Texan Convicted for Selling a Gun to an Illegal Alien with a Texas Driver's Licenese

rseymorejr · May 13, 2011

http://archive.constantcontact.com/fs043/1102148500335/archive/1105492943218.html#LETTER.BLOCK25

I got this piece of disturbing news in an e-mail from the AGC this morning.
A man in Texas was convicted for selling a handgun to an illegal alien (with a Texas drivers license!) at a gun show in Austin. Ironically Austin is a "sanctuary city" where the police aren't even allowed to question someone's immigration status and yet they expected a private citizen to be able to do that.

If this story came out of Maryland I wouldn't be surprised, but Texas??
What is this world coming to.

EL1227 · May 13, 2011

rseymorejr said:
http://archive.constantcontact.com/fs043/1102148500335/archive/1105492943218.html#LETTER.BLOCK25

I got this piece of disturbing news in an e-mail from the AGC this morning.
A man in Texas was convicted for selling a handgun to an illegal alien (with a Texas drivers license!) at a gun show in Austin. Ironically Austin is a "sanctuary city" where the police aren't even allowed to question someone's immigration status and yet they expected a private citizen to be able to do that.

If this story came out of Maryland i wouldn't be surprised, but Texas??
What is this world coming to.

It's Austin ... That's NOT Texas. Texas has to have an enclave for liberals to live and thrive because they aren't allowed to shoot them anymore. :innocent0

Name Taken · May 13, 2011

Send the American to jail, then give the illegal now felon hispanic children cheaper college tuition.

The Maryland way.

gamer_jim · May 13, 2011

What are TX transfer laws? Can they do F2F or do they have to go through the police like here in MD? IIRC VA says the seller only needs to not have reason to believe the buyer isn't prohibited. Meaning there is no onus on the seller to make sure.

Hol3shot · May 13, 2011

That is BS!

MDFF2008 · May 13, 2011

In Federal District Court on July 20, 2010, the ATF won a conviction from an Austin jury that defies logic and reason. In a trial before Federal Judge Sam Sparks, government lawyers conceded Texas resident Paul Copeland did not know his buyer was an illegal alien, but told the jury they should convict him anyway because he "had reasonable cause to believe" he was selling to an illegal alien because the two men and a boy who were present at his table at the time of the sale: 1) were Hispanic, 2) spoke Spanish, and 3) wore cowboy clothing. And the jury did as asked. Assistant U.S. Attorney Jennifer Freel acted as lead prosecutor in the case.

WOW. I hope one of the lawyers working for Jan Brewer sees this. Basically, they just said it's OK to profile someone as an illegal based on their looks.

Sounds like something Gansler would say.

I dunno, there's got to be more to this story. Seems like if it were that cut and dry, the NRA or SAF or someone would be stepping in to appeal this.

matt_b89 · May 13, 2011

i didnt think you were allowed to sells handguns ftf

jimbobborg · May 13, 2011

matt_borror said:
i didnt think you were allowed to sells handguns ftf

I can, and have, done that here.

Most of us prefer dealing with people with CCWs, though. Some will take Military IDs, though.

Jim

hvymax · May 13, 2011

If they speak spanish then no sale. He should have known better. We need to deport all non English speakers.

cmecha · May 13, 2011

that sucks and believe the case should have been thrown out and the illegal deported.

JMintzer · May 13, 2011

This is an old story. The very same Justice Dept that sued Jan Brewer for enacting a law that "profiled" Hispanics, expected the gun dealer to "profile hispanics" and know they were illegals since they were Hispanic, spoke spanish and wore "cowboy clothing" WTF is "cowboy clothing"???

Pretzel logic anyone?

Jamie

mvee · May 13, 2011

According to the article Huertas conducted the transaction speaking English.

Nanook · May 14, 2011

hvymax said:
If they speak spanish then no sale. He should have known better. We need to deport all non English speakers.

Some of us "habla" a bit, wear s**t-kickers on occasion, and tan pretty easy.

"I'm just sayin'" :innocent0

boricuamaximus · May 14, 2011

hvymax said:
If they speak spanish then no sale. He should have known better. We need to deport all non English speakers.

I guess I should return all my guns now.

zoostation · May 14, 2011

A little more to the story. According to the government's case the illegal negotiated the price of the gun with the seller, then handed the drivers-licensed guy the money to buy it for him right while the seller watched.

http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/GovtResponsetoMotiontoSupressPaulCopelandCase.pdf

TheTruth · May 14, 2011

Name Taken said:
Send the American to jail, then give the illegal now felon hispanic children cheaper college tuition.

The Maryland way.

Ain't that the truth!

MDFF2008 · May 14, 2011

zoostation said:
A little more to the story. According to the government's case the illegal negotiated the price of the gun with the seller, then handed the drivers-licensed guy the money to buy it for him right while the seller watched.

http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/GovtResponsetoMotiontoSupressPaulCopelandCase.pdf

So it was in effect, a straw sale that was plainly obvious.

WHY THE F'ING HELL DO PEOPLE WASTE TIME GETTING PEOPLE EXCITED OVER SHIT THAT ISN'T EVEN WRONG? SERIOUSLY, GET THE DAMN FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU START FEARMONGERING.

:mad54:

zoostation · May 14, 2011

gprimr1 said:
So it was in effect, a straw sale that was plainly obvious.

WHY THE F'ING HELL DO PEOPLE WASTE TIME GETTING PEOPLE EXCITED OVER SHIT THAT ISN'T EVEN WRONG? SERIOUSLY, GET THE DAMN FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU START FEARMONGERING.

That's why I mentioned it. I mean I don't disagree that there are certainly a lot of people who have gotten a raw deal on gun charges over the years. But I get sick of these people who get into trouble want the whole 2A community to rally around them and then we find out that we only got half the story. Just like the "my AR15 malfunctioned so I got sent to jail for a machine gun" guy. Then I read the federal affidavit and find out he was at least accused of more or less running an illicit MG manufacturing business out of his basement. I mean tell us the whole story and let us decide for ourselves. Doing otherwise is just going to hurt the people who really do get raw deals and need our money and support.

MDFF2008 · May 14, 2011

zoostation said:
That's why I mentioned it. I mean I don't disagree that there are certainly a lot of people who have gotten a raw deal on gun charges over the years. But I get sick of these people who get into trouble want the whole 2A community to rally around them and then we find out that we only got half the story. Just like the "my AR15 malfunctioned so I got sent to jail for a machine gun" guy. Then I read the federal affidavit and find out he was at least accused of more or less running an illicit MG manufacturing business out of his basement. I mean tell us the whole story and let us decide for ourselves. Doing otherwise is just going to hurt the people who really do get raw deals and need our money and support.

Thank you.

There are sooo many shitty things that are going on in the world, why do people feel the need to cry wolf all the time?

Honestly, I'm getting to the point where I 1.) Don't believe anything I read 2.) Am tired of sharing stuff and then having to retract it.

Inigoes · May 14, 2011

Actually, the dude was adamant about his constitutional privileges

Background:

http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=42641&highlight=Paul+Copeland

Texan Convicted for Selling a Gun to an Illegal Alien with a Texas Driver's Licenese

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