashPo stories for examples of this). But on another note: where the hell is Drudge?

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Or could the .gov/MSM be waiting for the right time to say 'since even the people who are supposed to be regulating firearms can't be trusted with firearms - we are now banning them for everyone...except the military and police'.

Ding, ding, ding ... we have a winner !!!

Ab_Normal said:

Or could the .gov/MSM be waiting for the right time to say 'since even the people who are supposed to be regulating firearms can't be trusted with firearms - we are now banning them for everyone...except the military and police'.

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Couple this with the Rahm Emnauel philosophy of not letting a crisis go to waste, or even better still, creating one, wouldn't an international crisis be the best reason to BAN all sales of weapons larger than a certain caliber, a certain magazine size, or a certain type ... or all firearms 'until this crisis can be resolved and order restored'.

Sound familiar ?

Oh, and one more thing. Remember Obama's campaign promise ?



Where's my tinfoil hat ?